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Kronos into Cubase

 
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methusala
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:02 am    Post subject: Kronos into Cubase Reply with quote

Hi,

Could someone help me out here.

Can you point me to a tutorial or video showing how to get Kronos fully integrated into Cubase (I have 8.5) as an external hardware instrument. I have made a number of botched attempts but I don't want to give up! I don't seem to be able to find any threads directly on this in these forums.

Thanks

Parick

On reflection, this is more a cubase question than a Kronos one.
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QuiRobinez
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've answered this question in other threads on the forum, but in basics the following steps are needed:

Cubase:
- create an external instrument named Kronos where you use the Midi Port: Kronos Keyboard and the audio return channels where connected your kronos to (see the cubase connection window)
- then (IMPORTANT) load this newly created external instrument in a VST instrument Slot (see the menu option: Vst instruments), what this does is saying to cubase that you are using a multitimbral external synth (so you have 16 midi channels) and that all audio streamed by this hardware external synth is latency compensated automatically with all your other VST instruments or samples.
- Now go to the Cubase project window and add 16 midi tracks (or as much as you need)
- in the inspector of the midi track in the output dropdownbox select the loaded kronos external instrument which is now available because you have loaded it as a vst instrument
- do this for every midi channel you want to use
- beneath the output dropdownbox you can select the midi channel, start with 1 and every next midi track add 1, so you have 16 midi tracks where you are using midi channel 1, 2, 3, etc..

Korg Kronos
- press the global button
- press the midi tab and then the midi subtab
- Set Local Control On to off (you are going to use cubase for this). If you want to use KARMA then you need to leave this to on, but then you will have to pay some extra attention to the midi return channels (not part of this explanation now.)

- Now open a new combi (empty)
- press the timbre parameter tab
- at the top you see a row with the name midi channel
- set it that way that you have selected 1 for timbre 1, 2 for timbre 2, 3 for timbre 3, etc...
- now select the programs per timbre you want to use in cubase. So for instance Piano for timbre 1, bass for timbre 2, guitar for timbre 3
- save the combi with the song name so you can find it later again.

Cubase:
- go to midi track 1
- play something: you will hear the piano of timbre 1
- go to midi track 2
- play something: you will hear the bass for timbre 2.
etc..

- Record your tune in cubase
- then go the file menu and choose audioexport
- IMPORTANT! Select the realtime export checkbox, this ensures that the track is played in realtime and not rendered at a higher speed which the kronos doesn't support.
- Now all your midi tracks from the kronos will be played and combined with your vst instruments and samples in realtime and all be merged to an audio file automatically. You don't need to record each audio track seperately anymore in the kronos. Cubase will take care of that.


These are the basics of working with an external hardware synth which you want to behave more or less like a vst instruments. Once you got familiar with this procedure you can go to the next step and create an automation connection between the kronos and cubase so that you can automate the parameters of the kronos with a midi controller or by creating automation lanes in cubase.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've also created a tutorial of how to integrate the kronos in cubase with VST's and get every sound in realtime on separate audio channels. Maybe you can use that too.

This tutorial explains how to setup a your computer environment to play and record VSTi's live (in this tutorial i use Omnisphere) on separate audio channels in your DAW (Cubase is used for this tutorial).

(switch to 1080P so you can better read the captured screens)

The following topics are explained:
- Setup your DAW for internal summing (every VSTI channel can be routed internally to their own Audiochannel in realtime. This way everything you play live will be recorded in realtime on their own channel.
- Setup Omnisphere for live performances, Omnisphere has a great live performance feature called LIVE where you can toggle up till 8 sounds that you can use when you play on the Kronos.

The first part of the video is a demo of this technique in action, from 4.25 on the tutorial of how to setup the environment is shown. In the video demo i'm using a touch screen and an Ipad with the APP Omni to toggle the sounds. But you can also do this with your mouse on the computer if you don't have a touch screen or ipad.

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methusala
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Qui,

Thank you very much indeed. I must have caught you at a good time having this forum open at the time of my post. I'll follow your instructions. In fact I have the Oasys but the path will be the same no doubt.

Best wishes,
Patrick
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QuiRobinez
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 12:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

methusala wrote:
In fact I have the Oasys but the path will be the same no doubt.

yes,
the procedure is the same for every hardware synth Smile
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methusala
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Qui,

I do value your time and helpful advice to us.

I've had a terrible day. I've been fiddling around with my Cubase 8.5 attempting to get the Oasys showing up as an external midi device. I came across a drop down asking me what parameters I wanted the O to show up. I chose volume, panning and others. I went back to the O, opened a combi and found for the first time the faders would not work when I pressed the Control Assign-Timbre/Track button: 1-8 and 9-16 still worked the Karma scenes and Karma switches But the faders still worked fine when pressing each one on the screen and moving the Value slider. I suspect I have upset something in Cubase which is always open when I operate the Oasys.

What a day!!

Have you any suggestions possibly?

Yours frustrated,
Patrick
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methusala
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Carrying on this awful day, I suppose all my troubles could be solved at a stroke if I uninstall Cubase 8.5 and re-install it, and work through the re-installed version in the hope that the faders will return to work from the faders and not the screen.

Oh lordy. Sorry to have troubled everyone.

Patrick
.
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80salife
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 7:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Qui,

Thank you for this really good informations...

I have another problem, I want use Clock of Kronos...

How can I set in cubase to clock of the Kronos?

Thank you Very Happy
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methusala
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Panic stations over. The cause for the non-working sliders was under my very nose the whole time. I was trying to operate them when the External button was on.

Patrick
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playboy354



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PostPosted: Sat Mar 25, 2017 6:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Will Cubase transfer over the korg sound efx you used or will these tracks have to be assigned new vst efx in Cubase?
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jg::
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The approach suggested by Qui Robinez is very extensive, and is sure to work.
But I have a much simpler way of setting up Kronos.

Simply install the Korg USB MIDI Driver.
Connect Kronos to your computer via USB (one cable)
Next time you boot Cubase, Kronos Kbd will be recognized as a MIDI controller, and Kronos Sound will be recognized as a MIDI sound source.
Set Kronos MIDI Local on/off as required.

Now, I can simply create a MIDI track, which by default responds to All MIDI inputs, including Kronos. And I can select the output of that MIDI track to be Kronos Sound, if I want, or of course, any other software sound or external MIDI sound.

This has worked for years with all versions of Cubase, and probably most other DAWs as well.

As for Oasys, and the op, there is no USB connection. So you must use a MIDI interface of some kind, and two MIDI cables, to get MIDI in and out of the computer. If that is working for one keyboard, it will work for everything with a standard MIDI port. There's nothing that is specific to the Oasys in this standard MIDI setup.

jg::
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QuiRobinez
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jg:: wrote:
The approach suggested by Qui Robinez is very extensive, and is sure to work.
But I have a much simpler way of setting up Kronos.

Simply install the Korg USB MIDI Driver.
Connect Kronos to your computer via USB (one cable)
Next time you boot Cubase, Kronos Kbd will be recognized as a MIDI controller, and Kronos Sound will be recognized as a MIDI sound source.
Set Kronos MIDI Local on/off as required.

Now, I can simply create a MIDI track, which by default responds to All MIDI inputs, including Kronos. And I can select the output of that MIDI track to be Kronos Sound, if I want, or of course, any other software sound or external MIDI sound.

This has worked for years with all versions of Cubase, and probably most other DAWs as well.

that is the same approach as my answer, but i've added the kronos audio as a return channel in cubase.

And you definitely want this, otherwise you would get way to much problems with audio latency if you don't do it this way. For instance, lets say you load a VST instrument and a VST effect in your project and you combine that with the kronos. The VST instruments adds 15 ms latency to your audio signal processing and the vst effect adds 20 ms latency to your audio signal processing (theoretical example), the audio interface has a combined input + output latency of 12 ms. Now what does this mean?

Your kronos will sound directly on your outboard mixer (without the added latency compensation), the vst and effect will sound 15+20+12 = 47ms later then your kronos sound. Now you can solve this a little bit by adding the kronos audio output to an an audio channel in cubase. In that case the VST + vst effect will sound 15+20 = 35ms later then your kronos (which sound is delayed by the 12 ms round trip).

Now if you add an external instrument then all this is taken care for you by cubase, everything will always be in sync, (no matter the amount of vst effects, synths).

So it's still the same as sending midi directly to the kronos (in external instrument you also use the kronos keyboard en kronos sound as midi source / destinations) but with the added benefit of the latency compensation.

This is not kronos specific, this applies to every hardware solution (hardware synths and hardware effects) that you embed in cubase.
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playboy354



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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can someone tell me if I set up kronos this way to DAW and set each midi track in Cubase or any DAW to Kronos Sound; will the exact sounds i used in the Kronos Sequencer be rendered into Cubase onto 16 seperate midi tracks?
Will the effects used on Kronos be used as well?

I'm trying to find a way to basically have my songs transferred to a DAW so I can edit each of 16 tracks easily and then render them into a stereo wav file once done; without having to solo record each track in Kronos sequencer over multiple takes
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xp50player
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sound isn't rendured on a MIDI track. The Kronos will not pass 16 stereo signals through the USB, if that's what you are wanting. Only the Yamaha Montage does that. You will have to solo Kronos tracks to get individual sounds onto different audio tracks in the DAW.
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