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Best budget keyboard Synths? Help!
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80snostalgia



Joined: 30 Dec 2018
Posts: 9

PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2019 1:34 pm    Post subject: Best budget keyboard Synths? Help! Reply with quote

Hi all!

Well thanks for all your help for letting me know what fantastic Synths are out there, especially on a budget.
I've always loved 80s music but a certain Theme tune ignited my love for Synths in the late 1980's.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Hq0mAxTckBE

I've got a Korg Microkey 25 and Novation Remote 25 Mk2, which I'll be selling this year.

So I'm either gonna start collecting of make a firm decision on one of these Synths...

1. Yamaha ReFace DX
2. Mininova
3. MiniAk
4. Roland JDxi
5. Korgmicro Korg-S

I'd love to hear from anyone who has bad or good reviews on any of these Synths, and what you like about them. I'm always keen to know the pros and cons of stuff!
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Sharp
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Funny enough I've never used any of those. Other than the Yamaha ReFace you mention, none of the others would give me any 80's vibe.

To me the sounds of the 80's is the DX-7, D-50, M1, and the Emulator 1, 2 or 3.

That being said, I bought one of the Roland boutique series keyboards, the D-05 which was an excellent addition to my setup.

It's preloaded with the Roland D50 factory sounds, and lots more new sounds. But I think the best thing about the D-05 is it's ability to load D50 SysEx files directly because there's tons of them online that are entire “Famous” banks of famous 80's sounds recreated.

A Reface would cover your FM needs. KORG's iPad M1 App is a complete M and T Series lineup and expansion cards. EMU 1, 2 and 3 libraries can be downloaded and converted to any format.

Regards
Sharp
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2019 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The microkorg and similar in the list make excellent virtual analogue sounds (VA).
Stand alone analogues were mainly 70s synths, but were continued to be used heavily and still associated with 80s, from John Carpenter to Acid house and techno.

I already cast my vote in the other thread..MiniAk :)
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megamarkd
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The synth in the video is an SCI Prophet 5 and the sequencer is the one I suggested you find in the other thread, an MC500, LOL. They were the pro sequencer back in their day. I remember when they changed the Doctor Who theme in about '88 or so and discussing the change with friends at school, we all noted the massive difference that the (obviously) digital synth brought to the sound of the music. Until seeing that video, I never actually knew which synth was used for that iteration of the theme.

The M1 was '88 but contained so many of the sounds out of the earlier Korg synths like the DW8000 and the Poly800 that it does feel to me like I'm listening to an M1 when I'm listening to pop music from the early and mid-80's.
I'd add that the Juno's were back bone of the 80's pop-band polysynth sound for a good amount of it. Way cheaper than the Oberheim and SCI's polys, they ended up in many pop-songs from that decade. It seemed as though if you were a serious synth player in the 80's, you had either the DX7 or a Juno 60, if could afford them. Although cheaper than the American synths, they still cost as much as a cheap motorcycle, so if you weren't making enough money to get the Yammy or the Roland, there was always the Korg option Wink

History lesson over with, I like the sound of the mircoKorg and the Mininova. Of course the Korg synth is going to do the ancient Korg sounds super-well, the Mininova still doesn't do that badly at them either. And then they both do a great job at doing Juno sounds. I've not played a MiniAK so can't comment on it's ability to sound like the 80's. I'd guess it would do a good Roland or Korg emulation as they are subtractive synths and essentially any VA synth can do what in spades.
From what I've read about the Roland JDxi is it's the spiritual successor to the Juno range and has a bunch of new stuff on it too (like one would hope it did). Again I've not played one so can't really comment on it.

What is always a hard one to do, though, is the DX7, with even Yamaha having a hard time at redoing their 80's flagship. Although when I say Yamaha can't quite get it right, I am repeating the words of owners of the original, I think they've done pretty well at making a clone of their most famous synth when I gave it whirl in the store. And considering the DX7 was a preset box for the most part, it's not like missing a few of the elements (that only a programmer who's owned an original will miss) is going to make that a deal breaker. If it sounds like original then it's as good as the original. I think the only difference really is the ReFace has minikeys (which you are already used to) and it has four operators not six like the DX7 had (the programmer's complaint). Oh yeah and the note looper on it wasn't on the original.

I hate to say this after all of my opinion slinging above, but if you live in a city, go to an decent instrument shop and have bash on their display models. It's the way to go if you really want to know which one will have what you're after. Remember that a keyboard synth is not about sound alone, you need to like playing it. No fun if the synth beautiful sounding but it's keyboard is horrible to play. I know that you'll end up with a sales person try to make you buy one there and then, but if you turn up the headphones then maybe you can just drown out their "oh we have this one over here that is twice as much as your budget, but just come over and have a listen...."
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Stuff I'm using: Umm right now, well there's a Volca Drum, a Micro Freak, an ADX-1, a Pulse, a Blofeld, a UNO Drum, KeyStep/Beatstep Pro/Keystep Pro (one of each), a Circuit, a LiveTrak L-12 and this nonsense: The Brief-case as it was about a bit over a year ago (the the complete ridiculous GAS monster collection here)and here
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If talking about fun factor I can vouch for the microkorg (original design) and would argue this over the xl.
It has mini keys but they ain't bad and the arp is a total blast. Possibly one of the best I've played, so interactive with its 8 lite steps for on/off patterns. That's why I'd prefer it to xl. The sound is all programmable from the front dead easy and you can't complain with its sound.
If I was critical about the sound I noticed the presets rely heavily on eq and built in fx to sound good, but layering two sounds is fun and easy.
My MiniAk is truly superior though, needing only it's pair of most excellent filters to sound good.It's a brilliant synth engine, combined with excellent performance front end and multi layered sequencer business that's fun to put together (although programming the step sequencer sucks- just record live, then quantize or not).
Vocoder superior to microkorg by miles.


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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you want an fm expander aswell you could do a lot worse than buying a Volca fm. Amazing little box of dx7 goodiness to go along side the kb.
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megamarkd
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 2:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spheric El wrote:
If talking about fun factor I can vouch for the microkorg (original design) and would argue this over the xl.
It has mini keys but they ain't bad and the arp is a total blast. Possibly one of the best I've played, so interactive with its 8 lite steps for on/off patterns. That's why I'd prefer it to xl. The sound is all programmable from the front dead easy and you can't complain with its sound.
If I was critical about the sound I noticed the presets rely heavily on eq and built in fx to sound good, but layering two sounds is fun and easy.
My MiniAk is truly superior though, needing only it's pair of most excellent filters to sound good.It's a brilliant synth engine, combined with excellent performance front end and multi layered sequencer business that's fun to put together (although programming the step sequencer sucks- just record live, then quantize or not).
Vocoder superior to microkorg by miles.


I dunno why I keep forgetting about the KARP's. They do sound great. I've always argued too that if a synth has onboard effects, they are as much a part of the synthesising of the audio as the "traditional" synthesis blocks are. In the end, a complete synthesiser is a series of modules interconnected, so why shouldn't delay or chorus or distortion be in that signal path? DSI/Sequential have put distortion, delay and feedback in their signal path in plain sight (rumour has it that the Juno's all had a secret chorus on the output to give a fat sound but they didn't add frontface controls for it, but I dunno how true that is). The Karplus-Strong synthesis model works completely on delay and LP filter, so as far as I'm concerned, bring on the FX!

And the Micron, I mean the MiniAK. I looked it up and discovered that it's a dragon in sheep's clothing! (not just a wolf, Laughing ) Now if only I was not trying to not add any more keys to my increasingly over-crowded hoard! (why am I making fantasy beast analogies? I am a sci-fi guy now and gave away D&D decades ago! Wink )
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Stuff I'm using: Umm right now, well there's a Volca Drum, a Micro Freak, an ADX-1, a Pulse, a Blofeld, a UNO Drum, KeyStep/Beatstep Pro/Keystep Pro (one of each), a Circuit, a LiveTrak L-12 and this nonsense: The Brief-case as it was about a bit over a year ago (the the complete ridiculous GAS monster collection here)and here


Last edited by megamarkd on Tue Jan 08, 2019 8:39 am; edited 1 time in total
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

:lol: haha yes D&D!
Use to work in a games shop (but that's another thread) :)
Yes love the deep engine and sound of the MiniAk.
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megamarkd
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spheric El wrote:
Laughing haha yes D&D!
Use to work in a games shop (but that's another thread) Smile
Yes love the deep engine and sound of the MiniAk.

Heheh, I knew we must have more in common than making odd noise with electronic instruments!

Is the MiniAK like making ships in bottles though? Can it be addressed with CC's for a little bit more access by using a MIDI knobbox? Is saying knobbox like saying two double-entendres in one?
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Stuff I'm using: Umm right now, well there's a Volca Drum, a Micro Freak, an ADX-1, a Pulse, a Blofeld, a UNO Drum, KeyStep/Beatstep Pro/Keystep Pro (one of each), a Circuit, a LiveTrak L-12 and this nonsense: The Brief-case as it was about a bit over a year ago (the the complete ridiculous GAS monster collection here)and here
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It has a brilliant keyboard shortcut system for editing the synth. So hold edit then hit C3 for envelope 1, hit again for envelope 2 or hit D3 for filter 1 etc.
Still using one knob for all edits keyhole style though.

It does have 12 virtual patch points which can be sourced from CCs (with destinations for nearly everything!) and an iOS program called midi designer (it's driven by rnpn's or whatever they are).
The 6 performance controls (3 wheels, 3 easy assign encoders) keep it fun.

And stacking synth programmes and patterns is easy with simple copying synth sound to sequence program with one button press etc. It's well thought out. Live phrase recording easy too.

It's certainly not the microkorg-s with regards to parameter access, but is better than the microkorg xl or mininova. The sound is the best VA I've heard with a sharp and clear analogue sound that is honest and like synths of yesteryear, making the original microkorg korg start to feel a bit thin, while the xl and mininova, to me from what I've heard in the shops, have presets relying on distortion to fizz the sound up to a modern vibe.

Having said that there certainly is nothing wrong with the original microkorg sound (or the S) these are honest analogue sounds too,just not as full and rich as the MiniAk when along side.
Combined with a much more capable synth engine, full size keys and two mod wheels (in not much more of a footprint) plus multi timbral sequencer, I use my MiniAk over my microkorg.

To the original post I'd say if simplicity is important go for the microkorg, but if you're half capable of grasping technical information, don't be put off from the MiniAk.
You may also pick one up cheaper.
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2019 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Again though, I spoke to someone on line that hated the MiniAk and had to sell it.
I say this to balance my view.

I think all the synths you've listed would make me happy.
Although I'd seriously go for a korg Volca FM over the Reface and buy one of the other keyboards to "play".
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megamarkd
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hmm, I've had the MS2000 on my gas list for about 19yrs and was thinking of getting a microKorg instead as it's the same machine in a different wrapper (not knob-per-function though). But then I remember the Micron from when it was released and how the only fault I could find with it was the lack of interface. The MiniAK is a clone with a better interface from what I can tell.....NRPN's though, hmmmm, time to read the manual I guess.
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Stuff I'm using: Umm right now, well there's a Volca Drum, a Micro Freak, an ADX-1, a Pulse, a Blofeld, a UNO Drum, KeyStep/Beatstep Pro/Keystep Pro (one of each), a Circuit, a LiveTrak L-12 and this nonsense: The Brief-case as it was about a bit over a year ago (the the complete ridiculous GAS monster collection here)and here
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

NRPN -that's it!
Yes, it's a tough call between the two.
The audio processing external sounds and vocoder well better on the Akai, plus the synth engine is excellent.
The interface is good too though.
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OpAmp
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

The Akai MiniAK interface has a better interface than the Micron in the sense that the buttons are larger, better laid out, wheels instead of sliders. Maybe the keys are larger? But ... that's it. It is a one to one copy of the Micron from interface functionality point of view. No extra buttons or easy reachable knobs.

Personally I like my mKXL better than the MiniAK soundwise and interfacewise.

The synth engine of MiniAK is more complex/advanced, but shows a less linear programming response to my feeling. I better feel what parameter to tweak to get a certain effect on the XL than on the MiniAk. The MiniAK comes also with the functionality of the multis, rythms and sequences. That is really amazing to have these packed in such a 'small box'! Is it a synth or a workstation? Smile

Interfacewise because of the XL comes with the excellent editor/librarian for programming. I know similar ones exist for the MiniAk. But they are basically editors for Alesis ?? (not the micron). They typically lack the possibilties to edit the multis, rythms and sequences.

I got my MiniAK second hand and from day one it had this noisy volume pot. That is a pitty because the levels of the factory programs tend to vary very much (overdriven output). So you need to tweak up or down often when switching between programs, but that comes then with the noisy pot... Aargh.

Bye
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Spheric El
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your input is, as always, very much appreciated OpAmp.
About the micron comparison - does it contain the excellent keyboard shortcuts for editing synth engine of the MiniAk?
(I find them so useful).
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