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For those that still have some doubts (JP 80)
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RKfan
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 6:26 pm    Post subject: For those that still have some doubts (JP 80) Reply with quote

Just noticed at the back of Sound on Sound that they will be reviewing the Jupiter 80 in the August issue (due in the shops end July).

Those of you that might want more realistic horns and are intrigued by how the Jupiter 80 works (esp Supernatural) - might be worth a look.

Although I am pretty convinved that the Roland is not for me (really want a Kronos) its probably worth considering.
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billysynth1
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for that info, I've been waiting for the SOS JP80 review. I'll buy the pdf file when it comes out.

Vas
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ScoobyDoo555
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 24, 2011 9:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Feel free to share the wealth when you get it Laughing

Personally, the JP80 doesn't interest me at all - I've got a V-Synth XT and soon, a Kronos.

I don't like the look of the JP80, if I'm honest.

Will be interested to see how it tests though.
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RKfan
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:28 pm    Post subject: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

Review by Gordon Reid is in Sound on Sound on sale today.
Key comments

Quote:
Pros:
(1) Its a solid, robust performance synthe with a good keyboard and reassringly large, freindly controls
(2) It's a surprisingly powerful and capable VA synth
(3) It offers some excellent acoustic sounds
(4) It incorporates a useful audio player/recorder
(5) It's compatable with V-link and MIDI visual control
(6) It offers some unusual, performance-oriented features not found elsewhere

Cons:
(1) The programming architecture is not well explained
(2) The effects structure is not as flexible as one might hope
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds
(4) Its name. I fear that this will prove to be a handicap rather than a benefit
(5) Its price, which puts it at the top end of the stage keyboard market


Summary
I wish that Roland named this synthesizer the "Stage 80" or something similar, because it's a very capable performance keyboard offering some unusual features and some great sounds. But the 'Jupiter' name could be a millstone, creating all manner of preconceptions that have to be eliminated before potential users begin to appreciate it for what it is. In short; very interesting synthesizer, very poorly chosen name. If you're after a stage synth, check it out for the first reason, don't ignore it for the second.
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Chriskk
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 12:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A typical SoS review. Like the Kronos review, it's basically a more detailed brochure.
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michelkeijzers
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?
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Bruce Lychee
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 1:58 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

michelkeijzers wrote:
RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?


I'm not sure what he means by this, because unless I'm missing something, you can definitely edit sounds.
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michelkeijzers
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

Bruce Lychee wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?


I'm not sure what he means by this, because unless I'm missing something, you can definitely edit sounds.


You don't miss something, but there may be a difference between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds. Seems a bit strange to make a nonintuitive distiction between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds.
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Bruce Lychee
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

michelkeijzers wrote:
Bruce Lychee wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?


I'm not sure what he means by this, because unless I'm missing something, you can definitely edit sounds.


You don't miss something, but there may be a difference between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds. Seems a bit strange to make a nonintuitive distiction between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds.


As far as I can tell, every sound on the JP has the SN label and you can definitely edit the piano.
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Last edited by Bruce Lychee on Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:06 pm; edited 1 time in total
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michelkeijzers
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

Bruce Lychee wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
Bruce Lychee wrote:
michelkeijzers wrote:
RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?


I'm not sure what he means by this, because unless I'm missing something, you can definitely edit sounds.


You don't miss something, but there may be a difference between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds. Seems a bit strange to make a nonintuitive distiction between supernatural acoustic sounds and 'other' sounds.


As far as I can tell, every sound on the JP has the SN label.


What does SN label means? (I don't know much about Roland, forgive me)
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Bruce Lychee
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm reading the article now. When it comes to saving SN acoustic edits he is just saying that they can't be saved at the single "tone" level and used as building blocks. You save them at the set level.
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JPWC
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Who has doubts? My only reason for not getting the JP80 now is dept not doubt. The strummed Acoustic Guitar sounds great.

Luckly the Kronos is a major distraction from G.A.S.

So many synth Engines to learn, with small font screens, this could easily take me a year to learn.
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Zeroesque
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

michelkeijzers wrote:
What does SN label means? (I don't know much about Roland, forgive me)

I believe they are referencing Roland's "SuperNATURAL" sound technology.
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Shakil
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Sound on Sound review by Gordon Reid Reply with quote

michelkeijzers wrote:
RKfan wrote:
(3) There is no memory for saving edited Supernatureal Acoustic sounds


Does this mean it's a purely preset synth?


Sounds like a mistake, but this in true for ARX sounds on Fantom the ARX sounds are not saved with the songlike regular patches get saved. You get only 50 slots for custom ARX sounds for the whole project file.
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Bruce Lychee
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ok guys. I read the review and I have the JP80, so a few things.

1) You can edit all tones. It is just that with the SN acoustic tones, they can't be saved at what most people think of as the single "tone" level, then built into sets. You edit the acoustic sounds at the set (i.e. Kronos "combi") level and they get saved that way per set.

2) He seems a little unclear about what SuperNatural means and which tones are SN. My understanding is that all tones are SN on the Jupiter, but I will confirm that when I get back home tonight. As far as what SN means, I summarized the discussion I had with Scott Tibbs on another forum:

I asked Scott specifically about the SuperNatural term and what it meant. Depending on the sound it can mean different things. My interpretation of Scott's answer is that it means they have identified and incorporated the elements of a sound that make it natural. Achieving natural sound through synthesis is the core of Ikutaro Kakehashi's vision.

The original Jupiter and today's Jupiter were both designed with the goal of emulating acoustic sounds through synthesis. The original Jupiter had much less success at doing that, but it sounded great nonetheless and people stopped thinking about it as an emulator. The SuperNatural term reflects that original and persisting goal of recreating natural sounds through synthesis.

For any given sound, SN means they have captured the natural sound of the instrument by focusing on the key elements that they believe are critical to producing a natural sound. Almost all of it is achieved through modeling. Scott indicated only the attack had sample elements. In all cases no velocity switching seems to be highlighted. For piano no looping in the decay is also key.

For other acoustic sounds like the violin, trumpet, etc. SN is focusing more on the natural articulation of the instruments, as that is the element that brings a more natural sound to those voices. Having experience with the articulations in the V-synth, I was very interested in this area. They greatly expanded the articulations, and there is no doubt this element makes a huge difference in the ability to use those sounds in an expressive way.

Finally, with the SN synth sounds, it is also referring to the articulations that you can incorporate, but it is really just referring to how much more expressive the new synth engine is and the quality of the new sounds. I'm not sure if SN really makes sense with the synths, but I can confirm that the quality of the synth sounds on the Jupiter are amazing and the primary reason I bought it.

3) He summarizes the synth section details:

Each "tone" is made of 3 partials, each of which is it's own synth

Each partial has 8 oscillator types. 6 of those are analog types and have 3 variants each with programmable pulse width and PWM. The 7th is a Super Saw which also has prgrammable depth. The 8th allows you to choose from 380 PCMs.

Dedicated AD pitch envelope.
Ring modulator between partial 1 and 2.
Wave shaper that can act on any of the resulting sounds.
Multimode filter (low pass, high pass, band pass and peaking) with 12dB and 24dB oct. slopes.
2 LFOs, one for conventional duties and one dedicate to modulation joystick.
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