Korg Forums

[RST]

Does anyone have any experience using midi and another keyboard to effectively turn a 73 note keyboard into a 140+ note keyboard? I use combination mode in most of my live performances with 3 to 4 zones. Keys organ brass etc. What I want to do is basically set the top C as center C and have more range for my split zones. As it stands now the other keyboard just plays the same notes as the master.

[voip]

As an example, the Korg Kontrol49 MIDI keyboard has a +/-3 octave shift, so effectively covers a range of 10 octaves (120 semitones). Its standard range is C2 to C6, so the shift will take the lowest possible note to C-1 and highest possible note to C9. MIDI only allows note numbers from 0-127 (C-1 to G9), so a 140+ note keyboard is not possible, without some further shifting. The Roland A-88 has an octave shift of -4 and +5, taking the possible range beyond 128 semitones. Not sure how the A-88 and target instruments cope with that.

Bear in mind that the Kronos chord pads are normally mapped C-1 to G-1, putting one constraint on what can be done.

The Kronos can be shifted -2 and +2 octaves.

Probably better to have the Kronos and external keyboards on different MIDI channels.

[KK]

[19naia]

What voip says covers the details, and important to know that number of available midi notes is the real limit.
1-127 notes may be the limit, but that is only per midi channel.
The 1-127 notes can be zoned into sections on one midi channel on one keyboard and then zoned into different sections on another midi channel for the other keyboard.
And each sound behind a zone can then have octave shift settings if you need the regular ascending order of octaves. But you will face the limits of the octave shift range.
I would push the octave or pitch shift to the limit and then see if detuning can push it a little farther, for finding the absolute limit of the highest note and lowest note.

If 140 different pitches are not needed, i think you can have zones that cover up to 140 independent keys, if you use more than one midi channel.
A midi note can have an assignment in 16 different midi channels and that makes the note not interfere with itself across 16 different keyboards being played. You only have two instances or two keyboards for the same set of midi notes, so at least two midi channels should do.

Octave zones already used in one keyboard, can be reused and pitch shifted on the other keyboard without interference from the other, as long as each keyboard uses its own midi channel.

If the second keboard has pitch or octave shifting, try that to see if it helps, and good to test to see how far the shifting goes on the other keyboard.
You may get lucky and find using the octave shifting on both devices gets you extra range via combined result of the two.
Kronos will let you assign zones and programs in timbres that can be set to a midi channel other than kronos global channel. You set the other keyboard to the other channel so that it plays only those timbre, and of course kronos will not play those timbres.
You may also end up needing Karma midi I/O to handle the other midi channel if it is playing internal Kronos programs. You may end up using up to 4 midi channels via karma midi I/O, but Karma also does zoning within Karma.
If you use zoning, you can make one Karma midi I/O channel work just like zoning makes one global channel work for any basic split combi.

I think there is another way to make 140 notes work between the two keyboards. Also using Karma.

Karma does have also a midi note mapping feature and that may be able to solve octave and pitch shift limitations. Note mapping lets you take any note number and have it play out of any key. No range limtation within the note map. The note map itself is the limit. If the note map shows a grid of 88x88, then 88 notes is the note shift limit. Note 1 can play out of key 88 and note 88 can play out of key 1. No distance/interval too small or too large to bridge in note mapping.
If the note map shows a grid of 127x127, then 127 notes is the limit.
Also worth testing to see if note mapping will exceed its own limits with pitch shift and detune settings added to the setup in the timbre program.
So you remap notes to play higher or lower on the register and then you apply pitch shift and/or detune after that to see if that stretches the pitch shift limitations reached when using one or the other alone.

Wow.... I think Kronos just may have ways of undoing itself,
but so far -all this needs to be tried before being sure it works for your needs.
I am coming from the approach “if it were possible, these are the things i would consider in the search for it being possible”.
Not a guarantee of a solution here, but a confident point in the right direction for a worthwhile search for an answer.

[Sharp]

As already pointed out, your limited to 127 notes.

A device such as this Event Processor will allow you to transpose all incoming signals from the external keyboard into the KRONOS.

http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm

This is a simple device that's powered directly from the MIDI Port and there's an editor on their website you use to program the box to do whatever you want it to do.

Regards
Sharp
_________________

[RST]

thank you all very insightful will try