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Voltan · Posted: Sun Nov 18, 2007 9:26 pm Post subject: Oscilator bug?

This happens to me every time:

-Select patch INT-C 045 - Mega Sync Lead
-Play a not-very-high note, say, a D3
-then play legato to a pretty much higher note (D5 or higher) - just hit D5 while holding D3
-the sound gets awfully detuned from there

It seems that while playing that lead legato up, one of the voices stops at some point at doesn't get any higher - it remaines at its "top-note" while the other voices of the program go higher - causing a nasty off-tune sound

I experimented with soloing the multisamples of that particular patch - looks like one of them is ok but all the others will stop at some note - different for each of them.
The "top note" also seems to be different depending on the note you start with - not for every note tough - more like for groups of them (guess this has to do with the multisamples' zones or something)

It does not happen when portamento is on
It does happen when portamento AND fingered are on

It also happens on some other patches (like C-061 Espress Lead)

Can anyone reproduce this on their units?

r12 · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:07 am Post subject:

yes, I'm not sure but it seems like multisamples zones can't be transposed more than 43 semi-tones...

maybe fixed in future OS Idea

_________________
YAMAHA W5 + TRITON proX (exb MOSS / exb PCM01 / exb PCM05 / exb SCSI / 64Mo) + M3-73 No.000187 v2.0 (exb Radias v2.0 / exb M256) + DOEPFER LMK2+
AKAI DPS16 + MINDPRINT Envoice + ART Dual MP + RODE NT1000
BEHRINGER DDX3216 + 4 MACKIE SRM350 + 2 MACKIE SWA1501 (+ PEAVEY KB300 )
...

Lorenzo · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 9:26 am Post subject:

can't hear the problem here cos I don't have an M3... but maybe it's an aliasing problem...
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http://www.synthaddicted.com

r12 · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:29 am Post subject:

I don't think it's an aliasing problem

some multisamples are affected and others not...

maybe samples compression Question

_________________
YAMAHA W5 + TRITON proX (exb MOSS / exb PCM01 / exb PCM05 / exb SCSI / 64Mo) + M3-73 No.000187 v2.0 (exb Radias v2.0 / exb M256) + DOEPFER LMK2+
AKAI DPS16 + MINDPRINT Envoice + ART Dual MP + RODE NT1000
BEHRINGER DDX3216 + 4 MACKIE SRM350 + 2 MACKIE SWA1501 (+ PEAVEY KB300 )
...

Lorenzo · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 11:39 am Post subject:

maybe you can post an mp3... I don't know what you mean with "alising" but if the samples are not good enough if you try to play them pitched on higher notes you can here digital noises from some subtle ones to heavy aliasing that doesn't let you to here the sound anymore... if it's the case the problem is with the samples themself and no one can fix it...
regards, Lorenzo
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http://www.synthaddicted.com

Voltan · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:40 pm Post subject:

It's not producing noises when shifting higher - that would be ok as there's nothing much to do about it really.
The thing is the samples' pitch can be shifted to a certain point and no further - they play the same note regardless of the key you hit.
I'll post a recording later.

Voltan · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:24 pm Post subject:

Here it is: http://download.yousendit.com/3639AC4D0A7C97DA
I recorded it twice:
- with the factory preset
- with 1 multisample on each OSC, one of them playing properly and the OSCs set to seperate channels (left and right) - so you can here it clearly.

r12 · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:55 pm Post subject:

yes that's right, and if you pitch down to -12 the OSC that is pitched up to +12, the effect disapear...
_________________
YAMAHA W5 + TRITON proX (exb MOSS / exb PCM01 / exb PCM05 / exb SCSI / 64Mo) + M3-73 No.000187 v2.0 (exb Radias v2.0 / exb M256) + DOEPFER LMK2+
AKAI DPS16 + MINDPRINT Envoice + ART Dual MP + RODE NT1000
BEHRINGER DDX3216 + 4 MACKIE SRM350 + 2 MACKIE SWA1501 (+ PEAVEY KB300 )
...

Lorenzo · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:11 pm Post subject:

uops... not certainly aliasing... this sound really strange... maybe it's really a bug.
Regards, Lorenzo
_________________
http://www.synthaddicted.com

Voltan · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:49 pm Post subject:

Well I hope someone at Korg will take a look at this

lcmorley · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:19 pm Post subject:

Diego · Posted: Mon Nov 19, 2007 3:32 pm Post subject:

OMG!!!!

It's the same was happening on the Trinity 12 years ago!!!
Try the monster lead patch on the Trinity and do a note-jump higher than 2 octave and you will ear the same result...incredible!!!

regards
_________________
Diego http://www.myspace.com/diegoinmusic

Korg M3 with EXB Radias & EXB-256 onboard
MOTU Traveler - iBook G4

r12 · Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:49 am Post subject:

I've tried it on triton classic and...working perfectly

you can see the problem without portamento : try to transpose up at max some multisamples :

1 : osc page : pitch up at +12
2 : pitch page : set sw1 at +12 and put sw1 on
3 : set pitch env at +12 and pitch env parameters at 99/99/99/99...
4 : set lfo1 mod to pitch at +12 and lof1 at square / frequency at 0

normally you have a +48 semitones transpose and you will see the problem immediately
some multisamples work fine and others bug Shocked

_________________
YAMAHA W5 + TRITON proX (exb MOSS / exb PCM01 / exb PCM05 / exb SCSI / 64Mo) + M3-73 No.000187 v2.0 (exb Radias v2.0 / exb M256) + DOEPFER LMK2+
AKAI DPS16 + MINDPRINT Envoice + ART Dual MP + RODE NT1000
BEHRINGER DDX3216 + 4 MACKIE SRM350 + 2 MACKIE SWA1501 (+ PEAVEY KB300 )
...

Lorenzo · Posted: Tue Nov 20, 2007 11:55 am Post subject:

I think that the one you write about is the aliasing problem I was talking about, a different thing than the problem of the m3... I still have to see if the problem could be found on the triton too.
regards, Lorenzo
_________________
http://www.synthaddicted.com

Timo · Posted: Thu Jan 31, 2008 9:24 pm Post subject:

The way it appeared to occur on the Trinity was if your hand strayed into another sample-region (of the multi-sample) to that of the original key, it couldn't seem to be able to deal with it as it couldn't pitch up or down the sample that far. (It doesn't play the sample from the new region, but uses the original sample from the original region, but this can only be pitched up/down so much).

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=6060&highlight=legato

It's sad to hear that the M3 has the same problem that the Trinity had all those years ago. I can't understand why any new note can't trigger a new sample from the new sample region, while just holding the EGs from the first key pressed. I can only think that it's due to needing to somehow bypass the attack portion of the new sample, or to start the sample at a later point in time so as to match that of the sample from the first key-press, which may be complex to execute and require extra DSP overheads in the form of sample analysis/tracking and could possibly affect polyphony if the legato function was enabled in this way.

I've always tended to use my Moss, Virus or Radias to do this stuff, as the bug is related to multisample-based ROMpler usage. I'm unsure as to whether it's limited to just Korg's ROMplers, as I don't have any others (other than Roland MC505, which can't use legato)? Does the Motif or Fantom have legato, and if so do they suffer from this?
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