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afr
Senior Member
Joined: 07 Oct 2005
Posts: 315
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 Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 10:10 pm Post subject: |
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| stratquebec wrote: | afr, thanks for your inputs!
One thing I wanna ask is : you would pay near 4000 to get a pa3x just to get those accoustic samples? Does it make any sens?
For sure if you can afford both a Kronos and the PA3x that's wonderful but 4000 more for those accoustic sounds, really? |
I will answer very frankly,
I need and I search mainly acoustic sounds, up to now with kronos I was pretty satisfied, but the level of expression offered by DNC is much better
Unfortunately this technology is not compatible with kronos because it use more osc on each sound.
So what can I do if I want better sounds? One possibility is to move on the VST world, no thanks is not for me, so the choice is: A nice and well sounding piece of hardware = today the pa4x
Cost: 4000$
I admit that is not cheap, but a good Daw+audio card+ORIGINAL VST it is cheaper?
I don't think so
Then, over the sounds the pa4 is an arranger, so I could benefit of some drum/percussion pattern or bass line to have a prompt idea about the arrangement...
This is my humble point of view, of course I would like to have a sw version 4 for kronos including the DNC feature...but this is just a dream
Last edited by afr on Thu Sep 17, 2015 1:12 am; edited 1 time in total |
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stratquebec
Junior Member
Joined: 29 Jul 2015
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Wed Sep 16, 2015 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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afr
I understand your choice and I respect your opinions. Despiste its versatility, indeed a DAW with so many third parties plug-ins, bugs, software updates etc etc is often a headache to maintain. I like too what the workstation has to offer despite their limitations.
Well Korg has something to learn here : the Kronos is already and old technologie  that's already outdated. The PA4X is more advanced at least in terms of sound quality on many aspect it seems. But hey, who I am to speak so, I don't own one or the other!!  (yet)
I hope you'll enjoy your PA4X! On my side I will choose a PA600 for my first arranger.
Peace! |
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Bachus
Platinum Member
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 3127
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:24 am Post subject: |
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| afr wrote: | | stratquebec wrote: | afr, thanks for your inputs!
One thing I wanna ask is : you would pay near 4000 to get a pa3x just to get those accoustic samples? Does it make any sens?
For sure if you can afford both a Kronos and the PA3x that's wonderful but 4000 more for those accoustic sounds, really? |
I will answer very frankly,
I need and I search mainly acoustic sounds, up to now with kronos I was pretty satisfied, but the level of expression offered by DNC is much better
Unfortunately this technology is not compatible with kronos because it use more osc on each sound.
So what can I do if I want better sounds? One possibility is to move on the VST world, no thanks is not for me, so the choice is: A nice and well sounding piece of hardware = today the pa4x
Cost: 4000$
I admit that is not cheap, but a good Daw+audio card+ORIGINAL VST it is cheaper?
I don't think so
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DAW costs,
macbook 2000
Logic+ mainstage 200 or live 700
NI complete ultimate 1000
VSTs about 200 each
Audio interface 300
Mastercontroller 88 weighted keys 800 ( i am using kronos and t5)
Ipad controller for logic remote 600
I have over 7000 spend on my DAW, that i mainly use as a module for VST sounds, keep in mind tough, that when i change things like hardware, i allways keep the backward compatibillity...
Keep also in mind that for the T5 and the K88 (used) together i payed 6200
So software diffinately is more expensive.. |
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Dikikeys
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:01 pm Post subject: |
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Not quite sure you got my point...
Even though Yamaha may have a unified technology design group, it was YEARS before the thing that appeared on the Tyros line finally made it to the Motif line. And this practice still continues, with Ensemble mode not available on Motif's yet at all. So, the apparent advantage of one single design group certainly doesn't seem to be making its way onto their products from both lines.
The truth is, the basic 'engine' of an arranger certainly comes from a unified design team (from each of the three 'majors'), but it pretty much only extends to the raw capabilities of the engine. Not only content, but how that engine is utilized certainly seems to diverge drastically as soon as each separate design team gets a hold of it. |
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Bachus
Platinum Member
Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 3127
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Dikikeys wrote: | Not quite sure you got my point...
Even though Yamaha may have a unified technology design group, it was YEARS before the thing that appeared on the Tyros line finally made it to the Motif line. And this practice still continues, with Ensemble mode not available on Motif's yet at all. So, the apparent advantage of one single design group certainly doesn't seem to be making its way onto their products from both lines.
The truth is, the basic 'engine' of an arranger certainly comes from a unified design team (from each of the three 'majors'), but it pretty much only extends to the raw capabilities of the engine. Not only content, but how that engine is utilized certainly seems to diverge drastically as soon as each separate design team gets a hold of it. |
The problem with ensemble voices is that they surfaced on T5 less then 2 years ago, and current motif was released over 5 years ago,,, its just a bad example
The problem with Yamaha (as well as Roland) is that it spreads all those nice additions over to many different instruments ( tyros, motif, cp4, reface) the same as Roland (japan ) does... I think thats where we both agree...
Atleast Korg went the oasys / kronos road about 10 years ago, that offers everything except arranger styles, pads and DNC... |
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Dikikeys
Guest
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Bachus wrote: |
DAW costs,
macbook 2000
Logic+ mainstage 200 or live 700
NI complete ultimate 1000
VSTs about 200 each
Audio interface 300
Mastercontroller 88 weighted keys 800 ( i am using kronos and t5)
Ipad controller for logic remote 600
I have over 7000 spend on my DAW, that i mainly use as a module for VST sounds, keep in mind tough, that when i change things like hardware, i always keep the backward compatibility...
Keep also in mind that for the T5 and the K88 (used) together i payed 6200
So software definitely is more expensive.. |
That is assuming that you buy a laptop or computer specifically for VSTi use. Most of us already HAVE one (and it doesn't need to be a TOTL Apple). It is also assuming the purchase of an 88 controller... many don't need something that big, or already have a MIDI keyboard (pretty safe to assume that most reading here have a Korg arranger at least!) and also assumes that either they HAVE to have the iPad (they don't) or that they don't already.
You can spend as much or as little as you want to, and STILL end up with something that will rival, if not outright beat the TOTL WS's. Remember, the OP was talking about home/studio use, NOT a rig he can go out and gig with. So, it's very likely he already has most of what he needs, even if it isn't convenient for him to take it all out of the house to gig with.
Sure, you want the absolute TOTL of everything in a VSTi rig, it's going to cost. But even a modest budget rig can seriously outperform the absolute TOTL hardware WS. Omnisphere2 alone pretty much puts a Kronos to shame, at a mere $480. Live use definitely changes the equation, but for the casual/semi=pro home studio user, it's not really accurate to say that software is the more expensive route. If it were, WS's would still dominate, and software would be a niche product rather than the #1 way of creating music that it actually is... |
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keybrdguy14
Joined: 23 Sep 2011
Posts: 30
Location: Destin, Florida
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 8:58 pm Post subject: Kronos versus PA4X |
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I currently own both a Kronos and a PA3X. I grew up playing in bands and continue to do that to this day. I also play 3 nights a week doing a duet with a female vocalist. I use the Kronos when playing in a band. I don't need drums or accompaniment, just great sounds and the Kronos delivers that in spades. With the Kronos, I have many more choices for each sound and I love B3 organs! I've purchased at least 400 additional organs for the Kronos and they are phenomenol. In a band, the Kronos is unbeatable. For the duet, I use only the PA3X. I use midi extensivey along with lots of songs using styles. I seldom use the PA3x in instrument mode - it is either in midi mode or style mode. The Kronos can't play midis well at all - they sound fairly bad but the PA3X is pristine with a midi. Overall, I would say the Kronos has many more and overall better sounds than the PA3X, which is why it is better suited for a band. If I'm composing a new song, it's back to the PA3X - nothing better on the market than the PA3X or Tyros 5 for composing. I've already ordered a new PA4X and excited to see how much the sounds have improved. Just my opinion.
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Korg PA4X, Korg PA3X 76, Korg Kronos 61, Yamaha S-80, Korg Triton, Kurzweil PC2R, Yamaha AW4416 Digital Recorder, Ensoniq EPS-16 Plus, Roland D-20 |
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nitecrawler
Platinum Member
Joined: 22 Mar 2007
Posts: 978
Location: from a mile high to the the AZ desert
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| Posted: Thu Sep 17, 2015 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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Would like to get your opinion on how the Midi to style converter works and how well it works. 
That is when you receive your ordered Pa4x keybrdguy14.
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http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=807494
Montage M7, Pa5x76, Nautilus, PA3Xle, Oasys 76, Mini-Moog, EMU Audity 2000, Motion Sound KBR 3D amp, Presonus and Reaper DAW W/Tannoy Reveal 501A powered monitors |
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keybrdguy14
Joined: 23 Sep 2011
Posts: 30
Location: Destin, Florida
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| Posted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 4:14 pm Post subject: Midi to Style converter |
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I will be happy to share my opinion once I get the PA4X. This is actually a very intriguing new feature - can't wait to see how well it works myself!
_________________
Korg PA4X, Korg PA3X 76, Korg Kronos 61, Yamaha S-80, Korg Triton, Kurzweil PC2R, Yamaha AW4416 Digital Recorder, Ensoniq EPS-16 Plus, Roland D-20 |
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