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WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

On which page of the Kronos will I find information as to which MIDI CC(s) control which LFO(s) for a specific program or combi?

Sorry if this is a dumb question. I have a lot to learn about such things.

voip · Platinum Member Joined: 27 Nov 2014 Posts: 3772

This is a very broad question to which there is no simple, straightforward answer.

LFOs are used in a variety of ways in the Kronos, and their uses are, to an extent, engine-dependent. So, for example, use of LFOs by the SGX-2 engine, as used by the German Grand, will be different to the AL-1 synth engine. See page 54 of the Kronos Operations Guide (KRONOS_Op_Guide_E10.pdf) to get started with developing a deeper understanding of LFO implementation. Use the PDF reader search, and hyperlink functions to help search and navigate backwards and forwards through the Guide, and the Previous and Next Page view controls to "return" back and forth to previously viewed pages.

One thing to look out for is AMS (Alternate Modulation Sources) which can be used to modulate LFOs, where this is possible, and the relevant Kronos screens will point to particular control sources. Bear in mind also, that there are such things as AMS mixers, that combine modulation sources in a mathematically-defined way.

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WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

Yes, I had a vague idea that my question might be overly broad.

I was reading the manual and kept encountering the term AMS, so I searched the PDF. AMS seems to always (?) use CC#83, so I tried that but didn't notice it having any effect. Maybe I wasn't properly routing data to the AMS.

And maybe I just need to keep reading the manual until it starts to make sense.

Thank you.

CharlesFerraro · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 4:28 pm Post subject:

Describe what you're trying to do specifically. Would you like to use CC's to control the frequency of an LFO? change the waveform? change waveshape? All of the above?
Which engine are you trying to use? Does the LFO need to be tempo sync'd? I can help you out if I know what goal you have in mind.
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WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

First, to clarify my most recent post, if I change AMS to use Controller, it seems to always use CC#83.

I take that to mean that I can feed Kronos CC#83 from my DAW, and it will do...whatever, I don't know what, but it will change some parameter, probably varying depending on which program I'm using.

Specifics:

I'm using Program IE77, which on my Kronos is Pro 5 Synth Lead. I'm using LFOTool to generate CC#83 data, and I'm sending the data from my DAW (Sonar) to Kronos. I'm simultaneously sending MIDI notes out from Sonar to Kronos. So the idea is that the CC data will modulate something or other in the Kronos as the MIDI notes are playing. But so far it doesn't effect any change in the sound.

Just to be sure the problem is not with LFOTool, I recorded the CC data output from LFOTool onto a MIDI track, then sent that to Kronos as the MIDI notes were playing. So at this point I'm not actually using LFOTool.

No change.

On the Kronos, I have the Global/MIDI/Enable Control Change box checked. And I tried sending the CC data on all 16 MIDI channels, one at a time. Still no change.

Btw, LFOTool can automatically tempo sync to a DAW, so that's not the issue.

Thanks for any assistance you can offer.

WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

PS: It occurs to me that maybe that's not at all what Controller means.

CharlesFerraro · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 5:52 pm Post subject:

So you're NOT trying to control LFO parameters via MIDI CC's. Which parameter would you like to automate with your LFO tool? And why not just use one of the Kronos' native LFO's?
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WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

It speaks to the depths of my ignorance that I'm not sure what you mean by that first sentence. Isn't that what LFOTool does? Generate MIDI CCs which can then modulate LFOs?

Which parameter? Any/all, but at this point I'll settle for any...let's say Pitch Bend.

I'm trying to learn how to do riser-type effects for EDM.

WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

"And why not just use one of the Kronos' native LFO's?"

If I knew how I probably would.

CharlesFerraro · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:13 pm Post subject:

WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

I actually did know what LFO stands for, and I also know one when I hear it.

The Program is Pro 5 Synth Lead, which is in Bank INT-E. The manual says this Bank holds both AL-1 and CX-3 programs, and I'm not sure which of these engines the Pro 5 uses.

I've spent a while now looking for this info, but haven't yet found it.

I'm guessing this conversation is excruciatingly painful for you.

WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

HD-1.

That doesn't show on the MQ Editor. I had to look at the Kronos screen.

CharlesFerraro · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 6:37 pm Post subject:

Looks like Pro 5 Synth Lead is Program U-F 124 which is an HD-1 program on the current voice name list. You should update to the latest OS.

That program already has an LFO modulating pitch by applying aftertouch or JS+Y.

If you would like to have constant pitch modulation simply go to
>OSC/Pitch tab
>OSC1 Pitch

There you'll notice a box that says LFO1/2
Boost the intensity of LFO1 which is a saw down by default.
Adjust LFO1 in the LFO tab.
>LFO
>OSC1 LFO1
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WVought · Full Member Joined: 12 Sep 2010 Posts: 129

On my Kronos it's IE77. And I updated the OS a few weeks back.

OK, so I changed the intensity of LFO1 and heard the effect on the pitch. So far so good. That's the effect I was looking for.

But I'm no closer to understanding how to do this via my DAW/LFOTool, or how to generalize this to other parameters, and I'm reluctant to ask for any more of your time.

I'll play around with this and see what else I can learn on my own.

Thanks for your help. Much appreciated.

CharlesFerraro · Posted: Sun Jul 30, 2017 7:04 pm Post subject:

Some general advice since I didn't notice that you said you're trying to create risers for EDM.

-Use negative modulation with a saw down to make the pitch rise.
-Offset the LFO -99 so the LFO is unipolar and thus starts on the key you press.
-Try setting the intensity to -12 semitones. (this is in the OSC/Pitch tab)
-Sync the LFO to BPM and make sure the Kronos is either at the same tempo of your project or controlled via your DAW.
-Set the LFO time to a whole note with the times parameter on four to make the riser last four bars.
-Make sure the LFO is not key sync'd.
-Use positive values in the LFO shape parameter to make the pitch rise more quickly towards the end of the LFO cycle.
-In the Basic / Vector tab, check Mono Legato under voice assign mode so you can program a legato performance in your DAW without resetting the LFO.

Goodluck
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