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Randelph
Platinum Member
Joined: 18 Oct 2008
Posts: 604
Location: San Francisco, CA
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 Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:11 pm Post subject: |
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Scott wrote:
| Quote: | | I think one advantage of the Kronos over a combination of soft synths will be the ease of use from a dedicated and consistent interface that is also designed to allow all the components to easily work together. |
That, and the ease of which you can record a combi containing any/all of the different engines very easily. And what about latency? Is that a non-issue these days with computers? I never hear talk of latency with hardware keyboards, and I always do with soft synths.
I too have the Nord Stage 88, and am also considering upgrading from it to the Kronos. It's got to be my favorite board of all time, I play it much more than any board I've ever had. And it has a big advantage over the Kronos: it's 40, not 50 pounds, and its 51" long compared to 57".
At 40 pounds (plus a rolling case), it's already at the upper limit of what I want to dead lift up flights of stairs; and 51" length for a full 88 notes is a beautiful thing. I just did a 5 week live theatre project, and the only way my placement worked in the theatre was 'cause it fit in the space; another 6 inches and I wouldn't have been able to do that gig. As a side benefit, it also fits in many 76 note gig bags!
The reason I'll probably upgrade to the Kronos is the pianos, eps and organs promise to be as inspiring as the Stage sounds, plus there's all the other sounds. I'm unhappy about the weight/length issue (why can't they put the damn wheels on top- the 88s are as long as aircraft carriers!), but to get the keyboard I've wanted for the last 25 years is worth a lot.
At first I was thinking the 61 note, for portability, but considering its got such great piano/eps onboard, it seems a shame to not go for the 73 or 88. I'll probably get the 73 for the shorter length/weight.
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Keyboards: Kawai ES920 / Casio CT-X5000
Instruments: Keys / Alto Recorder and Melodica
Last edited by Randelph on Sat Apr 16, 2011 8:23 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Scott
Platinum Member
Joined: 16 Oct 2009
Posts: 1015
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Randelph wrote: | | At first I was thinking the 61 note, for portability, but considering its got such great piano/eps onboard, it seems a shame to not go for the 73 or 88. I'll probably get the 73 for the shorter length/weight. |
Or get the Kronos 61 and pair it with your existing 88 (or even a cheaper, lighter one, if you want) in order to drive the pianos. Then you've got an 88 whose size and weight you can deal with AND all the Kronos sounds/features AND an additional unweighted board whose action will make playing organ much more satisfying. Just like you feel it's a shame to play the Kronos EPs from an unweighted action, it's also a shame to be playing the organ from Korg's weighted actions. |
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Sina172
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Joined: 29 May 2007
Posts: 1194
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Sina172 on Mon Feb 01, 2016 12:49 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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zahush76
Junior Member
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 98
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 5:31 pm Post subject: |
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| Sina172 wrote: | Soft Synths are a different story, because while some of them are simply amazing, if you don't have a good interface, it's pointless, IMO.
KRONOS has it all under ONE roof with a sound that you CAN NOT get with Soft Synths. Period.
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What this means is that eventually there will be a keyboard\workstation that will bring us omnisphere, trilian, reaktor, massive, gladiator etc - but in hardware, with immidiacy, integration and tweakability.
It's all a matter of time. The technology already exists. It will surely happen in the next couple of years.
The kronos is the best all in one solution right now. It's probably not going to stay that way... |
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synthguy
Platinum Member
Joined: 05 Jan 2005
Posts: 661
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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Some of us aren't that impressed with the wealth of soft synths out there. They all do something marvelous, but it depends on what you're doing, and if the sound pleases you. A good many of them seem very useful for certain styles of music, such as techno or industrial, but for emulating vintage synths, not so much.
Omnisphere is well named, because it's one unique soft synth which is good for almost anything from industrial to soundtrack or prog rock. Giga-libraries are very nice, especially the orchestral and grand piano sample libraries. Physical modeling synths are very good, and getting better by the day. And the vintage synth emulations are incredible, reducing the need for a real analog synth with its accompanying issues of reliability and care.
KRONOS is a key entry in the workstation lineage because it covers many of the above. It has giga-pianos that sound excellent. It has vintage synth emulation. It has physical modeling and a superb FM instrument. Plus, it has that KORG sound. I like the KORG sound, just like I do the Kurzweil, Yamaha and Roland sound. If I want this in a soft synth, I'll be hard pressed to accomplish that, and most likely can't.
I'm going to be building a music PC this year and tinkering with soft synths, mostly Arturia's vintage emulations and Omnisphere. But for the most part, my synths are going to be hardware guys, and I'm hoping the KRONOS is a huge part of that.
One day, soft synths have a good chance of taking a big chunk of the market, when sound quality, playability and latency are all dealt with. Until then, many of us are going to remain hardware guys. You can't get much more plug n play than a KRONOS. 
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ozy
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Sina172 wrote: | When I played the OASYS the first time, my jaws just dropped to the point where everything else just paled in comparison.
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| Sina172 wrote: | | When I brought it home, it was THE most joyful experience I have ever had |
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Sina172
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Joined: 29 May 2007
Posts: 1194
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| Posted: Sat Apr 16, 2011 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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Last edited by Sina172 on Mon Feb 01, 2016 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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zahush76
Junior Member
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 98
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| Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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Ok. Here's the deal.
I wanted the kronos and i also talked about the moog sound.
Since prices here in Israel are about 700$ higher than in the U.S. , i figured i might do what i usually do: i buy it from a U.S. store, have it sent to my sister in NY, and she brings it over here (that's the way i got almost all my gear).
For the money i would spend for a kronos 73 - i could get a kronos 61 and a moog slim phatty.
The catch?
My sister is coming to Israel on June the 6th.
Can i guarantee that the kronos will be shipped to her before that?
If not , i'd miss a great opportunity... |
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Randelph
Platinum Member
Joined: 18 Oct 2008
Posts: 604
Location: San Francisco, CA
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| Posted: Mon Apr 18, 2011 10:15 pm Post subject: |
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zahush76 wrote:
| Quote: | | Since prices here in Israel are about 700$ higher than in the U.S. , i figured i might do what i usually do: i buy it from a U.S. store, have it sent to my sister in NY, and she brings it over here (that's the way i got almost all my gear). |
hey- i believe the VAT on imports in Israel is 16%, which means that if you're prices are $700 more than the US, then the cost would be $3700 for the K61, and with the VAT of 16% ($592), the total would come to $4292.
If your sister bought it online from an out of state retailer, there would be no tax or shipping, and I believe most retailers would be giving at least a $200 discount even on the Kronos.
So if my prices are correct, for you it'd be the difference between $2,800 and $4,300. Of course if she declares it while going thru customs, the Israeli VAT would still be $448, making your total purchase cost $3,250.
Is this correct? Would the Israeli shops discount as well?
Randy
_________________
Keyboards: Kawai ES920 / Casio CT-X5000
Instruments: Keys / Alto Recorder and Melodica |
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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 1:51 am Post subject: |
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| Sina172 wrote: | | Sharp says it perfectly: Those that don't own an OASYS haven't a CLUE on how incredible it sounds. |
Umm, well, some of us who don't own an OASYS actually do have a clue. That's one reason - among others - why many people don't own an OASYS.
The first time I sat down at an OASYS and played through the HD1 sounds, I was underwhelmed. The guitars sucked. The brass sucked. The strings were great - Korg does strings well. And the 500mb pianos sucked too.
The STR guitars were interesting, but they didn't sound like guitars, and sure as hell didn't play like guitars. The CX-3 organs had no balls compared to NI's B4... not even close. The synths were ok as far as softsynths go, lots of hype about non-aliasing at the time, but certainly were not game-changers in terms of what was available in the field at the same time. And time has marched on beautifully in the softsynth world. OASYS boldly staked a spot in this fertile ground, at a hefty premium out-of-touch-with-reality price, and then simply stood there for years, virtually unchanged - apart from offering a few new apps... at an additional price, of course.
This same particular OASYS has been sitting in the same space in the same store for at least four years, and I have played with it for hours on end through many different monitors and headsets. It's surrounded by Nords and Kurzs and Yammies and Moogs and Accesses and Macs running every plug under the sun, and the list goes on.
I've compared them all extensively, in the same environment using the same monitors and headsets. I'm an old dog, but my hearing threshold tops out just shy of 18 Khz, so I can still appreciate the nuances to be heard.
The younger cats surely can as well.
I've seen the price of this particular OASYS drop by 500 bucks, then another, but guess what... nobody's bought it yet. This shop hasn't sold an OASYS yet. Same goes for Steve's Music in Toronto... they had one out for ages, and when I asked the manager how many he'd sold, he said "none".
Kronos brings this old tech "forward" at a more realistic price, judging by how many of you guys are chomping at the bit to get into the game that has been "changed".
The game's still the same - only the price is better, as are Kronos' pianos (supposedly).
But to suggest that one must own an OASYS to have a clue about how it sounds, well that's simply one man's opinion, well two men including you.
And unrealistic, in my opinion. |
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aron
Platinum Member
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 1548
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:40 am Post subject: |
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> It's surrounded by Nords and Kurzs and Yammies and Moogs and Accesses and Macs running every plug under the sun, and the list goes on.
What combo do you think gets the closest to the Kronos? Do any of the keyboards sound close?
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad. |
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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:40 am Post subject: |
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But in the spirit of the OP's question: "Do I need one?"
I can't answer that for him personally, but I do know that until I can spend some quality time with a Kronos myself, I am pretty sure that I don't need one |
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rrricky rrrecordo
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Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 2:45 am Post subject: |
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| aron wrote: | | What combo do you think gets the closest to the Kronos? Do any of the keyboards sound close? |
They all have their strengths and weaknesses. I like the Nords for their synths and organs, don't care for the Kurzweils, and still think the Mac is the best way forward for me.
One man's opinion though |
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zahush76
Junior Member
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 98
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 5:57 am Post subject: |
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| Randelph wrote: | zahush76 wrote:
| Quote: | | Since prices here in Israel are about 700$ higher than in the U.S. , i figured i might do what i usually do: i buy it from a U.S. store, have it sent to my sister in NY, and she brings it over here (that's the way i got almost all my gear). |
hey- i believe the VAT on imports in Israel is 16%, which means that if you're prices are $700 more than the US, then the cost would be $3700 for the K61, and with the VAT of 16% ($592), the total would come to $4292.
If your sister bought it online from an out of state retailer, there would be no tax or shipping, and I believe most retailers would be giving at least a $200 discount even on the Kronos.
So if my prices are correct, for you it'd be the difference between $2,800 and $4,300. Of course if she declares it while going thru customs, the Israeli VAT would still be $448, making your total purchase cost $3,250.
Is this correct? Would the Israeli shops discount as well?
Randy |
That's about correct, though when she brought the PolyEvolver she was asked to pay 70$, which is far far less than 16%.
That would give me the option to add the moog slim phatty - and still have some "spare change" for a karo ksl expansion.
But, like i said, the problem is - will it be shipped to her before the 6th of June? Is there an estimated arruval date for the kronos to the U.S.? And can someone promise there won't be any more delays? |
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synthguy
Platinum Member
Joined: 05 Jan 2005
Posts: 661
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| Posted: Tue Apr 19, 2011 10:28 am Post subject: |
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| rrricky rrrecordo wrote: | | aron wrote: | | What combo do you think gets the closest to the Kronos? Do any of the keyboards sound close? |
They all have their strengths and weaknesses. I like the Nords for their synths and organs, don't care for the Kurzweils, and still think the Mac is the best way forward for me. |
It definitely is. While I rather like the Nords, they're too bright for me. I much prefer a Virus or Radias (own both), or a real analog. XK3 for organ. And I obviously like Kurzweil because I own a K2000R and recently bought a PC3, and other than many acoustic samples sounding compressed, sounds fantastic, and its organ and Leslie are just great. And I like Yamaha too, but the new Motifs just cost too much for what they are.
And I really like KORG since the Triton emerged, replacing Roland as my fave single company, owning a KARMA, Radias and M3, and a Triton which I sold. The Motif rounds out the M3 nicely. But the KRONOS is as close to a must-have as the market has produced for me. Well, it is, one man's opinion.
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