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firstlovedan

I hate to seem like i am beating this horse, but i am still puzzled..... In seq. Mode, i sequence a piano on track 3, bass on 2, drums on 10. I turn on the 2 m- effects. I set one for reverb, the other for chorus. Set my m-efx levels. Awesome so far. But when I copy a program, say a hammond, or a dst guitar, the reverb acts like it just too many steriods! I literally have to change everthing. When copying program, I have tried different toggles... All efx, or all efx used. I do not understand the difference. Can someone help me understand this? I love this board! Sounds are great. I am using a fantom G7, Motif XS7, and a Motif ES 6. All i need is to understand this sequencer better, and I am good to go.
Thank you guys for your infinite patience! You Rock! I learn so much here!
Firstlovedan
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

If you have already set and are happy with your mfx levels, you should not copy over the mfx of the new program you're adding. You should use "all ifx used" and that should copy just the insert fx and leave the mfx untouched.

Now, what happened is probably you set the MFX level to 100% wet and adjusted the send levels for moderate amounts of reverb. This is the most logical way to do things from a mixing perspective. But for some reason, Korg synth presets always have the sends at 100% with a low wetness in the actual FX setting. (Btw if anyone can think of a good reason for this I'd like to know)
So when you copied the new program, it will have had a maximum send setting of 127, drowning out everything. You should be able to fix this by going to the IFX page, finding the last IFX slot used by that program, and turning down the send to the verb.

At least, from what you told me, this seems the most likely issue to me. Good luck!

firstlovedan · Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 5:08 pm Post subject:

That makes sense. You were right... I turned the send up to 127, and then adjusted each track. But when i copied the program, there is no way to reduce that sound as an idividual sound! It diesn't make sense, but wow, at least i know i am not doing somwthing wrong. Thank you so much fir your time!
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

firstlovedan · Posted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 9:58 pm Post subject:

Ok, when I have copied a program to seq. Mode, I press IFX on the lower right tab. Then i press midi routing 1. When i look at the miximg board, the mfx 1&2 are sgaded out. How do i reduce the revetb i have for mfx 1? I know i am missing something, but all i can do now is reduce the master send, and then crank all of the 'no copied' programs up. Hope i am explaining this well.
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

If your programs are going through an FX bus instead of directly to the L/R outputs, you have to set the MFX send levels after the IFX instead of in the routing screen. Say it says timbre one is going to IFX1. You go to the screen with the overview of IFX (1-12). Check if IFX1 is chained to more IFX slots (the box saying "chain" will be ticked in that case). Find the LAST IFX in the chain and you'll notice it'll say on the right hand side where the sound is going (probably the L/R bus, but you can route it to any of the individual outs as well) and it'll show the send levels to MFX 1 and 2. They're probably at 127.

I agree that this is a somewhat confusing way of doing things but it's quite powerful and flexible once you get the hang of it. Hope you're getting all this, don't hesitate to ask if it's still confusing you!

firstlovedan · Posted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:38 am Post subject:

Wow. Thanks so much. I will check it out tomorrow! I know it us complex, but just like my fantom, once you get an understanding, and work flow, you become grateful of the complexity, and versitility of your axxe!
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

Did this work for you eventually?

firstlovedan · Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 2:57 am Post subject:

Yes. Sorry I was lax in ly reply. I am setting the Reverb send AFTER I hear what copying a program does. I adjust the send until I am satisfied with the copied program... And TGEN I adjust the indv. Tracks. I like the Fantom's aporoach better. I just go to sequencer mode, and just pick my sounds. No copying. And if you use too many efx, than they just don't happen. But, I am sure the Kronos has more efx options, so, I just need to create a new work flow. I do not understand why we need to copy. A HUGE part if the program's sound quality is the efx. I just wish the efx were 'Married' to the programs, then we would have the option to change, or tweak them. Thanks again for all your help
Firstlovedan
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

Ok, that's not what I was saying at all, but I'm glad you found something that works for you.
You can fully tweak/change/adapt all the fx after copying a program btw. The only reason you use "copy from program" is because as you said, they're a large part of the sound. But nothing is keeping you from altering them.

firstlovedan · Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 4:43 am Post subject:

Dear SanderXpander,
I don't want to keep pounding this, but can you walk me through setting the amount of
MFX for the 'copied program'? I have studied the midi routing 1&2, and the MFX page, but all I see are Master controls that affect 'All' channels. I noticed on one page (I can't remember which) but on a drop down menu, it is set to 'G'. Is this the way you select a certain track? Again, I know I sound dense, but I have read the manual, and I am just not getting it. As you noted, I have found a work around. At current, I am copying a program, and then setting the MFX 1 (usually reverb) to my liking ie, +20 or so, and then setting the other 'non-copied' programs in the MIDI routing 1 page. This works, but as you noted is not the best way. Thank you again for your time! I hope someday soon I will be helping other newbies!
Blessings and Beatles,
Firstlovedan
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

No problem at all, I'm glad to help.

I think what's confusing you is that in the midi routing pages, the mfx sends are "greyed out" for the copied program, right? You can set the send levels for the other (non-copied) programs but not for the copied program(s). This is because those other programs are going directly to the L/R bus, as you can see, while the copied program is going to an IFX slot. If you were to change the non-copied programs routing to an IFX slot too, the MFX sends would get greyed out as well. But that doesn't mean that you can't the MFX send level anywhere, it's just in a different place, as I tried to explain above.

Try this for an experiment. Take an empty combi or sequence. Set a reverb on MFX1 and make sure the fx settings are pretty wet so you can hear it. In the midi routing page, you can adjust the send level, as you know. Now change the routing for the program you're using from L/R to IFX1. The mfx sends will now be greyed out. You'll see a line going from timbre 1 to IFX1, signifying the sound is now going to IFX1 instead of straight to L/R. You'll probably still hear reverb but that's because it's now coming from a "send" in a different place. Now go to the IFX overview page - the one where you see all 12 IFX slots top to bottom. Not the one where you edit the individual fx but the page with the overview. They're all empty right now (unless you copied from a program) but your timbre is going to IFX1 so putting any effect in there and making it wet should affect your sound. But you don't have to right now, the point is that on the right side of the screen, on the line of IFX1, you should see a few things; you'll see L/R again, meaning that the sound is going to L/R after having passed through IFX1 - and you'll also see send levels for MFX1 and 2. THIS is where you set your mfx send levels if you are putting your sound through IFX first.

So when you've copied a program, check the midi routing page, it'll say where your timbre is going (usually IFX1 unless it's your 2nd or 3rd copied program). Then go to the IFX overview page and adjust the mfx send there. The only extra thing to pay attention to is that it's possible to chain IFX. Meaning the sound will pass through multiple IFX before going to the L/R bus. There is a chaining checkbox that shows this - if IFX 1 and 2 are chained for instance the box will be checked, there will be a small connecting line and the mfx and routing of IFX1 will be greyed out. So you just adjust your mfx sends after IFX2. Is this making sense yet? It's a very powerful and flexible system but you're definitely not the only one breaking his head over it.

EDIT:
For a useful analogy, think of the IFX slots as stomp boxes. When I hook up my Rhodes directly to the mixer, I set up the send levels for my reverb straight at the mixer. But when I put my Rhodes through a phaser first, the reverb send will also have to come AFTER the phaser. Otherwise I would send a clean signal to the reverb while have a phased direct signal. Did that help or just confuse things more?

firstlovedan · Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 2:59 pm Post subject:

Awesome! That's it! Thank you again! This changes everything!
Blessings again to you,
firstlovedan
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SanderXpander · Platinum Member Joined: 29 Jul 2011 Posts: 7860

I'm glad it helped. Much easier to get your mix right if you know where the knobs and buttons are Smile

firstlovedan · Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:45 pm Post subject:

Absolutely! Now, my next goal is becoming a PRODUCTIVE citizen of this forum! Maybe I can discover some 'unknown' function or something!!! Thanks again,
Firstlovedan
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'Life is what happens while you are busy making other plans"