Korg Forums

Peter J

Hi All,
I have just imported a midi file with markers for a new style for the PA2X of the Committments' version of 'Try a Little Tenderness' and cannot get the differing tempos to be recognised. Under the import procedure, the midifile tempo map appears to have been ignored except for the opening tempo. What I need is for the intro to be at 72 bpm, Variation 1 at 94 bpm, variations 2, 3 and 4 at 103 bpm and ending 3 at 115 bpm.

I had thought that what I needed to do was access style record and using Menu/ Event Edit bring up the Master Track and edit the tempo value shown against Intro 1, Variation 2, 3 etc. but on doing this I find that on leaving Event Edit the changes are discarded. Using Write Style after making the tempo changes seems to make no difference, which does not surprise me as I believe that tempo is generally saved under style performance [ which cannot be accessed in Event Edit?]. How can tempo changes be saved?

Changing the tempo on the main style record page also seems to have no effect for variations but only changes the initial [overall] tempo.

Can anyone please advise where I am going wrong and how such tempo changes may be incorporated in a style? Thank you.
_________________
Regards,
Peter J

PA2X Pro

MrVlad · Posted: Fri Jul 01, 2011 6:16 pm Post subject:

if I remember correctly, Go to the event editor and change the channel to the tempo track and edit the tempo in there for each variation and also make sure that aren't any other 'Tempo' events that contradict your changes
_________________
Korg PA800

Peter J · Posted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 4:38 pm Post subject:

Mr Vlad,
Thank you for your prompt reply. Unfortunately, there is not a tempo track in Event Edit, only the Master Track with a tempo item which appears to set only the global [overall] tempo for the whole style and any changes to this tempo do not affect the individual style element tempo separately. Also, if further items, tempo or metre are added to the master track there seems to be no way of saving them. Midi channels cannot be changed as there is no facility in event editor and Korg protocol uses channels 9 through 16 for bass, drums, percussion and accompaniment tracks.

As your reply to my query is the only one received so far, I wonder whether that is because nobody knows how to do this or whether it is not possible!
If anyone knows how to do this, their advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
_________________
Regards,
Peter J

PA2X Pro

karmathanever · Platinum Member Joined: 12 Jan 2004 Posts: 10404

Sam CA · Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 5:51 am Post subject:

Hi peter,
Actually, I can think of many songs or medleys where you could take advantage of multiple tempo/variations type of style. I've never needed one myself, but if i remember correctly once "Rikkibear" talked about this. I think she said it's possible to save tempo with each element. I don't have the keyboard with me to check this at the moment, but I will look into it. I wonder if this is like "time signature"..once you record a style you can't change the time signature, but If you set the time signature info with proper markers in the external sequencer, then you can have multiple time signature. Maybe, you can also set the tempo information with markers? I dont' know..never tried different tempo for variations before.
_________________
Sam

MrVlad · Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 9:05 am Post subject:

I have just been having a play around with the tempo editting.. and I was correct but forget to mention that you have to INSERT a NEW TEMPO Measure for each variation, thru the Event Editor.

This works great, and actually better than i originally thought. I thought that the tempo values were absolute but it seems they are not, they are relative Tempo's
for instance in a style,
VAR1 - tempo 120, on the event editor master track just leave this on the global tempo
VAR2 - Tempo 130, INSERT a measure on the tempo track and change value to 130
VAR3 - Tempo 150, INSERT a measure on the tempo track and change value to 130

now when you play the style if you change the global tempo to say "130", VAR2 and 3 will be incremented accordingly, so VAR2 will play at 140 and VAR3 will play 160

hope this helps.
regards,
Vlad
_________________
Korg PA800

Peter J · Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 3:30 pm Post subject:

Pete, Sam and Vlad,
Thank you for your helpful replies.

I would agree that different tempos for different variations is not something that is wanted very often. However, if you listen to the Committments version of Try a Little Tenderness you will see how it starts slowly with minimal instruments and builds as it progresses with additional instruments coming in and increased tempo and then the extended outro is massive with everything including the kitchen sink playing at the final [fastest] tempo. It was a Pa2X style to hopefully achieve this treatment that I have been seeking.

Many thanks Vlad for your further advice which I am delighted to say works spot on and gives me all the desired different tempos. The only thing which still puzzles me however is that I had previously tried inserting an additional different tempo in the master track of the event editor only to find it was deleted on exiting !!! This time however it worked with the first tempo item at 1.1.00 at 72 [the initial tempo] and the revised tempo ,say 94 at 1.1.01 --- then write the style when all the tempo changes for each variation had been made.

Sam, you mentioned the possibility of changing time signatures. I did not try this, but the event editor master track also contains a time signature item so, as for tempo, inserting a second time signature against different variations may be feasible.

Many thanks again to you all.
_________________
Regards,
Peter J

PA2X Pro

Sam CA · Posted: Mon Jul 04, 2011 4:15 pm Post subject:

Awesome! Glad to know this is possible.
_________________
Sam

Peter J · Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:18 pm Post subject:

Hi All,
Just for completeness, thought I would advise that when adding the additional item for tempo in the master track, it is necessary to do it for all chord variations [cv1, cv2, cv3 etc], otherwise, for a given variation, playing a major chord results in a 94 bpm tempo say whilst a minor results in the original global 72 bpm tempo.
Obvious really I suppose, but caught me out initially as I was thinking the change was made for the whole variation.
_________________
Regards,
Peter J

PA2X Pro

Thoraldus · Posted: Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:18 pm Post subject:

It never ceases to amaze me just how flexible our KORGs are. Thanks for the discussion folks, I learned valuable info.
_________________
”It’s easy to play any musical instrument: all you have to do is touch the right key at the right time and the instrument will play itself.”

Johann Sebastian Bach

----------------------------------------------
Rick Stirling - Retired Electrical Engineer - Erstwhile Photographer
Korg Kronos2, Casio MZ-X500, PA600, AKAI MPD32, M-Audio Oxygen 25, ZOOM H6, Cakewalk Sonar

Veren · Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 12:39 pm Post subject:

Hi Guys

Thanx for the clarifying that the Pa2x can indeed change tempo in FILL relatively to the current main tempo. But is same possible with Pa3x

However, i need to know will the main tempo resume after the fill as i need the Pa3x to function so for eastern music?

Thank you and appreciated

siebenhirter · Platinum Member Joined: 13 Oct 2011 Posts: 1844

hello,
<But>
i think it maybe possible with each model of Korgs Pa-serie.

Also on Pa500 it is possible, to play each Chordvariaton of each Stylevariation with a different tempo, because each CV has its own Mastertrack. But each of them will be shown with the actual tempo, as it is not possible to edit Tempo-Value1 on Position 001.01.000 with the built-in editor of Pa500.

although as stylechanges will not automatically insert styletempo, it is easy to change tempo of CVs in stylerecord.
To do so, select <Master> in Event-Edit where you can see your styletempo on unchangeable position 001.01.000, select this position and press <Insert> to get a new tempo-event on position 001.01.001 where you can select the tempo you want to play.

It may be not good application but it is funny to be able playing some stylevariations or/and chordvariations with different tempo.
_________________
kind regards
- siebenhirter, austria -

Interesting facts about styles and stylePlayer functions can be found at http: www.elmarherz.de