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sparkie
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 Feb 2005
Posts: 743
Location: Indiana
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 Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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| rrricky rrrecordo wrote: | | theshinenz wrote: | | Come on guys, you really think it sounds bad? Each to their own, |
No. I do think Kronos pianos sound much better than the Jupie's though.
Motif XS' guitars sound better to me too - particularly when I can "strum" the keys and maintain total control over my performance. I prefer to be my own behaviour modeling technologist.
I have heard some lovely JP-80 demos, but in the links posted by Beavis, some of the content screams "ANIME SOUNDTRACK!!!" to me. Probably more a function of the player rather than the playee though. |
Sound better?? How would you know, do you have a JP80 with a Kronos side by side?? Have you heard the pianos in a Jupiter in person? I dont see how you can compare anything listening to Youtubes? |
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:02 pm Post subject: |
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| You can judge the basic character of sound at least. Kronos definitely trumps every other workstation out there with its piano sound. |
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rrricky rrrecordo
Senior Member
Joined: 26 Jan 2011
Posts: 448
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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Well,- no, sparkie, I don't have either, but I did play and listen to Kronos' pianos very carefully, and compared them to the Roland SuperNatural stage pianos that were on the same floor.
No contest 
And I agree with the Dragon, as usual |
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vstkeys
Full Member
Joined: 20 Mar 2011
Posts: 158
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 4:42 pm Post subject: |
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OMG, I can't believe someone just praised that so called "supernatural piano " and the 4 cheesy layers on that video. Loll
Ok it proves to me that these things are just subjective and I got respect it .
The only thing that impressed me was the Orchestral sounds, not bad for a keyboard. However east west is pretty hard to beat if the idea is studio use. IMOHO the jupiter 80 seems to have the best factory orhestral sounds avail on a keyboard today. |
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RonF
Platinum Member
Joined: 04 Jul 2002
Posts: 1179
Location: San Diego, CA USA
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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I gotta say....anyone who would try to make a qualified judgement about the sound quality of just about anything from a YouTube or other Internet video demo, is just missing the point. You just simply cannot! There is SOOO many variables on such a video which may color, change, diminish, degrade, alter, and otherwise disguise the TRUE sound of the source material, that its just not possible to rely upon. You have got to play it first hand to know for sure. I am willing to bet you that anyone who has not yet played the JP80 (I have not, BTW), but has heard demos on the Internet, is going to be surprised at the quality and experience of a first hand demo. But that's just my opinion. I know that my Fantom G often impresses with its sound quality, on certain strengths it has (and disappoints on certain weaknesses it has).
And then you factor in the 'behavior modelling", or however you want to define it. As I understand, its basically some level of intelligence from creative programming or scripting that responds to your playing, with a high level of expressiveness. How can you perceive THIS from a video? You can't! You must play it and FEEL it, and you may be impressed. You just don't know until you have first hand experience. Please.....a grain of salt until you get hands on one!
I am looking forward to demoing a JP80, with an open mind to my experience and my ears!
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Favorite Gear: Kronos 61, M3, Z1, Radias, KPro, KP3, Moog Voyager, Foogers, Virus TI, Jupiter 80, Integra7, GAIA, SPD-30, Kiwi 106, RE-201, MC808, RC505, MV8800, DSI P6 and OB6 and P12, Ensoniq SQ80, EMU MP-7, Eventide H7600, Eclipse, SPACE, Pitchfactor, Timefactor, Looperlative LP-1, Axe FX Ultra, Nord Modular, DSI Tetra, Tempest, PEK, JDXA, Eurorack Modular, Octatrack, MDUW, Monomachine, A4, RYTM, Waldorf Q Phoenix, MWXTk, Blofeld, TR8. |
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EXer
Platinum Member
Joined: 17 Jan 2011
Posts: 558
Location: France
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| Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 11:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Rocness wrote: | Check this out . Some guy controls about 50 parameters with his hand on the Jupiter-80 and it sounds amazing !
@ about 8:29 watch the screen very carefully , Warning : it's very sexy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bdBWB2rVzU |
The strings from 2:30 to 2:50 don't sound so much different from the old SR-JV80 Orchestral card strings... |
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Chriskk
Senior Member
Joined: 10 May 2011
Posts: 349
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 12:51 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | The strings from 2:30 to 2:50 don't sound so much different from the old SR-JV80 Orchestral card strings... |
One could argue that the Kronos strings are not so different from the M1 strings on Youtube. Most modern romplers offer decent strings. But you cannot mimic nuances of a string ensemble on keys. All you can do is trigger the sample and apply some real time controls.
The key aspect of the JP-80 is behavioral modeling. My understanding is that it is an advanced version of their AP synthesis, and that it enables the keyboard player to play an acoustic sound almost as expressively as a real musician playing an instrument.
I played the JP-80 only for 20 minutes when I was visiting Japan. Its acoustic sounds are out of this world. Check out a Sweetwater video showing a trombone sound. The expressiveness and performance nuances are not possible on other synths. |
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synthguy
Platinum Member
Joined: 05 Jan 2005
Posts: 661
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:23 am Post subject: |
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| rrricky rrrecordo wrote: | Great board for anime soundtracks tho, very cartoonish  |
I don't suppose you noticed the language being used in the video wasn't Swahili. 
And I guess you haven't been exposed to J-Pop or J-Rock very much, but this is what music in Japan sounds like. Often, anime opens and closes with a popular piece of radio music licensed for the show. I happen to like Japanese music very much, and listen to anime and video game soundtracks a lot. Very inspirational, whether I'm wanting to write fiction or music.
If I watched a demo of a major synth in a European setting, I might have to endure a lot of techno with supersaw and "hoover" patches all over the place, and think it sounded very plastic and cheezy. And undoubtedly, Euro folk who listen to American demonstrations can expect everything from goopy new age, cheezy hip-hop, to bombastic prog.
And as much as I love the Kronos, every time I hear a Jupiter-80 demo, I want one more with each listen. It takes Yamaha's articulation engine and ups the ante by quite a jump.
| Chriskk wrote: | | Check out a Sweetwater video showing a trombone sound. The expressiveness and performance nuances are not possible on other synths. |
Yes, even a Kronos, except by hand.
For the record, I think Roland provides their synths with the best orchestral samples in a keyboard. When I want rich orchestrations or huge pipe organs, I'll use anything and everything, but I almost always start with my Fantom X.
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| synthguy wrote: | | And I guess you haven't been exposed to J-Pop or J-Rock very much, but this is what music in Japan sounds like. Often, anime opens and closes with a popular piece of radio music licensed for the show. I happen to like Japanese music very much, and listen to anime and video game soundtracks a lot. Very inspirational, whether I'm wanting to write fiction or music. |
Yay, I'm not alone on this board!  |
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sani
Senior Member
Joined: 22 Jul 2002
Posts: 354
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Rocness wrote: | Check this out . Some guy controls about 50 parameters with his hand on the Jupiter-80 and it sounds amazing !
@ about 8:29 watch the screen very carefully , Warning : it's very sexy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bdBWB2rVzU |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that possible on Korg workstation for a long time?
When programming a patch on Korg, you can set the same Controller to any single parameter which has the AMS mark. |
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Rocness
Guest
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:04 pm Post subject: |
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| sani wrote: | | Rocness wrote: | Check this out . Some guy controls about 50 parameters with his hand on the Jupiter-80 and it sounds amazing !
@ about 8:29 watch the screen very carefully , Warning : it's very sexy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7bdBWB2rVzU |
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't that possible on Korg workstation for a long time?
When programming a patch on Korg, you can set the same Controller to any single parameter which has the AMS mark. |
This guy did it by waving his hand in the air just like MAGIC . I think it uses what Roland calls D-beam .
Very cool for studio and especially Live because
most people won't know how your controlling all of that sound just by waving your hand in the air. Starts to seem like Magic to the audience , very cool . |
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 2:24 pm Post subject: |
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| D-Beam is gimmicky crap. |
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BillW
Platinum Member
Joined: 12 Jul 2005
Posts: 933
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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| EvilDragon wrote: | | D-Beam is gimmicky crap. |
Hey ED -- How do you feel about the the D-Beam?
I have owned a boatload of Roland gear with the D-Beam on it and have never found a real use for it.
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Korg Kronos 61 (2); Kurzweil PC4; Casio Privia PX-350m; Macbook Pro |
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phattbuzz
Platinum Member
Joined: 15 Jun 2011
Posts: 790
Location: NH USA
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:43 pm Post subject: |
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Got a D-Beam on my Roland Ax-Synth. Doesn't seam to be a lot you can do with it and it's hard to figure out where the beam becomes active. Very limited area to do a slow filter sweep, etc.
Also have a theremin and that's MUCH cooler!
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Latest Set Up: Kronos 61, Casio Privia, Korg TR61, EoWave Ribbon, Roli Rise 48, TEC Breath Controller, StudioLogic MP-117 Bass Pedals, Moog Theremini.
Past Instruments of Construction: Hammond A100 w/Leslie 760, Korg R3, Roland AxSynth, Korg Poly61, Korg M1, Univox MaxiKorg, Korg MS2000, (2) Moog Concertmate MG1, (2) Hammond X5, Rhodes Mark I & 2, Farfisa Compact, Yamaha S08, Casio SK1, Strymon Mobius, Custom Bass Pedals, Burns B3 Theremin. |
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Devnor
Full Member
Joined: 30 Jan 2011
Posts: 222
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| Posted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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| EvilDragon wrote: | | D-Beam is gimmicky crap. |
Its another way of controlling the sound actually a very powerful tool. The way some folks might use it is pretty gimmicky :p If you adjust the sens you won't look like your trying to levitate. D beam controls the "leslie" on my fantom X. I wish they'd put 3 or 4 beams on their boards. Ultimately we'll see more 3D spacial control as accepted norms for controlling synths when the sensors get cheap enough. Just remember where you saw it first
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Fantom 7, Kronos 2, V Synth GT, Moog Voyager |
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