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Kronos - disappointment...
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Liviou2004
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Joined: 20 Feb 2017
Posts: 430
Location: Fontainebleau - France

PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SeedyLee wrote:
Another little trick you can use to get around limitations with polyphony is resembling - that is, sample the sound you want and convert it to a HD1 program. That will significantly free up processing power at the expense of memory and SSD. Because the Kronos supports streaming from the SSD, it’s usually not even necesasary to loop the samples.

Downsides are that the resampled version won’t necessarily respond to tempo changes and you won’t have as much real-time control over the sound, plus it takes a little bit of work to setup. But within an hour you should be able to have a very good result.


Yes. In SEQ mode you can even sample certain parts of a song, for example all rythmic parts, save it in WAV file, import it as audio tracks in a new song. Doing that you free many polyphony voices.
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GregC
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Joined: 15 May 2002
Posts: 7040
Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)

PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Liviou2004 wrote:
SeedyLee wrote:
Another little trick you can use to get around limitations with polyphony is resembling - that is, sample the sound you want and convert it to a HD1 program. That will significantly free up processing power at the expense of memory and SSD. Because the Kronos supports streaming from the SSD, it’s usually not even necesasary to loop the samples.

Downsides are that the resampled version won’t necessarily respond to tempo changes and you won’t have as much real-time control over the sound, plus it takes a little bit of work to setup. But within an hour you should be able to have a very good result.


Yes. In SEQ mode you can even sample certain parts of a song, for example all rythmic parts, save it in WAV file, import it as audio tracks in a new song. Doing that you free many polyphony voices.


Converting midi tracks to an audio WAV is a useful workaround. I have done it to solve polyphony problems in SEQ recordings.

This is cumbersome from a Song creation workflow viewpoint- adds 12 extra steps. I think other creative artists are similar to me- in that we like a smooth work flow. This is why I like using up to 16 midi channels on the K's SEQ.

I am not complaining or expecting perfection. Just pointing out the priorities of a song writer who frequently records multiple tracks in an original.
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Liviou2004
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Joined: 20 Feb 2017
Posts: 430
Location: Fontainebleau - France

PostPosted: Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GregC wrote:
Liviou2004 wrote:
SeedyLee wrote:
Another little trick you can use to get around limitations with polyphony is resembling - that is, sample the sound you want and convert it to a HD1 program. That will significantly free up processing power at the expense of memory and SSD. Because the Kronos supports streaming from the SSD, it’s usually not even necesasary to loop the samples.

Downsides are that the resampled version won’t necessarily respond to tempo changes and you won’t have as much real-time control over the sound, plus it takes a little bit of work to setup. But within an hour you should be able to have a very good result.


Yes. In SEQ mode you can even sample certain parts of a song, for example all rythmic parts, save it in WAV file, import it as audio tracks in a new song. Doing that you free many polyphony voices.


Converting midi tracks to an audio WAV is a useful workaround. I have done it to solve polyphony problems in SEQ recordings.

This is cumbersome from a Song creation workflow viewpoint- adds 12 extra steps. I think other creative artists are similar to me- in that we like a smooth work flow. This is why I like using up to 16 midi channels on the K's SEQ.

I am not complaining or expecting perfection. Just pointing out the priorities of a song writer who frequently records multiple tracks in an original.


Yes Greg, I can understand that. This kind of workflow is far less intuitive and can dampen creativity.
But this example showed that despite its limitations, the Kronos has such a versatility that we can often find a way to solve many of them.
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Poseidon



Joined: 08 Jul 2018
Posts: 43

PostPosted: Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:09 am    Post subject: Re: Kronos - disappointment... Reply with quote

danmusician wrote:

Poseidon wrote:
4. Both D2500 and D2700 have 2 cores, but D2700 offers 2 extra Hyper-Threading threads. Would that lead to even better boost then 2 voices ? it's up to kernel.


I don't believe the OS is written to take advantage of this.


As I said - it's up to kernel. The Kronos Kernel has been compiled for 2 treads only ( -j2 ). To take advantage of 2 additional treads, the option flag should be -j4.
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jeremykeys
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Joined: 19 Jun 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've got an ok'd original k73 and rarely these days run into note steeling. I think though that is because now when I make a combi I think about where across the keyboard I need those particular sounds. So I do a lot of splits and layers. I think I may have also just taught myself to play Ina way that saves notes. I know that may sound strange but say for example playing an orchestral combi. I've built some where I've added strings or changed some sounds. I try not to make a sound that is too dense. I've found that some sounds just don't cut through the mix and that led me to the realization that if you can't hear it, you don't need it. If I'm not mistaken there is some acoustic law of 6 decibels but I could be wrong on the number there.
The thing is, even if you are playing it, if it's not loud enough, you won't hear it in a dense mix.
Now I obviously do recognize that this may not apply to what you may be trying to accomplish and with judicious panning you can circumvent this acoustic rule.
The thing is to me though, if you have note steeling, maybe you might have just too many things going on.
No offence meant to anybody here. It's just what I've found.
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GregC
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Joined: 15 May 2002
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Location: Discovery Bay (San Francisco Bay Area)

PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="jeremykeysa way that saves notes. I know that may sound strange but say for example playing an orchestral combi. I've built some where I've added strings or changed some sounds. I try not to make a sound that is too dense. I've found that some sounds just don't cut through the mix and that led me to the realization that if you can't hear it, you don't need it. If I'm not mistaken there is some acoustic law of 6 decibels but I could be wrong on the number there.
The thing is, even if you are playing it, if it's not loud enough, you won't hear it in a dense mix.
Now I obviously do recognize that this may not apply to what you may be trying .[/quote]

Which is why context is important. For live gigs or rehearsals, lets take orchestral combis as an example. The "large " orchestras are not as likely to be used- they have lots of detail and take up to 12 or more midi channels.

And the details would get lost in the rock band mix.

Recording is much different- I need the details of the large orchestra combi for a song. And I would add an AP, drawbar organ, MOD-7, ambient drums, E guitar with heavy FX. And Karma as much as possible. Thats the way I write originals- hybrid and using all 16 midi channels-most of the time.

So lots of note stealing and poof click goes polyphony. When you use multiple instruments with the great Kronos FX, then polyphony is a big deal.
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