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jroujinsky · Joined: 16 Apr 2003 Posts: 28

Today I conducted side by side auditioning of Oasys and Kronos.
Both synths were connected to Tannoy reference monitors.
To compare the sound we have played number of combies and sounds that exist on both instruments.
Our observation is:
Oasys seems to have better sound than Kronos.
It produces more naturally sounding and full (especially in low frequencies) sound.
Kronos sounded more shifted to higher frequencies.

It will be very interesting to hear Korg people on that.
If the difference is caused by D2A converter - then there might be a way to get the sound via SPDIF and save the quality.
Otherwise the sound engine can cause the difference itself.

Regardless of the difference with Oasys, after week of playing the Kronos, I can only say that it sounds fantastic and keeps inspiring me again and again. I still did not listen even to 30% of sounds it has.
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Korg Kronos 61, Studiologic 88.
(Trinity, Karma, Triton Studio, M3 in the past).
www.soundclick.com/ambiento

McHale · Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 9:33 pm Post subject:

Oh, you must be Leo200's buddy.

FYI, hardware-wise, it's basically impossible for them to sound any different.
_________________
Current Korg Gear: KRONOS 88 (4GB), M50-73 (PS mod), RADIAS-73, Electribe MX, Triton Pro (MOSS, SCSI, CF, 64MB RAM), SQ-64, DVP-1, MEX-8000, MR-1, KAOSSilator, nanoKey, nanoKontrol, 3x nanoPad 2, 3x DS1H, 7x PS1, FC7 (yes Korg, NOT Yamaha).

Hanon_CTS · Full Member Joined: 14 Jun 2011 Posts: 249

Hello jroujinsky,

interesting observation.
What types "genres" of sounds and combis did you test?

Cheers, Hanon
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I used to play Korg instruments, then I took an arrow to the knee.

Synthesizedclapping · Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:21 pm Post subject:

Try and make the exact same patch (not preset) on ms-20 for both kronos and oasys and see what you get. It may just be the voicing team changed the combis around.
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Listening to Music too loud is like reading with the text an inch away from your face.

BasariStudios · Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 10:25 pm Post subject:

I had them side by side too, phisically is not possible for them to sound
different since from what i know they share the SAME EXACT hardware
but i might be wrong.
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jroujinsky · Joined: 16 Apr 2003 Posts: 28

I think we can do another test:
Record a wave file from a combi on both synth.
Thise should eliminate potential difference in DAC and amplificaiton.
_________________
Korg Kronos 61, Studiologic 88.
(Trinity, Karma, Triton Studio, M3 in the past).
www.soundclick.com/ambiento

shap · Posted: Sat Jun 25, 2011 11:46 pm Post subject:

jroujinsky:

Dan stated that the A/Ds are the same, so I wouldn't expect that to be the cause. We know from statements elsewhere that Korg did a bunch of work in the filters, so I wonder if that may account for [some of] what you are hearing?

I'm unfortunately not in a position to test an OASYS here side-by-side here. Other people are, though, so I wonder if you could give one or two examples of voices that produced unexpected differences. Also, I wonder if you might dig in a little bit to the EQ, filter, and effect chains on the two machines to see if relevant differences may exist?

I do plan a similar side-by-side with the MOTIF XF, though.

shap
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Motu 2408mk3 + 24I/O
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Border Collies + Misc. Squeaky Toys

danatkorg · Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 12:11 am Post subject:

shap · Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 12:25 am Post subject:

Dan:

Wish I could point you at where I saw it. It was a passing statement sort of thing, and I'ld pass you the source if I could.

Definitely didn't intend to attribute that to you, and humble apologies if I managed to do so inadvertently.

Jonathan
_________________
Motif XF8, Kronos-88 (ordered), V-Synth GT, DT-Extreme eDrums
PC Core i7-920/24GB/3TB (2x)
Motu 2408mk3 + 24I/O
Sonar Producer, everything EastWest
Brian Moore iGuitar+Roland GI-20, Composite Acoustics 6, 12 string guitars, Multiple Ovations from when they were still worth it
Presonus Eureka (2x), TC Helicon VoiceOne
ADAM A7's and JBL 4328Ps, each for its purpose
Border Collies + Misc. Squeaky Toys

Melodialworks Music · Platinum Member Joined: 23 Feb 2003 Posts: 522

shap · Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 5:29 am Post subject: Re: Kronos sound vs Oasys sound

StephenKay · Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 5:40 am Post subject:

I can only report that I have both an OASYS and a Kronos, and one of the projects I am working on is porting one of our KARMA-fied combi sets (Catalyst) from the OASYS to the Kronos. Since the Kronos has all of the same programs from the OASYS (and then some), I can write some conversion code to remap the program locations and other things needed (the Kronos can read OASYS data basically, but the program locations and a few other things will be wrong).

In listening to the combis side by side, once converted, I have noticed no difference in the sound of the two, they are identical to my ears through Genelec monitors. Of course, this is not a scientific test in any way, but I haven't detected any differences.

It's worth noting that level matching the two is extremely important; if one of them is just a tiny bit louder, this can be perceived as "better", or "brighter", or whatever. Assuming no introduction of distortion, the louder sound always seems better.

Also, how are the two being monitored? Through a mixer with analog outs? Can you be sure the two (or four channels) have the same frequency response? If using a mixer, I don't know how high-quality it is, what are the tolerances of the components? Different channels could actually have slightly different colorations.

Lastly, are they using the same exact type of high quality cables, of the same length (assuming you are listening to analog outs)? I'm not one to overly buy into the monster cable and $10,000 audiophile wiring systems, but at the same time, I'm trying to point out that there are in many cases external influences that could cause subtle (and it sounds like you're talking about subtle) differences in the coloration of the sound. For me, they sounded identical.
_________________
Stephen Kay - KARMA Developer • Karma-Lab - karma-lab.com

jroujinsky · Joined: 16 Apr 2003 Posts: 28

Stephen, thanks for your valuable input.
Just for clarification, the idea of the post was to see if anybody else has similar observation. We did not expect to hear any difference, just as you stated. But we when we did, we wanted to understand the reason.
We compared EQ parameters of the combis and they seem to be identical.
The sound was routed through the mixer. Cables were not identical.
We will record couple of combies on both synth and then listen to recordings. - I can make them avaialable to the forum if someone else is interested in comparing.

It is not that really imporant (at least for me) if in reality there is a difference between the two. I am just curious.
_________________
Korg Kronos 61, Studiologic 88.
(Trinity, Karma, Triton Studio, M3 in the past).
www.soundclick.com/ambiento

Xenomorph · Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2011 10:34 am Post subject:

The cables NOT being identical could be the culprit, I've personally used 2 different brands comparing my Triton extreme with my cousins. He went home one day and realized his sounded different from mine, different enough where he didn't need to have both in front of him to know something was off. So we got together and did a side by side and it ended up being the cables. I had several pair of the same ones and once we removed his cables from the equation, bingo, same exact sound.
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Life is short, play a KORG!

Current: Pa5X, Nautilus
Past: M1, X5D, N364, Karma, X50, TR61, M50, micro-Korg, Triton Extreme, Pa3x, Roland Fantom 06, Akai mpc key61

Melodialworks Music · Platinum Member Joined: 23 Feb 2003 Posts: 522

I still maintain that if you know what you are listening to, then you will be biased (even without realizing it). So, you really need a third party to control the sound sourcing, as you compare, so that at no time you are aware of which instrument you are listening to. Where I come from, that is called a "blind test". Is that Coke or Pepsi?