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Kronos vs. Oasys (information only, no complaining/requests)
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Scott
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

danatkorg wrote:
The list being maintained in the first post of this thread is pretty good. The new sample management features are noteworthy as well, IMO.

New sample management features hasn't quite made it to the updated first post yet. Might you be able to summarize what these features are?
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maphill
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Scott (or anybody)

I'm not sure what the differences are. As soon as someone can clarify here, I'll add the info to the first post. I know the Kronos can do the following:

Quote:

No matter whether you're in Program, Combination, or Sequencer mode, you can always use KRONOS to sample an external audio source, or to resample the performance of the KRONOS itself. User samples can be edited using operations such as truncate, normalize, time stretch, or time slice. Edited samples can also be exported in AIFF or WAVE format. You can also load external samples in AIFF, WAVE, SoundFont 2.0, and AKAI S1000/3000 formats via USB memory. By loading samples that you've previously created on other instruments or on a PC, you can set up your music production system on the KRONOS – no additional equipment required.


...but I don't know how that is different from the OASYS, nor if that is what Dan was referring to.

Mark.
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

From what I remember, it's the features of the Open Sampling which should be similar on the Oasys... I think Wink

Phil
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Scott
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Kronos vs. Oasys (information only, no complaining/reque Reply with quote

maphill wrote:
KRONOS has current Korg support, OASYS support is closed down.

What does this mean?

And what is verified fact versus conjecture?

As far as I know, OASYS support is not closed down. I believe they will still respond to requests for technical support, and still service and provide parts for OASYS.

Perhaps you didn't mean "support" but were referring to ongoing development. But I don't think we know for a fact that there will be future development on the Kronos. I don't think Korg has promised any future enhancements or software updates... we should expect that it is what it is, and anything else that might happen would be a bonus. (As has been posted elsewhere, you should buy it for what it offers out of the box, not for any hope of what enhancements may or may not later be released for it, in order to avoid ODS... Oasys Disappointment Syndrome.)

It is true, however, that often initial releases of complex keyboards have bugs that are addressed in a software update, so I think at least that much is somewhat likely. Whether you see that as a Kronos advantage (that there will probably be a bug fix update) or disadvantage (there have already been bug fix updates for OASYS, and it is currently known to be pretty clean) is almost along the lines of asking whether a cup is half-empty or half-full.

Logically, I would say that since the Kronos is a beginning-of-life product and OASYS is an end-of-life product, the *likelihood* of more enhancements for the Kronos is better, but we really don't know whether there will ever be any.

For that matter, let's even assume that they come out with a nice enhancement for, say, the CX3 engine for the Kronos. If the engines are identical with the OASYS, it might be simple enough for them to make that enhancement available to OASYS users as well, no? In that case, not only don't we know for certain that there will be software enhancements for Kronos, we also don't know for certain that there will not be software updates for OASYS. We just don't know anything for sure. Except maybe that there won't be any upgrades of note for the OASYS that are not also available for the Kronos. That much, at least, seems reasonably certain!
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maphill
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Scott,

I see your points. However, I think most people will get the gist from the short description in the first post.

We can be certain there will not be any updates for OASYS. In particular, they have already confirmed that patches on the KRONOS will not be portable back to the OASYS. We know that the engines produce the same sound, but obviously the OS has been updated for the new hardware and features.

In particular, JerryK has said (years ago now) that they will fix "serious bugs" but that there will not be software development. I am unaware of anything Korg is likely to consider a "serious bug" on the OASYS.

It's reasonable to assume that they will not be diverting resources toward updating 3000 units that already work quite well.

Mark.
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Megakazbek
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Kronos vs. Oasys (information only, no complaining/reque Reply with quote

Scott wrote:
Perhaps you didn't mean "support" but were referring to ongoing development. But I don't think we know for a fact that there will be future development on the Kronos. I don't think Korg has promised any future enhancements or software updates...

Of course they won't officially promise any updates because they learned their lesson from OASYS and wouldn't give people any formal reasons to whine again. But I expect that there WILL be major updates for Kronos just as there were for M3 and OASYS.
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vEddY
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 7:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Kronos vs. Oasys (information only, no complaining/reque Reply with quote

Megakazbek wrote:

Of course they won't officially promise any updates because they learned their lesson from OASYS and wouldn't give people any formal reasons to whine again. But I expect that there WILL be major updates for Kronos just as there were for M3 and OASYS.

You know what - I don't want to sound pissy here but... your sentence makes the whole situation sound like KORG got hurt with their marketing bla-bla, promising-some-stuff-yet-never-delivering update policy, not users. As if OASYS buyers are "in the wrong" or "did something wrong". This isn't learning from mistakes - this is called "silently - albeit not openly - admitting them and making sure that they don't get THEMSELVES into the same situation again". You know, there's a huge difference.

They didn't get hurt in any way. Wether users did or not, that's entirely different matter.
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maphill
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 02, 2011 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Please use the KRONOS Feedback thread or one of the many threads OASYS for complaints about past development, etc.

This thread is for information only.

Thanks,
Mark.
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maphill
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I received my Kronos yesterday, so here are some additional comparisons I added to the first post.

- Many KRONOS buttons are smaller than their OASYS counterparts.
- KRONOS joystick is "shallower" and somewhat smaller
- KRONOS pitch/mod wheel has a round shaft, where the OASYS is rectangular

I have a question for those who have listened to both: While I know the engines are the same (of course Kronos has additional ones), I want to gauge how similar the Combis and Progs are. I went seeking for Combis I remember, but they seemed significantly different (but it has been since Februrary since I sold my O).

I have some recordings that I may reference tonight. And I know that, for example, the new piano is leveraged in combis. But can anyone comment on how much a given combi/prog is likely to have changed?

And if I load the Oasys version combi/prog, is that likely to bring the two closer together?

Thanks,
Mark
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Subpar
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2011 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Saw this in another thread, so thought I would post it here, as it may answer your question on Combi's.


StephenKay wrote:
Sina172 wrote:
The Combis in KRONOS are the most incredible and inspiration works of art that I have EVER heard. I FINALLY have a STARTING POINT I NEVER had with the OASYS. I literally HAD to start from scratch on the OASYS, because MOST of the Combis on the OASYS were cheesy as hell and I was ALWAYS in Program mode, sequencing tracks because of that!

Well, OK, but that's kinda interesting. AFAIK, there are 96 new combis on the Kronos, and the other 384 are exactly the same as they were on the OASYS. But if you like them better now, cool. Smile

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Michael Blue
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Owned an Oasys for a few years, played a Kronos a couple days ago at GC.

I can confirm, many of the same Programs/Combis exist in Kronos that were in Oasys, but the Karma for them has been significantly revised and is NOT the same.
If you were used to using Karma on a given patch, you will have to re-load the Oasys data into your Kronos to have it back. If you don't use/care about Karma, no harm no foul.
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StephenKay
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 6:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Michael Blue wrote:
Owned an Oasys for a few years, played a Kronos a couple days ago at GC.

I can confirm, many of the same Programs/Combis exist in Kronos that were in Oasys, but the Karma for them has been significantly revised and is NOT the same.
If you were used to using Karma on a given patch, you will have to re-load the Oasys data into your Kronos to have it back. If you don't use/care about Karma, no harm no foul.

Well, I don't know if I really want to get involved in this discussion, but the above comment is completely wrong, to my knowledge. The 384 Combis in the Kronos that were taken form the OASYS are *exactly* the same as they were. I'd like to see you demonstrate to me the difference between a Combi w/KARMA in the OASYS and the same Combi in the Kronos. Go ahead. Dozo, as they say in Japan...
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Michael Blue
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, obviously Stephen you would know better than me.
I could swear that the handful of Combis I used in my Oasys with Karma were totally different in the Kronos I played the other day in the store, but I submit to your knowledge.
Is there any way they could have been modified, since it was a floor model? I thought it would require your 3rd-party software for that?

*Edit, I bought my Oasys used as well, I suppose it's possible someone modified the Karma GEs in it before I got it? I dunno...

Either way, thanks for the clarification.
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Kevin Nolan
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 28, 2013 9:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

One difference could be with Combis karmafied to respond to keyboard velocity - since the Kronos uses a completely different keyboard, this could plausibly mean that the same user performance yields different results. Perhaps different aftertouch sensors too.

Similarly, with different faders, knobs and joysticks between the two, any mechanical inertia affecting a Karmafied performance could be noticed / felt by the performer

The screen size and resolution are also different, perhaps subconsiously affecting edits, realtime changes and visual feedback.

Another difference could also be available polyphony - with heavily layered combis on OASAY (and with heavy effects usage) yielding less polyphony compared to Kronos, potentially yielding different combi results (notes cut at different points).

Some of the EXis also have slightly different polyphony between the two instruments.

And - isn't MIDI PPQ resolution higher on the Kronos?
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