Suggestion to Korg - how to make a few quid from OASYS

[vEddY]

Q: Is there a sound that is needed, but cannot be created with a fully expanded OASYS and would require another type of engine, another synthesis method? (I think I know, e.g. granular synthesis or maybe other physical modeling like Yamaha VL1.)

A1. If we consider OASYS as a kind of sound lab for experimenting then yes, there is, for sure. Everything goes.

A2. But if we consider OASYS as an instrument that should be used musically (= enjoyably also by listeners playing meaningful tunes, chords, rhythms as ingredients of what we consider "music" today) then is there anything missing from OASYS that exists somewhere else already and most keyboard players would need?

There are certain aspects of the overall soundscape that OASYS can't do. Let's forget about the granular thingy for a second.

As far as the "synth-usage-model" is concerned, it's really bulletproof. Really just perfect as a synth. But I'd kind of missing some things, like:
- atmospheric sounds like some Spectrasonics stuff (Omnisphere is a good bet)
- bass sounds (real bass guitar, electric, fretless, whatnot) could be a bit better (Spectrasonics Trillian offers more at times, as well as some sample CD's that I have for my Kurzweil K2500RS)
- I'm still soul-searching on the path to this perfect soft-piano sound that I have in my head (I need it for a tune that I'm recording and arranging for my friend's album). When hit hard, every synth-or-sampled piano I've tried so far has this glassy character that I don't like. To OASYS's credit, I went through every single piano library on the market and found nothing there, as well. BTW, I'd love to have a perfect sostenuto-pedalled piano in my synth. That's just something I still haven't found, as well.
- as I said, some brass-woodwinds-string sounds are too synthy and at times I need more real stuff (which I then cover with EastWest's libraries)
- it really sucks that there aren't more banks for sounds available and that pisses me off on daily basis.

I use KARMA extensively while playing live, so that's one of the aspects of it that brought such enormous joy and ease of use in my live-playing, it's really beyond any possible description.

[cello]

@ vEddY, Akos Janca and peter m. mahr -

Thank you, thank you, thank you for your wonderful exchange about the OASYS as an instrument and tool!

Loved reading your views that whilst mentioning what is strong and weak about the instrument, were based on a respectful, meaningful and useful debate.

Absolutely wonderful! Keep it going because I'm learning more from this than any discussion around what Korg should or could do...

[vEddY]

@ vEddY, Akos Janca and peter m. mahr -

Thank you, thank you, thank you for your wonderful exchange about the OASYS as an instrument and tool!

Loved reading your views that whilst mentioning what is strong and weak about the instrument, were based on a respectful, meaningful and useful debate.

Absolutely wonderful! Keep it going because I'm learning more from this than any discussion around what Korg should or could do...

BTW, these comments I made about bass and orchestral sounds... think of them as comments about the "studio" aspect of the keyboard. No sane person would notice those subtle differences live within the realms of general population. No "Johnny from the Audience" ever would. Almost all of those sounds are very good for live performances.

It's just that when I record some of the songs that I do, at times, I need real sounds - again, for RECORDING - and then it's lacking a bit.

At the same time, it's perfect for both live and studio as a synth. Just freakin' awesome. Oh, yeah - and when I take a broad look - Z1, Trinity and OASYS alltogether are just a perfect setup, and one I'm using. Z1 is excellent for weird sounds, has really cool effect-type sounds, some very interesting modelled sounds. Trinity is sublime for dark sounds and some unique sounds that it has. And OASYS is perfect for - just about everything else. While being more "straight in your face" synth.

[Davidb]

I have no beef with Korg,...,but it has certainly damaged a Brand loyalty I once would have pledged an alliance with and Have done since the early 90s the Oasys shall be the last and only Workstation of Korg I ever buy again,even if they ever release Oasys Mk2,I'm sure they are aware of the Damage/Resentment they've caused to Oasys owners

I guess they are.

+1 anyway for your reflection, though.

[Kevin Nolan]

I have no beef with Korg,...,but it has certainly damaged a Brand loyalty I once would have pledged an alliance with and Have done since the early 90s the Oasys shall be the last and only Workstation of Korg I ever buy again,even if they ever release Oasys Mk2,I'm sure they are aware of the Damage/Resentment they've caused to Oasys owners

I guess they are.

+1 anyway for your reflection, though.

I would suggest that most OASYS users do not feel that way. Yes there is a cohort of OASYS owners on this forum who regularly articulate their frustration, but they are not the majority even here, and as Akos has indicated on another post, most OASYS users do not visit this forum. I don't think most people give a 2nd thought to Korg having abandoned them - they're just getting on with composing or playing.

Irrespective of the numbers who feel aggrieved, its inaccurate you your post as if its the norm among OASYS owners that they feel agrieved- I don't and the majority probably don't. So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Kevin.

[cello]

I would suggest that most OASYS users do not feel that way. Yes there is a cohort of OASYS owners on this forum who regularly articulate their frustration, but they are not the majority even here, and as Akos has indicated on another post, most OASYS users do not visit this forum. I don't think most people give a 2nd thought to Korg having abandoned them - they're just getting on with composing or playing.

Irrespective of the numbers who feel aggrieved, its inaccurate you your post as if its the norm among OASYS owners that they feel agrieved- I don't and the majority probably don't. So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Kevin.

+ 1!

[TonyGen]

I would suggest that most OASYS users do not feel that way. Yes there is a cohort of OASYS owners on this forum who regularly articulate their frustration, but they are not the majority even here, and as Akos has indicated on another post, most OASYS users do not visit this forum. I don't think most people give a 2nd thought to Korg having abandoned them - they're just getting on with composing or playing.

Irrespective of the numbers who feel aggrieved, its inaccurate you your post as if its the norm among OASYS owners that they feel agrieved- I don't and the majority probably don't. So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Kevin.

-1

[kenackr]

Irrespective of the numbers who feel aggrieved, its inaccurate you your post as if its the norm among OASYS owners that they feel agrieved- I don't and the majority probably don't. So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

:


No Grievance here!

+10

Ken

[Kontrol49]

Whether my views represents a majority or not in terms of disgruntled owners,this sort of discussion will always divide a community,your going to have those that kind of feel let down and vent the frustration directly at Korg direct and ditch the machine in principal,and others who kind of perhaps feel let down but respect the decisions and apprecciate the machine for what it is and those who simply defend Korg because it kind of makes them feel better for spending so much money on an obsolete device

I kind of fall somewhere between all of these,its technology progression and every piece of musical gear i have purchased new,I never bought into a lifetime of support,but it was kind of anticipated because of how things progress but somewhere amongst the angst and frustration of most owners there seems to be some glimmer of hope that maybe this is not the end of the Oasys but we all have learnt some valuable lessons as so have Korg.I'm glad I have an Oasys its an integral sound source in the studio but I would like it to be more than just a top grade studio sound module/keybed

Most of us recognise the strengths of the Oasys which is why its harder to accept those flaws of it being dropped,most of which seem aimed at the Sequencer,myself included that feel it could with that screen be the heart of many studios with its wealth of HDR options bolted on,how they ever thought a 16 track midi sequencer with one Hardware Midi out was ever going to be adeqaute was beyond me that comes across as some arrogant viewpoint that bolting 16 audio tracks alongside it would kind of make any external hardware redundant and that the oasys engines would be all you'd ever need but however they allow you to compromise between an external and internal midi channel out of those minimal 16 tracks,I 've written songs that have in excess of 45 midi tracks whilst bouncing audio maybe a solution sometimes it not convenient and is more time consuming with complex arrangements

If Korg updated the sequencer to compete with more modern Hardware sequencers specifically something to rival the MPC line with whats inside the machine from an engine perspective it would put most software DAWS to shame,The Triton extreme from a feature aspect in sequencing mode is ahead of the Oasys,even simple things like the cue list and ability to alter basic Timbre/sound parameters directly,why Korg left those out is beyond me.

Even in Hindsight now I would have still purchased the Oasys,I Have always liked and used Korg romplers,Like many people I was after that elusive all in one package,the Oasys only seems like part of the Puzzle and when you look around at other devices you kind of wonder given the Concept of the Oasys and what we already have inside the Machine like theres something more to give not only towards the sequencer but further exis or OS.

I Guess more and more of us are left frustrated not at the price tag but Korgs intentions,I find it hard to accept that Korg never have disclosed any more info as to what other developments could of taken place had there not been an economic descision to stop it and for me thats where most of the frustration Lies and an underlying desire to hang on to that glimmer of hope that we might see some more updates to the OS given we had no statement to suggest otherwise on the future of the OS,Other than stopping the Build of the hardware components

[TonyGen]

Whether my views represents a majority or not in terms of disgruntled owners,this sort of discussion will always divide a community,your going to have those that kind of feel let down and vent the frustration directly at Korg direct and ditch the machine in principal,and others who kind of perhaps feel let down but respect the decisions and apprecciate the machine for what it is and those who simply defend Korg because it kind of makes them feel better for spending so much money on an obsolete device

I kind of fall somewhere between all of these,its technology progression and every piece of musical gear i have purchased new,I never bought into a lifetime of support,but it was kind of anticipated because of how things progress but somewhere amongst the angst and frustration of most owners there seems to be some glimmer of hope that maybe this is not the end of the Oasys but we all have learnt some valuable lessons as so have Korg.I'm glad I have an Oasys its an integral sound source in the studio but I would like it to be more than just a top grade studio sound module/keybed

Most of us recognise the strengths of the Oasys which is why its harder to accept those flaws of it being dropped,most of which seem aimed at the Sequencer,myself included that feel it could with that screen be the heart of many studios with its wealth of HDR options bolted on,how they ever thought a 16 track midi sequencer with one Hardware Midi out was ever going to be adeqaute was beyond me that comes across as some arrogant viewpoint that bolting 16 audio tracks alongside it would kind of make any external hardware redundant and that the oasys engines would be all you'd ever need but however they allow you to compromise between an external and internal midi channel out of those minimal 16 tracks,I 've written songs that have in excess of 45 midi tracks whilst bouncing audio maybe a solution sometimes it not convenient and is more time consuming with complex arrangements

If Korg updated the sequencer to compete with more modern Hardware sequencers specifically something to rival the MPC line with whats inside the machine from an engine perspective it would put most software DAWS to shame,The Triton extreme from a feature aspect in sequencing mode is ahead of the Oasys,even simple things like the cue list and ability to alter basic Timbre/sound parameters directly,why Korg left those out is beyond me.

Even in Hindsight now I would have still purchased the Oasys,I Have always liked and used Korg romplers,Like many people I was after that elusive all in one package,the Oasys only seems like part of the Puzzle and when you look around at other devices you kind of wonder given the Concept of the Oasys and what we already have inside the Machine like theres something more to give not only towards the sequencer but further exis or OS.

I Guess more and more of us are left frustrated not at the price tag but Korgs intentions,I find it hard to accept that Korg never have disclosed any more info as to what other developments could of taken place had there not been an economic descision to stop it and for me thats where most of the frustration Lies and an underlying desire to hang on to that glimmer of hope that we might see some more updates to the OS given we had no statement to suggest otherwise on the future of the OS,Other than stopping the Build of the hardware components

Agree 100%. Maybe Korg have disconinued the M3 so they can free their developers up to work on sequencer updates for the Oasys

I can but hope.

[Sina172]

...

[Sharp]

So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Couldn't disagree more.
There is a lot of dissatisfaction accross the forums with KORG.

Heck, ask yourself why Daz left. After 10 years and him being a founder of this forum ?
Maybe it's because you stick to the Oasys section you don't see everything that's going on.

My 2 cents.

Sharp

[Davidb]

So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Couldn't disagree more.
There is a lot of dissatisfaction accross the forums with KORG.

Heck, ask yourself why Daz left. After 10 years and him being a founder of this forum ?
Maybe it's because you stick to the Oasys section you don't see everything that's going on.

My 2 cents.

Sharp

I was about to post the same, thanx my friend.

[Davidb]

Whether my views represents a majority or not in terms of disgruntled owners,this sort of discussion will always divide a community.

That´s for sure.
And it always will.

If Korg updated the sequencer to compete with more modern Hardware sequencers specifically something to rival the MPC line with whats inside the machine from an engine perspective it would put most software DAWS to shame,The Triton extreme from a feature aspect in sequencing mode is ahead of the Oasys,even simple things like the cue list and ability to alter basic Timbre/sound parameters directly,why Korg left those out is beyond me.

+1

[Kevin Nolan]

So Korg have nothing to be aware of in this regard - there's no brand loyalty loss (for most of us) and there isn't a problem (for most of us)!

Couldn't disagree more.
There is a lot of dissatisfaction accross the forums with KORG.

Heck, ask yourself why Daz left. After 10 years and him being a founder of this forum ?
Maybe it's because you stick to the Oasys section you don't see everything that's going on.

My 2 cents.

Sharp

I appreciate Daz's stand point, but I don't agree with his decision to leave this forum. It seems Daz is happy to have moved away from Korg and is busy doing music on other platforms, but I find it pretty hard to understand his abandoning the OASYS so resolutely. I mean, the instrument is still outstanding. IF Daz were not so happy with his move I'd have said he shot himself in the foot with such a resolute move. Don't get me wrong I greatly admire Daz and I realise there were big issues with Korg behind the scenes I’m not privy to, but it does look a little to me that Daz's and your expectations from Korg are too high (even if you are right). This is a quite faceless technology corporation after all - heck I've never even understood what my various bosses / managers thought most of the time in companies I actually worked in.


Overall, Korg instruments are excellent quality, stable, feature rich, innovative and actually usable. So there can be no suggestion of an underlying issue with Korg product quality or support. I have as many gripes as the next guy w.r.t to the OASYS, but I do not hold it against Korg that all my dream wishes in these regards are not implemented.

But even if the users on all the Korg forums here are justified in their gripes, as Akos has just pointed out, by far the majority of Korg users are not on this forum. So this forum is not necessarily representative of typical Korg users and it may be that the majority do not think about the product nitty-gritty as do we here. Remember that we've also made a hobby out of being very particular about electronic music technology; and that's probably not typical of most musicians who use music technology.

So it is far from clear to me that the concerns and gripes raised on this forum are justified or that they represent the concerns of typical Korg users; and I don't think Korg will ever be particularly concerned with what is being articulated here. Again don't get me wrong there are lots of very interesting discussions here and this forum is indeed relevant, but it is not necessarilty reflective of the majority of Korg users.

My personal opinion is that about 80% of Korg (or any synth users) do not give a damn about the sorts of issues we raise here. And, Korg are not widely regarded as 'problematic' to deal with, so I don't accept that there is widespread dissatisfaction with them at all.


Kevin.