Korg Forums

korg1 · Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 1:33 am Post subject:

Really can't follow you right now, maybe i am tired now,i will have to read it again, but i would also like to see or hear an example of how you work with them.

For example:
1)How do you find the song you want to play ,or should i say the setlist you want to use,among let's say 1500 setlists?
That could only work if you play 30-40 songs.

2)how many kbdsets do you need to play in a song,and why you can't change kbdsets on the fly while playing ?

3) What do you mean ''no variable style performances of a song in a style'' ? you can use the same style ,change instruments ,mix, insert fx,etc , and save it as a second songbook entry for example,in case you want a total different sound or a special master effect for the whole style while playing.you can use kaoss also in realtime.

As i also said,you can use up to 6 different cv's for every1-4Variations ,so i think they are more than enough to play what you want .

You are right about setlists are not fixed somewhere,
but what is in every setlist,should be located either in internal or direct set songbook.
Setlist can't exist by itself only without the songbook entries,it will be just an empty list.

For me,setlists are just lists of songs i want to play in a gig,nothing more.
It works for having more kbdsets for a song if you like too,but there is no search list for setlists.You also have to be careful when switching kbdsets,not jumping for example from Verse of the song to intro ,etc.
That means,you will have to store the right element with the right kbdset each time.

As i said ,i would love to see how you work with them in realtime and what other ''PLAYBACK PARAMETERS'' you can use that we can't do it normally
_________________

https://pasongstyles.com/
https://soundcloud.com/korgfx

inox · Joined: 02 Feb 2020 Posts: 12 Location: Hungary

Because of language difficulties, it is impossible to explain
these complex problems.
And there are plenty of problems.
The bottom line is that the SET List does not have many benefits for me.

It annoys me that when I change a track (Songbook or even SET List), PAD playback stops.
It is recommended that you use the PAD Lock feature, but the other PAD will not be called when you call another entry.
In addition, changes in the SET List occur 1 step later.

It would be worthwhile for Korg professionals to study Tyros, Genos User memory.

By the way, I really like the PA4X, it's just tiring that you have to constantly press one of the buttons like a raging nerve to call up functions.

siebenhirter · Platinum Member Joined: 13 Oct 2011 Posts: 1844

korg1 · Posted: Sat Mar 28, 2020 9:03 pm Post subject:

still don't get it.
Working setlist as a kbdset entries works well only if you use the keyboard as a synthesizer ,not as an arranger,for the reasons that i mentioned before :
1)no search option (you have to scroll through setlists to find the list you want for every song you want to play )
2)no cue for style
3) no option to use the same set of entries with another style on the fly(you will have to resave the same kbdsets with another style at another setlist).

I work with 4 STS just fine for every song,if i need more i just chose from the keyboard set library categories i have on internal-user or Direct.

Working so many years with bands i am used at changing sounds and scales on the fly while playing ,on pa4x is a benefit having 4 ready STS for each song .

I am sure Yamaha has not only better and ready to play sounds,
but better way of using chord sequencer as well.
The way it handles STS is better too,but it's not fair to compare it with setlist.

Setlist is just a list,which by the way,could be used for working with more kbdsets if you need too,but not use it as superior way of working with.
_________________

https://pasongstyles.com/
https://soundcloud.com/korgfx

inox · Joined: 02 Feb 2020 Posts: 12 Location: Hungary

As I see it, the whole point of the SET List is that I can sort the Songbook entries in any order I want to play the songs.
Songbook is a large collection of records, a mix of MIDI songs, styles, Mp3s.
Yamaha manages these individually, transparently.
In the SET List group view, selection is easier (physically),
like the narrow list view of the Songbook.
I do not agree that, as I use it (1 song -1 Set List), it is harder to find a song than it is on pages 30 or 50 of a SET List.
In both cases, the songs can be saved in play order.

siebenhirter · Platinum Member Joined: 13 Oct 2011 Posts: 1844

Hello,
it is ok to work with 4 STS for every song and to choose additional KbdSets from SetLibrary.

This single Sb-entry per song is sufficient and fixes its style performance to the play parameters of the style tracks. Even if up to 6 different CVs and up to eight style elements allow different sequences, this does not change the fixed playback parameters of the unique style performance.

Amount of Sb-entries limits the amount of style performances and is not suitable for being as variable with the play parameters of the background tracks (style performances) as with the real-time tracks (keyboard sets).

If there is only one sb-entry for a song only one style performance exists for the song. It is also ok if a single style performance is considered sufficient for a song.

If one style performance is not sufficient, additional Sb-entries are required in the Sb-database. As a large number of Sb-entries are well suitet for multiple use in different songs of same genre (that is without to resave styles), these sb-entries are much easier to summarize for songs in an sb- list, instead of being duplicated individually for each song in the database.

Using set-lists does not hinder working with using benefit of 4 STS ready for certain songs and choosing kbdSets from library, also do not hinder to search your entries as you like it. On the contrary, setlist are to use in parallel and without to fill the database. Sb-lists correspond to a database query - the are lean and do not burden the system and are stored for fast access to direct devices.

It is also not intended to present different ways of working as competition or superior work because there is no reason not to use them in combination. The one does not exclude the other.

After hopefully eliminating the shortcoming not being able to play smooth transitions, the biggest advantage of set lists with entry-typ style is to eliminate the shortcoming of rigidly assigned and limited style performances for a song.

Also it is ok to be satisfied with a single style performance, but - after it embody the accompanying orchestra - it should be usable more variable as being lashed to the settings of a single style in an single sb-entry. Sb-list is made and well suited also for that.

Working with more kbdsets if needed also can be done via the KbdSet library with well-prepared auto-select settings.