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Joined: 02 May 2008 Posts: 3990 Location: Los Angeles
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:49 pm Post subject:
BR wrote:
And can we load/use it to an existing set without overwriting any existing sound?
Thanks
I think you would have to load the sounds one by one to whatever empty user locations you have. It'll take a while though....unless you use the PA Manager? _________________ Sam
And can we load/use it to an existing set without overwriting any existing sound?
Thanks
I think you would have to load the sounds one by one to whatever empty user locations you have. It'll take a while though....unless you use the PA Manager?
Thanks Sam.
I have PA Manager and I think in my case it would be better, as you mentioned, to load one by one.
I recomment to save your recources that you have in .set (all or sounds) and then try that sound collection. Then You can modify the sounds as You like and save them separetely (other .set) and later load them individually.
That recommendation is not only for sounds but for testing styles, pads etc. as well.
I think you would have to load the sounds one by one to whatever empty user locations you have.
Because I had some spare banks, I copied existing sounds from Bank 1 somewhere else temporarily, then loaded Qui sounds to Bank 1. Then copied Qui bank to spare bank where I wanted them, and finally reinstated original sounds in Bank 1.
But without a few spare banks, yes, use SamCA method. _________________ Korg Pa4X (OS NEXT 3.1.0)
Bose L1M2 speaker system
Yamaha BT midi interface
Songbook+ app for iPad
Cubase12 Pro DAW software
Dorico Elements 4.2 scoring software
Band-in-a-Box 2022
Yamaha CVP-309GP
Joined: 25 Aug 2007 Posts: 2539 Location: Netherlands
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 9:31 am Post subject: Re: Korg Pa4x Melliflous Sound Set Released! QR
midimusa wrote:
I see this theme is very popular here. I have a little analyzed that set for my PA1000 and as i wrote before many of that will not match with PA1000 samples. I must say that Korg is very intelligent machine and it recognizes (and founds) the similar samples, but there are used in the sounds many PA4X factory samples that PA1000 will not found. For that i've made a Multismple comparison chart: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1DVTb6JOXB3GvJRRpNrjsfwSuQxDArqc3
And Robin, if You agree I will start that theme in PA1000/PA700 topic
.
Hi MidiMusa,
nice to see you compiled a list of the samples. I appreciate the offer and you can of course try to convert the Melliflous soundset for your own use. But it's not allowed to share your work with others. This is because i had nothing to do with the end result of how the programs sound on the pa700/1000 and this was originally ment as a commercial sound set.
Not many people will realise that creating a sound set like Melliflous takes literally hundreds of hours to get the exact sound i want. The sound set, sounds rather different then the factory programs on the pa4x. This is because every oscillator sample is modified by me in the synth engine which takes between 4 till 10 hours per program (including lots of proof testing and playing) till it exactly matches the sound i wanted to achieve.
If you simple replace a sample for a similar one then the result will be quite different then what i tried to achieve with that sound. So that's why i don't want to have a Melliflous sound set floating around for the pa700 / 1000 if i didn't create it myself. I hope you understand my thoughts about this.
I think it might inspire pa1000 and pa700 owners to go an create there own sound sets if they have knowledge on how to edit the sounds etc.
No need to physically recreate Qui great work. _________________ Gem Wk4, Technics Kn5000, Solton Ms60, Yamaha Psr K1, Korg Pa50sd, Tyros 4, Korg Pa700
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 11:47 am Post subject: Re: Korg Pa4x Melliflous Sound Set Released! QR
QuiRobinez wrote:
midimusa wrote:
I see this theme is very popular here. I have a little analyzed that set for my PA1000 and as i wrote before many of that will not match with PA1000 samples. I must say that Korg is very intelligent machine and it recognizes (and founds) the similar samples, but there are used in the sounds many PA4X factory samples that PA1000 will not found. For that i've made a Multismple comparison chart: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1DVTb6JOXB3GvJRRpNrjsfwSuQxDArqc3
And Robin, if You agree I will start that theme in PA1000/PA700 topic
.
Hi MidiMusa,
nice to see you compiled a list of the samples. I appreciate the offer and you can of course try to convert the Melliflous soundset for your own use. But it's not allowed to share your work with others. This is because i had nothing to do with the end result of how the programs sound on the pa700/1000 and this was originally ment as a commercial sound set.
Not many people will realise that creating a sound set like Melliflous takes literally hundreds of hours to get the exact sound i want. The sound set, sounds rather different then the factory programs on the pa4x. This is because every oscillator sample is modified by me in the synth engine which takes between 4 till 10 hours per program (including lots of proof testing and playing) till it exactly matches the sound i wanted to achieve.
If you simple replace a sample for a similar one then the result will be quite different then what i tried to achieve with that sound. So that's why i don't want to have a Melliflous sound set floating around for the pa700 / 1000 if i didn't create it myself. I hope you understand my thoughts about this.
Offcourse we can understand you...
Espescially with the knowledge that the larger multisamles with the best sounds are missing on the 1000... and this file prooves just that.. _________________ Korg Kronos 2/88 , Genos, Mainstage3 +VSTsu, ipad pro, GSi Gemini, Roland Integra 7, Jupiter Xm, Yamaha motif XS rack, Ketron SD90.
www.keyszone.boards.net
I think it might inspire pa1000 and pa700 owners to go an create there own sound sets if they have knowledge on how to edit the sounds etc.
No need to physically recreate Qui great work.
This is where the korg edx engine shines...
It blows away the competitor(yamaha) in this department (and qui is proof of that)
I hope in the future korg will expand this engine.. by adding things like virtual analogue oscilators... a huge bank of filters... more advanced DSP... FM... and much much more(think kontakt programming) if you can see the engine as semi modular with different building blocks... then it has a long lifespan ahead of it... _________________ Korg Kronos 2/88 , Genos, Mainstage3 +VSTsu, ipad pro, GSi Gemini, Roland Integra 7, Jupiter Xm, Yamaha motif XS rack, Ketron SD90.
www.keyszone.boards.net
Joined: 25 Aug 2007 Posts: 2539 Location: Netherlands
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 12:03 pm Post subject:
Bachus wrote:
NativeAngels wrote:
I think it might inspire pa1000 and pa700 owners to go an create there own sound sets if they have knowledge on how to edit the sounds etc.
No need to physically recreate Qui great work.
This is where the korg edx engine shines...
It blows away the competitor(yamaha) in this department (and qui is proof of that)
I hope in the future korg will expand this engine.. by adding things like virtual analogue oscilators... a huge bank of filters... more advanced DSP... FM... and much much more(think kontakt programming) if you can see the engine as semi modular with different building blocks... then it has a long lifespan ahead of it...
I agree, although the current synth engine is rather basic, it offers more then enough possibilities to create lots of great sounds.
VA oscs would be nice and would give more possibilties for sound design, but it's not really needed because there are quite some samples like SAW, SQUARE, TRIANGLE, etc already available, and with some tricks you can also modify those to your liking. One thing that i really miss is the maximum rate for things like LFO (the same applies to the Max Rate setting for the Effects like chorus).
The rate of Lfo's is especially important for current days EDM sounds. I'm building a Pa4x EDM dance sounds library at the moment inspired by the sounds used in the Armin van Buuren State of Trance shows. And most of the sounds i can create just by using the SAW, SQUARE, SINE, TRIANGLE sample, but there are a few sounds that aren't possible simply because the Maximum LFO rate is to slow. So i'm still puzzling how to solve that with other tricks. But the sounds that are ready sounds really convincing and are on par with my Virus TI and Sylenth 1 sounds.
Ive not really gone too deep in PA700 sound design. Ive played round with some vst synths on FL Studio. Some simple tutorials for creating simple sounds on the Korg pa4x,1000 and 700 would be great. _________________ Gem Wk4, Technics Kn5000, Solton Ms60, Yamaha Psr K1, Korg Pa50sd, Tyros 4, Korg Pa700
Joined: 25 Aug 2007 Posts: 2539 Location: Netherlands
Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2018 6:21 pm Post subject:
NativeAngels wrote:
Ive not really gone too deep in PA700 sound design. Ive played round with some vst synths on FL Studio. Some simple tutorials for creating simple sounds on the Korg pa4x,1000 and 700 would be great.
Ok, let me see if i can help you to get you started with this.
First i've checked on youtube for Korg Pa sound programming tutorials in english, but i couldn't find them. The good news is that it's uses one of the most easy to learn synth engines. It's called Substractive synthesis.
So then the only thing left is to understand the structure of programming substractive synthesis. It's explained in this tutorial: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=se31yZHNLLI
Now there is one addition to that video, the oscillators are based on samples. So that gives you much more sound sources then just the standard four Osc types that you can find normally in a substractive synth.
Then the next step is to program a sound on the Korg Pa, if you understood the substractive synth tutorial you will recognise most parts in the synth engine now. So let me give you a quick start on how to do it on the korg pa
steps:
- press the sound button
- go to a free slot in the user area (for instance user - sound tab 2 - slot 1)
- if you only have slots filled with sounds then just select the sound you want to replace and press right top menu on the screen and select initialize sound.
If you done it correctly you will hear a dry piano sound which is the default on the Korg Pa series (on VA synths it's most of the time a Saw sound)
According to the video earlier in this thread you need to follow this structure to create a sound (recommended if you are new at sound programming)
Select Oscillator -> Set Filter -> Set Amp parameters (called EG in Korg terminologie) -> set effects
Select Oscillator
- press the menu button
- press the Basic tab on your screen
- you see that you have a sound that uses 1 oscillator. Let's leave it at that value to avoid the more complex sound setups
- press the osc tab at the bottom
- you have 1 oscillator at the top which uses the default piano sample (that's why you hear the piano sound), press the number 0000 and change it to a SAW sample by turning your jogwheel (or enter the number of the sample from your sample list in the manual) on the korg pa4x the sample number is: 1273 - Saw 1
- Now the piano is gone and you hear a saw sound to work with
There is a section below the top sample area, where you can still see the piano osc, but that one isn't used in this example, you can ignore it.
So you have finished the first part of the substractive synth tutorial and selected an oscillator to work with
Now the second part, sculp the sound to a more friendly one by adding a filter on top of it
Set the Filter:
- press the menu button again
- select the filter button on the screen
- select the default Low Pass filter resonance option at the top of the screen
- then press the number behind the frequency in the Filter A area (it's default 99)
- now lower that value to 45 by turning the wheel while you press a note, you will notice that the sound will sound darker (because you cut the high end of the frequency away this way).
the third part is to set the AMP also called ADSR or envelopes (EG) in synths.
- press the menu button
- press the amp button on the screen
- now the most important part of this section is the EG tab at the button of the screen, here you can sculp your sound like behaving as a pad or for instance a lead or bass sound. So Press the EG tab
- in this tab you can set the ADSR parameters (Attack, Decay, Sustain and Release) of a sound.
- For pads set the value 99 in the level area to 0, then you can sculp your pad in the time area, for instance Attack 77 and release 60 (the rest stays at 0), play something and you will hear a Saw Pad sound
- now change this same sound to a more trancy lead sound
- at the levels area: set Start to 0 - Attack to 99 - Break to 0 and Sustain to 0
- at the time area: set attack to 0 - Decay to 32 - Slope to 0 and Release to 0 , play something and you will hear a saw short lead sound instead of a pad.
Now the last part: add effects
- press the menu button
- press the effects button on the screen
- press the Master FX 1 dropdownlist to select a FX
- select: DEL stereo BPM delay and press the OFF button behind it on the screen to ON
- play something and you will hear a delayed trancy kind of lead
- press the exit button to return to your previous screen
- When you look at the Master MFX1 section you will see now the Del Stereo BPM delay and below that you will see the word: W/D 50/50 , select that and change the wet/dry level to your liking
- at the left you see a knob called Send 1, this determines how much of the original signal goes to that effect
the DO NOT FORGET part: Saving the sound
- press the right top menu button on your screen and select write sound
- give it a name and then you have created your first sound in the Korg PA
DONE!
Now the only thing left is your imagination, this is the most important skill a sound designer has to have. Every sound designer has it's own style. I recognise most of the sound designers just by listening to their work and this is a very important thing to develop yourself over the years. But all sounds on the korg pa series are based on the steps mentioned above. Now this was just one Oscillator, you can easely add another oscillator to add more possibilities to your sound by increasing the first step (number of oscs) to 2. Then you can for instance add a Marimba hit to your lead sound. And if you need another osc, just add the number 3, now you can create a sound that consist of three oscillators (samples) with their own behavior. The possibilities are huge then.
hope this helps a little to get you started creating your own sounds.
The above starters guide is of course a really basic start, there is lots and lots more possible then the things above, but my advise, just start with the things above mentioned. Everyone that develops sounds started with this. The more advanced things can come much later once you understand how to do this.
Thanks for that could you apply the same principle to the factory sounds _________________ Gem Wk4, Technics Kn5000, Solton Ms60, Yamaha Psr K1, Korg Pa50sd, Tyros 4, Korg Pa700
I think it might inspire pa1000 and pa700 owners to go an create there own sound sets if they have knowledge on how to edit the sounds etc.
No need to physically recreate Qui great work.
This is where the korg edx engine shines...
It blows away the competitor(yamaha) in this department (and qui is proof of that)
I hope in the future korg will expand this engine.. by adding things like virtual analogue oscilators... a huge bank of filters... more advanced DSP... FM... and much much more(think kontakt programming) if you can see the engine as semi modular with different building blocks... then it has a long lifespan ahead of it...
I agree, although the current synth engine is rather basic, it offers more then enough possibilities to create lots of great sounds.
VA oscs would be nice and would give more possibilties for sound design, but it's not really needed because there are quite some samples like SAW, SQUARE, TRIANGLE, etc already available, and with some tricks you can also modify those to your liking. One thing that i really miss is the maximum rate for things like LFO (the same applies to the Max Rate setting for the Effects like chorus).
The rate of Lfo's is especially important for current days EDM sounds. I'm building a Pa4x EDM dance sounds library at the moment inspired by the sounds used in the Armin van Buuren State of Trance shows. And most of the sounds i can create just by using the SAW, SQUARE, SINE, TRIANGLE sample, but there are a few sounds that aren't possible simply because the Maximum LFO rate is to slow. So i'm still puzzling how to solve that with other tricks. But the sounds that are ready sounds really convincing and are on par with my Virus TI and Sylenth 1 sounds.
Well i guess if you want a higher rate lfo, you enter the territority of FM..
So far it seems that the italian development team is a bit comservative... but things might change if the pa5x has a lot more processor power...
I guess we will have to wait another year or so before we know.. _________________ Korg Kronos 2/88 , Genos, Mainstage3 +VSTsu, ipad pro, GSi Gemini, Roland Integra 7, Jupiter Xm, Yamaha motif XS rack, Ketron SD90.
www.keyszone.boards.net
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