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Kronos input routing for monitoring

 
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Rskeys
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Joined: 26 Sep 2011
Posts: 124

PostPosted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 11:26 pm    Post subject: Kronos input routing for monitoring Reply with quote

Hello everyone.

Is it possible to route Kronos inputs 1 or 2 exclusively to headphones?

I’m wondering if this would be possible for establishing a personal in ear mix, I would route all my Kronos sounds to the stage mixer via outs 1 to 4 and leave l/r and headphones available just for me, I would only ask the tech for other band members mix via input 1 or 2. In my mind this would allow me to adjust personal mix in the Kronos even being able to dedicate one of the knobs to the band signal and the master for the headphones (or in ears).

Can this be made?? If it can am I limiting access to MFX due to using outs 1 to 4 instead of l/r?

Thank you for the help.
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LZ
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Joined: 02 May 2007
Posts: 572
Location: St. Louis, MO

PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The headphones are tied to L/R (main) outputs. Yes you can route inputs 1&2 to L/R.
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Xenophile
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Joined: 14 Nov 2017
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am interested in this as a monitoring solution, too.
At the very least, you will need to ensure that all the programs/combis that you use are routed to the desired outputs 1-4. If you inadvertently switch to one of the factory programs/combis, you'll be hearing it in your monitors but sending nothing to the house.

Have to look back into the manuals to find out if MFX are hardwired to L/R outputs, or if they can be re-routed to 1-4.
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LZ
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Location: St. Louis, MO

PostPosted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Depending on how you're intending to set this up, the problem will be that you can't send a sound out Aux 1-4 AND L/R at the same time, so in order to monitor your keyboards, FOH will need to also send your keys mix back to you through the monitor send coming in to inputs 1&2. If that's the case, I'm missing what the advantage is of running it through the Kronos. It it basically just to use the Kronos as a headphone amp? Seems like a lot of trouble rerouting the outputs of all of your programs just for that.
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Gunnar
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Joined: 27 Jan 2016
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Location: Norway

PostPosted: Sun Aug 05, 2018 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rskeys wrote:
Is it possible to route Kronos inputs 1 or 2 exclusively to headphones?


Yes, you can. Under the "Play / Audio In/Sampling" tab, you can route the Inputs any which way you want.

The problem, as Xenophile says, is that you cannot do this globally, any solution you set up will be limited to the PROG / COMBI you implement this solution for. If you have a few stock sounds, that might be ok, if you're using a lot of factory presets, it will quickly get unmanageable.

Rskeys wrote:
Can this be made?? If it can am I limiting access to MFX due to using outs 1 to 4 instead of l/r?


Indeed this is correct, you can do it, but you won't be able to use MFXs or TFXs for your sounds, which limits a few functions on the Kronos, like the FX sends.

I'll describe the steps below though, just in case.

LZ wrote:
Depending on how you're intending to set this up, the problem will be that you can't send a sound out Aux 1-4 AND L/R at the same time


The Kronos is a versatile beast, and this is in fact possible Smile

I first thought this was impossible too, but you can duplicate 2 separate signal chains by using the FX Control 1 & 2 busses combined with a Stereo Limiter IFX.

You set it up like this. In a COMBI, say you have I-A000 KRONOS German Grand on Timbre 01 and you want some O-Verb on that, and you want the output to go to both L/R and 1/2.

1. Under "IFX / Routing1", route Timbre 1 to IFX1.
2. Under "IFX / Insert FX", set IFX1 to "on" and pick "100: O-verb".

At this point, you have a piano sounding with reverb, not relying on any MFX or TFX. You've probably done this dosens of times, so lets move on to replicating that signal on a separate bus.

3. For the IFX1 strip, set "Bus Sel." to "1/2"

Now the signal for the piano+reverb is routed to the 1/2 outputs instead of L/R.

4. for the IFX1 strip, set "Ctrl Bus" to "1".
5. set the IFX12 strip to "on" and pick "005: Stereo Limiter"
6. switch to the page "IFX / IFX 1-12" and pick the "IFX12" tab.
7. Set "Source" under "Envelope" to "FX Control 1"
8. Check the "Side Chain Monitor" checkbox.

What you've done now is to, in addition to sending the piano+reverb signal to L&R, also sent it to the FX Control Bus 1. In the IFX12 slot, the limiter picks that signal up and because you can preview the control signal with the side chain monitor, you end up with a replica of the original signal. And because this signal's "Bus Sel." is unchanged, it will go to L/R.

Now, you want to have volume control on this signal to control your own personal mix?

9. Under "Output", set "Wet/Dry" to "50:50"
10. and "Source" to "Knob Mod.8"
11. and "Amount" to +50.

Now you'll be initialized at 50% volume going to L/R and RT 8 controls your levels from 0-100%.

At this point, if you want more sounds going to both, just route them to the "FX Control Bus 1". If you need another set of sounds going to Output 3/4 just send to that bus and also FX Control 1, and you should be in good shape.

Finally, you wanted to also control the volume of the signal coming in from the Inputs. We again solve this with a limiter.

12. Go back to the page "IFX / Insert FX"
13. Set IFX11 to "on" and pick "005: Stereo Limiter"
14. Go to the page page "IFX / IFX 1-12" and pick IFX11
15. Set "Ratio" to "1:1" and "Gain" to "-Inf"
16. Under "Output" set "Dry/wet" to "50:50", "Source" to "Knob Mod.7" and "Amount" to "-50".
17. Then under the page "Play / Audio In/Sampling", uncheck "Use Global Setting"
18. For both Input 1 and Input 2, set "Bus Select" to "IFX11".

Now, you should have routed inputs 1&2 to the IFX11 channel, which has a limiter on it to control its volume. The limiter uses the -inf gain to cut all volume. RT Knob 7 is then used to turn off the limiter, which brings back the original signal.



--

Quite lengthy this one Smile

TBH, you might be better off using an external mixer as that keeps the Kronos free to do its thing and you are in full control of the wiring. If you decide to with this setup, you could do it once, and then copy that COMBI around and just modify the PROGs it uses, thus creating a template that you keep replicating for all your sounds. Or stick all your sounds into a single combi and switch sounds using the Play/Mute buttons. Depends on what you intend to play, I suppose..

Anyway, good luck! Smile
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Sweat
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Joined: 17 Dec 2011
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Location: Live Music Capital of the World

PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gunnar, this is such an excellent explanation for those of us willing to implement it.

Your warnings of complexity are also well noted, helping to decide if the solution is even worthwhile.
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