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Original Kronos 61 key not starting up anymore
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sjj50



Joined: 29 Sep 2011
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 7:58 am    Post subject: Original Kronos 61 key not starting up anymore Reply with quote

Hi,

My 6 year old Kronos 61 begins to start up but half way through the following message occurs:

System cannot start due to a file system error

Please reinstall the system software


(19, keybed)


I have tried reinstallng the system software from the original DVDs but this does not help (I tried a full format and reinstall). I assume I have a hardware failure - something to do with the keybed presumably.

Has anyone else had this problem and if so what was the fault and how was it resolved?

Thanks in advance for your help.

Cheers, Ian
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geoelectro
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Joined: 14 Sep 2012
Posts: 891
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm just going to take a guess. Since it's out of warranty, I would take the bottom off and check all the cable connections, especially to the keyboard assembly. Maybe a loose cable is interfering with boot up. The 61 bottom is easy to remove and it doesn't cause any issues like is possible with the larger versions.

Geo
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Schmooster
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Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 238

PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a link to the service manual - there's a test mode you can enter by holding [mixer knobs] + [reset controls] + [Enter] + [5] together; that lists 5 areas of auto-test with keybed being number 5 This will say Ok if it's Ok; but then there are a number of sub-tests you can go through - right down to the ADC's and internal buzzer so you need to refer to the manual.

https://elektrotanya.com/korg_kronos_61_73_88_ver.2.0.pdf/download.html

It should enter Test Mode regardless of boot issues. Hope it helps you pinpoint it anyway.

Give the manual a minute to download fully to your browser - you can copy it to iBooks or Adobe Acrobat although they ask you not to - it's copyrighted after all.
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pedro5
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Joined: 06 Oct 2011
Posts: 1103
Location: Coventry UK.

PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 11:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Schmooster

Interesting information.
I don't wish to spoil your suggestion,but...

Are you sure test mode can be entered regardless of boot issues ?

I've only been able to enter test mode when the Kronos is fully booted.
It may be difficult to press & hold the buttons and flip the power switch... Wink

I realise you're trying to be helpful and appreciate the link,but be aware it may be removed by the moderator...unless the copyright limits no longer applies.

Forgive my negative approach.
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Schmooster
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Joined: 13 Jan 2007
Posts: 238

PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pedro;

The power switch isn't part of initiating this test sequence, and since you say you've initiated the test yourself from a booted board you'd already know that - so why say how awkward it would be to press 4 buttons and then 'flip the switch'? You said you initiated it after booting, which is 2 minutes after 'flipping the switch' as you put it - I'm not following you at all. So were you fully booted (which means you completely by-passed Test Mode) and then switched it off ('flipped the switch') to initiate the Service Test Mode? Or did you actually not 'flip the switch'? Sorry for my negative approach but you appear to completely contradict yourself.

Also, there wouldn't be much point having a full-system service-level diagnostics tool for a working keyboard - that makes absolutely no sense at all to a former service engineer? It tests the SSD - why bother if it Boots? If it works it's working - there's no need to test it further other than by use alone. The test is in ROM and doesn't require a booted keyboard - it's Service Level, not 'user' - totally separate and independent (aside from the buttons used to enter it and a screen to display it, external if necessary as there's a VGA port on the main board for use if the screen is faulty, nothing else should be required except more faults; for which the tests are intended to pinpoint). Pity they didn't code that VGA port for use after booting. Wink They still could... They should!!? It's not Rocket Surgery.

I'm aware the post or link could be removed - however the host site is licensed to display the manuals - to join the forums you need to pass a simple Electronics test - 5 questions, translated from Japanese and only a tiny bit ambiguous; but worth taking if you want access to Service Manuals for 1000's of electrical/electronics items including Korg's full back catalogue. If you leave the page to find the answers you'll end the test. It can only be taken once a week and the questions vary - the ambiguity of them is deliberate to ensure knowledge of the subject - I think; it's hard to know unless you don't know??
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pedro5
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Joined: 06 Oct 2011
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Location: Coventry UK.

PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Schmooster

Thanks for your response.
I think we are at cross purposes here.
Forgive any confusion caused.

My experience of entering test mode would be after a completed boot, without any errors shown on screen during the process.
It's good to know it can be entered into with a non booting Kronos…

The results will be very interesting, if the o/p choses to do this.

I would like to take advantage of an opportunity to ask a few of questions,please.

My Kronos show two errors in the main test mode screen.
1) MIDI NG S2 (Time Out Error).
2) USB NG S1 ( USB A and B Loop Test Not Detected).

What do these mean ?
Should I try to eradicate them ?

Would appreciate any further information,if possible.

I mentioned the possible snags with downloading the manual, as a sort of warning for others in that it may be removed.
This has been the case several times in the past,so a need to seize the opportunity sooner,rather than later exists.
It is worth having a copy…so thank you for making it available.

Best Wishes.
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Schmooster
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Joined: 13 Jan 2007
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Pedro,

No worries, certainly no need for apologies. Wink I haven't made the manual available though - Google did; there are several copies for reference available on the net, so I can't take any credit - I do however accept responsibility for posting the link however, so if it gets removed then it gets removed and I'll take my 'punishment' from the mods.

Are you experiencing any issues related to those 'potential faults' you've highlighted? They may just be red herrings.

You'd get a MIDI time-out error if you weren't using MIDI or had it actively connected and communicating during the test, or had a dongle fitted for testpurposes - the same for the USB messages - if the sockets were empty and you weren't using 'loopback' test plugs then Tx and Rx can't be tested - the test will transmit (Tx) a signal which would be looped back and received (Rx) to fully test the USB ports if they weren't in use. They're not errors as such unless you're experiencing MIDI or USB problems - if you were then these notifications may indicate why.
In your case I'm guessing they've been highlighted as they've not been fully tested - so in that instance you have nothing to worry about. There's no need to eradicate them no. Hope this helps.
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pedro5
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Location: Coventry UK.

PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks for your informative reply.

It certainly helps alleviate my concerns.
I shall now disregard any further possible "remedial" actions.

Initially these errors weren't present,but over time they appeared for unknown reasons.
However....the Kronos behaves and plays just fine.

My keyboard has been to a service center several times,in the past (for an unrelated problem) and they refused to provide any answers to this query.
They even scoffed at the idea I had entered test mode anyway...lol.

Thanks again for your help.

Best Wishes.
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sjj50



Joined: 29 Sep 2011
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 8:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks Scmooster for the Service Manual and suggestions. I don't seem to be able to get into the test mode using your suggestion. I have tried presssing [MIXER KNOBS] + [RESET CONTROLS] + [ENTER] + [5] after the boot error shown above stops the boot up sequence. I have also tried holding down all these keys while I turned on the power switch. Neither method sets it to Test Mode. What is the correct method to enter Test Mode?
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tritonhaven
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Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 53
Location: Netherlands

PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 8:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Was anyone able to download the PDF? Could you mail it to me?

cheers!
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pedro5
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sjj50

The only thing I can suggest is that you check the memory modules for security.....they can sometimes become loose.

Also,check for any other loose connections.

Best Wishes.
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sjj50



Joined: 29 Sep 2011
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks pedro5. I haven't had time to open the board up but when I do I will also check the memory boards. Cheers sjj50
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qqquartzzz



Joined: 24 Apr 2018
Posts: 26
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 8:36 pm    Post subject: Same problem as above. Reply with quote

Hello. New to the group and I have a Kronos 61.
I was wondering if there was any resolve to this?
I can't seem to get mine into test mode either.
Same "19 keybed" error on boot up.
Going to crack it open tonight and give the RAM and some wires a shake.
I'll keep youse posted in case anyone else falls into the same hole.

Slainte!
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qqquartzzz



Joined: 24 Apr 2018
Posts: 26
Location: Ontario Canada

PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well. I have it apart. Replaced the RAM. Gave every wire a shake and security test. Loaded 6.0.4 firmware in. Did a full install / format again afterwards. Changed the SATA cable. Tried to enter the elusive "Test Mode" to no avail.
I now am going to purchase a new SSD drive to see if that's the culprit.

Everything was working fine until I did the Full Install/Format option. I'm hoping that during the format, the SSD did a little shimmy and got damaged somehow.
I know. If everything was working fine, why on earth did I do a Full Install/Format? I just got this unit and the files were a mess. I just wanted to start completely from scratch. I guess I got my wish Shocked

Update: I'll just try another SATA hard drive I have here...hmm..let you know

Question: Is it possible to update to say OS 3.0.3 without being able to get a full boot and access to the GLOBAL screen? Say, through Enter+Pause and entering into USB mode? I'm wondering if it's an older OS on the factory disks causing the "19,keybed" boot up error. It had 3.0.3 when I got it.
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Falcon2e
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Joined: 19 Feb 2008
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Location: Indiana USA

PostPosted: Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello and welcome to the forum.

I'm a little confused reading this post. I noticed you mentioned "19 key bed" error. There is another post about "19 key bed". Did you want to post your question here, or join in on "My Kronos has died..19 key bed error"?

Good luck, let us know if you solve your issue.
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