A Couple of Thoughts on Build Issues

[GregC]

I always thought and said that the best feedback to Korg concerning quality issues is either having serious(!) issues fixed, exchange the device, or give it back. I would act exactly like that and use one of those options, if I had serious issues with my Kronos.

Even more than ten percent issues in our poll are definitely too much for a well working quality control, though we don't know exactly what kind of issues were involved, or if someone just detected too late in a weird way that he wanted another device. My impression is that Korg is aware of the quality control challenge, and that the ongoing delivery delays are part of their reaction.

What makes the situation less relaxed is the obvious attempt of some to jump in and try to slander the Kronos into something generally unreliable or of untolerable bulit quality. This is nothing but spreading of clueless malevolent nonsense, looking at the device I use daily, and looking at the majority of users in the poll.

I have my own business, have sold over 5,000 SKU's in 2 years and have a feedback system.

A business typically hears back from 10-15% from their customers. That is the FB rate. Thus the business does not hear from 85% of customers. That can be called " no news is good news ".

A business will almost always hear about a defective item or a customer service issue. That portion will almost always report it in a variety of ways.

Thus, one should not assume, that 10% of all Kronos sold are defective in some way, based on the anecdotal reports on this forum.

Like I have posted numerous times, ( especially to new posters), they do not have access to all the info on defects, thus they should not over exagerate, over speculate, or pound the desk that Korg is not doing enough, etc, etc, etc. Korg is this , Korg is that, etc, etc. Korg should do this, blah blah.

That won't stop these folks( who are non owners) from doing it. Its impossible to have a reasonable discussion with these folks.

I believe the defect rate is MUCH lower than 10%.

Lets say, 2000 Kronos have been sold and lets assume, for sake of discussing, there are 200 bad boards in the marketplace. If that were the case, that would be devastating to a business. I do not believe this forum reflects that defect level at all.

I arrive at 2000 sales based on the various serial #'s per keyboard and the very strong unit sales here in the US.

[madbeatzyo111]

I can't help but wonder if some of the negative reactions to build quality aren't fed by the fact that they get discussed here so frequently.

Including this thread with the title "...Build Issues" which would surely come up in a search involving "build quality" but actually has nothing to do with build quality at all but actually discussing other threads that do involve build quality?

Congratz, you just added more fire to the very topic you wish suppressed.

[jimknopf]

Nobody wishes the topic to be supressed.
It should just be put into proper proportion, and make some people, who are reading about issues, aware of the difference between legitimate user interests and malicious spreading of rumours.

[Devnor]

Its not that complicated. I go to a music store ready to buy a Kronos. Keybed is splitting and parts missing. All the other boards save SV1 seem to be a great condition. Fine lets try another store. Same deal. Wait 3 months go back to store. Same problems and the other boards are still in great condition.

I was ready to buy a Kronos last week but walked out empty handed again. Most people just want these problems solved so we can get on with making music with the instruments we want to use. For me that includes Kronos....someday.

[madbeatzyo111]

and malicious spreading of rumours.

That's a bit paranoid isn't it? And what would be the purpose of trying to spread rumors in a place where such would be quickly dispelled by Korg (Dan) or by a myriad of actual Kronos users/owners? And if they weren't quickly dispelled in such a fashion, then what does that imply?

[GregC]

and malicious spreading of rumours.

That's a bit paranoid isn't it? And what would be the purpose of trying to spread rumors in a place where such would be quickly dispelled by Korg (Dan) or by a myriad of actual Kronos users/owners? And if they weren't quickly dispelled in such a fashion, then what does that imply?

I agree with jim's point.

There are posters that are not serious players, they simply enjoy the chance to do a rip job , in an effort to attract attention to themselves.

[PinkFloydDudi]

and malicious spreading of rumours.

That's a bit paranoid isn't it? And what would be the purpose of trying to spread rumors in a place where such would be quickly dispelled by Korg (Dan) or by a myriad of actual Kronos users/owners? And if they weren't quickly dispelled in such a fashion, then what does that imply?

How would a myraid of users dispell false rumors, if when they do - they simply get scolded by people like you?

[Randelph]

I posted this in the thread, "Poll: How is it for you?" thread.

Not sure what perspective to apply.

Look at how buggy and incomplete the Fantom G was upon release- uninspiring presets, no multi-sampling, a crippled sequencer; a lot of really basic important things that were serious impediments for a lot of folks.

And then look at the Motif XS- fairly mature OS, good hardware, etc.; but for those of us that want to be more musician than engineer, the XS, even with its strong sound set, was not worth the trouble for many of us.

And then look at the Kronos- a core OS that many used to Korg workstations are already familiar with, an overall OS that many feel is the most user friendly of all, superb new kick-ass sound engines that brings the flexibility of the powerful sequencer/sampler/audio recorder to bear on a music production board of unparalleled compositional capability; fabulous sweet reverb and flexible effects routing, SST, set lists- preaching to the choir here obviously- but it bears repeating in the face of what else is available in the way of an overall solid and friendly workstation experience at an affordable price.

My impression is that the Kronos is a skillful blending of the Oasys and the M3. Bringing direct trickle down advanced technology from the Oasys to a board that's built more to the M3 hardware spec- and of course the price point is a large part of why the Kronos has been so keenly anticipated.

After I got burned with the Motif XS, taking a +$1,500 loss after 2+ years of ownership (having gotten one of the first units), I'm happy enough to wait for the eventual sales or used boards that become available. By that time 1.5, and possibly, 2.0 will have arrived. I'm guessing that economically and for the fast moving technology trends, that Korg had to strike as quickly as they could.

Compared to what I heard about the Fantom G, the year plus that it took for the Kurzweil PC3 to have a full-fledged sound set and OS, the 9 months to a year? that it took the M3 to get its new 2.0 OS and new sound set; compared to examples like that, the Kronos seems like a reasonable blend of available now (at least for some lucky people) and some to-be-expected glitches that apparently aren't totally crippling or unacceptable for most people.

Perspectivo!

From my point of view, the Kronos is what I've always wanted in a keyboard- I just hope i can afford one sooner than later. And having a JP-80 as a complement to it would just confirm that we live in the best of times-

Randy

[madbeatzyo111]

How would a myraid of users dispell false rumors, if when they do - they simply get scolded by people like you?

Here's a recent case. There were rumors that Fatar was manufacturing the Kronos keybed or alternately that Korg was using an outdated Technics design. Dan came in (along with some others) to set the fact straight that Korg manufactures the Kronos keybed. End of rumor.

My point was that spurious rumors don't survive very long here. If they do persist, then they might not be all that spurious.

[PinkFloydDudi]

How would a myraid of users dispell false rumors, if when they do - they simply get scolded by people like you?

Here's a recent case. There were rumors that Fatar was manufacturing the Kronos keybed or alternately that Korg was using an outdated Technics design. Dan came in to set the fact straight that Korg manufactures the Kronos keybed. End of rumors.

My point was that spurious rumors don't survive very long here. If they do persist, then they might not be all that spurious.

Ah so we should expect Dan to monitor all the bs on these forums. Gotcha.

Dan does at times come in to dispell untrue rumors. It is wrong to expect him to always be there to monitor.

He also doesn't help at all to dispell false impressions. If all someone sees is complaints about the board when they come here to read something - that leaves a false impression about the keyboard.

You may be sick of seeing the same people say "our Kronoi are fine"...but they typically only do so when the same people say "my data wheel is still broken".

Would be great if this place went back to being somewhere that you could learn how to do things with the keyboard...or learn what different capabilities the Kronos had. Not just a bunch of threads on complaints...

Let me ask you - how "productive" is it to come here and complain about something being broken on a Kronos? You know the response they get? "Contact your Korg dealer"...cause that is the correct "forum" for those complaints.

Again, would just love to come here and learn about the kronos...not hear for the 10th time about Devnor seeing a Kronos in a store that had a millimeter difference in key spacing.

[madbeatzyo111]

Let me ask you - how "productive" is it to come here and complain about something being broken on a Kronos? You know the response they get? "Contact your Korg dealer"...cause that is the correct "forum" for those complaints.

I don't like useless threads either, that's why I was questioning the purpose of this thread.

[PinkFloydDudi]

Let me ask you - how "productive" is it to come here and complain about something being broken on a Kronos? You know the response they get? "Contact your Korg dealer"...cause that is the correct "forum" for those complaints.

I don't like useless threads either, that's why I was questioning the purpose of this thread.

I'm with ya on that aspect of things. Feel like I'm at my office...having meetings just to discuss what the next meeting is going to be about!

That is where my frustration has built to at this point though. I think ANY thread that is complaining about the Kronos and isn't bringing up something we haven't already heard is useless.

[danmusician]

Let me ask you - how "productive" is it to come here and complain about something being broken on a Kronos? You know the response they get? "Contact your Korg dealer"...cause that is the correct "forum" for those complaints.

I don't like useless threads either, that's why I was questioning the purpose of this thread.

The purpose of the ORIGINAL POST was to try to inject some perspective to some of the handwringing that is going on in this board.

1. A few complainers are making some of us look for problems that aren't really there.

2. It's a new product. Unfortunately, many new products suffer in quality control. It's true for cars, computers, music instruments, etc.

I apologize if trying to encourage folks to back it down somehow fans the flame of discontent.

I notice that you waded through a page and half of a "useless thread" to comment on it. Or, you posted to a thread title without reading what came before so you don't what you're talking about. Either way, it makes no sense to me.

[madbeatzyo111]

I understand you trying to inject some warm fuzzy feeling into a sea of negativity. But it's turning out to be yet another "us vs them" sitation pitting Kronos users against Kronos users.

Let's try to remember we're on the same team and ultimately want the same thing--for Kronos to sell well so that Korg can continue to develop great products in the future. Undiluted praise is always nice, but we all know what happens when you only listen to the "yes" men. What helps Korg more is identifying areas that can be improved and that's where we can help.

[PinkFloydDudi]

I understand you trying to inject some warm fuzzy feeling into a sea of negativity. But it's turning out to be yet another "us vs them" sitation pitting Kronos users against Kronos users.

Let's try to remember we're on the same team and ultimately want the same thing--for Kronos to sell well so that Korg can continue to develop great products in the future. Undiluted praise is always nice, but we all know what happens when you only listen to the "yes" men. What helps Korg more is identifying areas that can be improved and that's where we can help.

add in "Without beating the negatives to death" into your post and I'll +1 it.