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How long will the K last?
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rickster1
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Joined: 23 Mar 2012
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Location: Hilton Head Island, SC

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 3:06 am    Post subject: How long will the K last? Reply with quote

Since the 6 year anniversary of my 1st gen Kronos 73 just passed, my question is ....

How long of a life do you think the Kronos should have? NAMM has come & gone and there's no new Korg keyboard to buy, so I was thinking about adding a new Kronos. I could retire my current one to my studio & use a flash drive to load my files into the new one.

I take it out on gigs once or twice a week on average. Love the K. Except for a coupla minor quirks, it's been trouble free.

Thoughts?

Rick
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GregC
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Its a good question. I started a post about K longevity some months ago.

Got lots of great and useful feedback + opinion.

I will see if I can google search if you want.

I think if you baby your K, you ' should ' get another year or 2 .

But you gig your K routinely- I think that puts more mileage on it.

My near 7 yr old K never leaves the home. It does get a solid 4-5 hours of use every day.

If your livelihood and rep depends on a dependable keyboard, I would seriously consider a 2nd K.

You should actually consult a Kronos repair person in order to get solid data on failure. That actual experience will have more weight than ' my opinion '.

New K's can still suffer component failure- we have seen about 5 reports of that in the past month. So you can't assume anything.

I would suspect your felts might be getting worn. Thats bounds to happen over many years. another reason to call a tech person.

Some potential good news- there are many of us 6-7 year K owners outs there. I have not seen any volume of routine complaining related to age.

I think its total guess work to estimate when a component is going to blink out.
Given many of us are at the 6-7 yr mark.

This optimism was based on taking good care of your K.

If an owner leaves his K on , day and night for 5 years, I would expect a component to blink out. I consider that irregular use. Same with dropping it or subjecting a K to power surges.
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Rich Z
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you haven't heard about the problem they are calling "tin whiskers" in electronics, it's an interesting read that will likely have you laying awake some nights thinking about it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpYibOp4HeQ

The above video repeats after the 5:50 point, btw.

And for some technical papers:

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2006-Leidecker-Tin-Whisker-Failures.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-kostic-Pb-free.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NASA-GSFC-whisker-failure-app-sensor.pdf
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GregC
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rich Z wrote:
If you haven't heard about the problem they are calling "tin whiskers" in electronics, it's an interesting read that will likely have you laying awake some nights thinking about it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpYibOp4HeQ

The above video repeats after the 5:50 point, btw.

And for some technical papers:

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2006-Leidecker-Tin-Whisker-Failures.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-kostic-Pb-free.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NASA-GSFC-whisker-failure-app-sensor.pdf


ok. I guess we are all doomed, right ? Smile
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Rich Z
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

GregC wrote:
Rich Z wrote:
If you haven't heard about the problem they are calling "tin whiskers" in electronics, it's an interesting read that will likely have you laying awake some nights thinking about it.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SpYibOp4HeQ

The above video repeats after the 5:50 point, btw.

And for some technical papers:

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2006-Leidecker-Tin-Whisker-Failures.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-kostic-Pb-free.pdf

https://nepp.nasa.gov/whisker/reference/tech_papers/2011-NASA-GSFC-whisker-failure-app-sensor.pdf


ok. I guess we are all doomed, right ? Smile


Ah, so you know that those technical papers are all incorrect or outright lies? Good, now I can sleep better knowing your learned opinion.
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leonh
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you buy it new then is new not this model is 7 years old nonsense and as you said it does what you want then why waiting for possible new model !
Unless new one plays by itself then that would be interesting only limitation in current Kronos is musician (except geniuses out there 😁)
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runningman67
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've heard of this. Nothing new but techies talk about it.

Having owned a stupid amount of synths over the last 43 years, the only thing that actually destroyed one was nicotine. I don't smoke but the audiences did and it completely wrote of my Hammond.
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geoelectro
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What does eventually kill off a product is lack of replacement parts. That is, when one is needed, but not available. I have a 1983 Yamaha Organ that absolutely is filled with specialized IC's that have long been out of production. However, it plays perfectly. I just received a Yamaha Clavinova built in 2004 that has bad DAC's which is a common failure for these products. So common I guess that Yamaha no longer has any. I found some on eBay from the UK and got it running.

Companies are typically required to carry replacements for 10 years after discontinued. Either by law or common practice. Since the K2 is still made, those parts should be around another decade, if needed. The older versions are getting closer to that cutoff. Still, as long as it keeps working you're good. I've had my K61 for over 5 years. Last year I picked up a K2 61. I keep one at home and the other at Church where I play. That way, I just bring a flash mem back and forth AND if one fails, I have a backup.

I keep discovering new things on this board and haven't lost any enthusiasm for it. Smile

Geo
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benny ray
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My tech says Korg is the worst at when they discontinue a keyboard the parts become hard to find really soon. I am not sure about the 10 year law that you speak of but it sure would be nice if it were true.
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Last edited by benny ray on Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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rickster1
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, this whole Tin Whisker thing is new to me. And they have no idea why they grow!
I'd like to get 10 years out of my K73 but now I'm thinking this could be the year I spring for the second one.
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mm-pro
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My 7 year old Kronos 73 is in the shop. The screen stopped lighting up. Hopefully they can get a new display card for it. I bought a new one in the meantime.
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GregC
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mm-pro wrote:
My 7 year old Kronos 73 is in the shop. The screen stopped lighting up. Hopefully they can get a new display card for it. I bought a new one in the meantime.


I think thats a wise move. Interested in your tech's diagnose on what exactly failed. And how long it takes to get the suspect part.

For some reason, more likely my suspect memory- I don't recall any display card in the K. I thought the graphics or whatever that drives the LCD was on board , as in part of the mobo.
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mm-pro
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don’t really know what failed, but I do believe there is a board between the motherboard & the display, but I probably used too generic a name for it.
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KK
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rich Z wrote:
If you haven't heard about the problem they are calling "tin whiskers"...

Geomagnetic storms are much more likely to destroy electronic equipment.

Or glasses of anything passing too close.

Or when you use your Kronos without UPS protection.

Sleep tight now.

Shocked
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GregC
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

KK wrote:
Rich Z wrote:
If you haven't heard about the problem they are calling "tin whiskers"...

Geomagnetic storms are much more likely to destroy electronic equipment.

Or glasses of anything passing too close.

Or when you use your Kronos without UPS protection.

Sleep tight now.

Shocked


I prefer real problems. Like being clumsy moving my K, and dropping it on my foot , or taking out a wall of my house , when turning a tight corner. Wink
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