Korg Italy financial informations

[Biggles]

Do Korg Pa buyers have short memories?

The 4X was released and it took years before the OS reached the the Next version.

Pa700 and 1000 were both released in 2017 and have not had any updates at all only bug fixes. That to me gives a very big question mark on Korg’s business strategy.

Nautilus is released and Kronos dropped so there is no direct competitor with Roland and Yamaha and does that flag a question mark on Korg business strategy?

I bought a Kross 2 in 2018 and it took 18 months before a significant update was released.

Yet the 5X is released and the clammer of buyers rushing to buy is overwhelming only to find a product that does not meet their expectations.

Buying a Mark 1 version of any product means you are a Beta tester, that is the reality of buying what is a niche market product.

My faith in Korg is severely dented

Why must they add more features according to your post?
When you buy a car you expect a free new and better engine after 2-3 years? I don't understand this at all.
We buy it for what it is when we buy it and of course we expect and want the bugs to be fixed but we have no right to demand adding more than what was advertised when we bought it.
And now pa5x has reached that state.
It has everything it was advertised with right now.Still with bugs but everything is in there.
The bugs will get away sooner or later.
Although i totally agree that a professional musician that is working live as his/her main job should never get rid of the old keyboard before the new one is ready and if he/she can't afford to have 3 keyboards (2 in perfect working order is a must for me for anyone that wants to be called professional) , they should not buy the new one until everything suggests it will meet their requirements...

You seem to be missing that Korg were aware of the limited functionality of the 5x compared to the 4x and that Korg Staff said that more features would be added to the OS but nothing so far.

The Kross 2 received a significant upgrade to its OS

The 4X received a very significant update

So expectations are now that Korg models will have features unlocked if nothing else than to compete with Yamaha who are leading Korg 4 - 1 with new Arrangers in the last four years.

Your Car analogy is utterly and totally irrelevant.

You buy a computer and expect the operating system and software to be updated, a keyboard is no different,

[musiccankill]

As you said yourself, you get updates NOT upgrades!
On a computer you PAY for the upgrades of the software , you don't pay for the updates (which means fixes and small changes)..
We already got an update which didn't fix everything but it is way better than what it was and it will continue getting better with every update we get.

I don't remember anyone being able to get a newer major version of cubase (an example) or pa manager (another example) for free , right?
Same here , even if they were never and in no way obliged to give free software upgrades (not updates) to their software , they did add a lot new features as the years gone by and for free on all major and most lower end keyboards.
So, when we say (and i will say it and believe that it will happen too) that they will do it on 5x too , it is just our assumption , not a fact and surely not an obligation for them...

Also the "so far" you wrote on your first sentence , is only 1 update down the road, which is just the beginning and they said that cause they really had it planned and people gone crazy over some missing things that nobody said officially that they would be there in the first place...

People even said bad things about the vocal processor because it is not the known TC but in reality it is multiple times better than the old one and sounds almost natural finally (the TC implementation was really useless compared to the new one) !

Come on people, enjoy making/playing some music on that beast or any keyboard you have!
The new features are way past good enough and its factory sample library and the sound quality it produces is way above any previous korg model.
The bugs will get ironed out eventually and when the world chip shortage ends (not going to happen soon though) there will be enough supply for anyone who wants to get one.
You need to remind to yourself that any machine is as good as its operator..
Having the best machine out there (not talking only about keyboards here) but being unable to use all its capabilities is worse than having a way older one with less than half the functionality but not knowing how to control it in order to utilize it at its max!

Sorry if i pissed some people off by trying to explain my point of view. Nobody has to follow what i say if they don't feel like it of course. It is just my opinion and food for thought!

I want the pa5x to become what it deserves to be more than anyone and I believe it will be and that is why I got it the day it got announced knowing all the downsides of getting the first one out there in my country (and most of the world)...

[Pekilik]

The problem is not to expect some new upgrades, the problem is that some basic functions that already exist on the keyboard do not work properly, such as conversion from previous models, intro /ending 1, lack of some basic functions in style record editor, cutting or bad notes when changing from style to style and so on, and that it will be a year and maybe more before it is fixed, and unfortunately the user's confidence is quite shaken that it will ever be fixed until the end because the list of what needs to be fixed is quite long, all that should have existed and be fully functional at the very beginning, if soon the basic that is already on the keyboard is functional and stable, the instrument will be excellent even without any special upgrades...

[rikkisbears]

Assuming a new model will have everything the previous models had and more is not a fault from any company , including korg .

Now about availability , you can just look what is going on on the planet. It is far from the only company that has production issues. Entire car industries have shut down temporarily cause of chip shortage and that happens to every production plant no matter the product they create as long as it needs electronics and metals (both are available at extremely limited quantities worldwide).
.

Hi, by the time I bought mine, I was aware there were a lot of bugs, and for me personally, the current functions would be enough if and when the bugs get fixed.
But I still don’t think they should have called it a PA5x, if a lot more of the functions that the Pa4x and all the prior pa x’s had.
Also before I bought there was a list of future functions that they were planning on adding in the next big update in April, that list seems to have disappeared, unless I’m trying to find it in the wrong spot.

Agree they must be having problems with chip shortages etc. my son had to wait weeks to get a particular electronic part for his car, he was without it for weeks.

[siebenhirter]

.. sorry if i pissed some people off by trying to explain my point of view ...

That's ok and not a big problem, because everyone here tries to explain their point of view.

Now if you say "I want the pa5x to become what it deserves to be more than anyone" then that sounds a bit different whereas than in previous postings like:

You (the buyer) BELIEVED it would have EVERYTHING that was in the Pa4x , Korg never said that and there are no such details anywhere (product page, manual , etc).
It is not Korg (or any company) who should be blamed for that.
Guys i m not defending KORG or any company , i have nothing to win.
Nobody has to follow what i say if they don't feel like it of course.
It is just my opinion and food for thought!

If that was your opinion - again my opinion and food for thought still is remaining:
Only Korg is solely responsible for its disaster of a hasty presentation and causing the customer's loss of trust.
Korg should make an effort so that also premature buyers can trust and expect again that bugs to be eliminated satisfactorily within a short time.

An opinion like "the bugs will get ironed out eventually" however, warrants the storm of indignation that Korg faces at the Pa5x's OS-shortcomings.

For this no chip shortages are not responsible - that would cause bottlenecks in delivery, but that's a total other topic.

[korgpask]

If I understood correctly how you write here.

Who is determined to buy the Pa5X in this condition and is aware that it doesn't matter that it can't do as much as the Pa4X. So it's his choice, his decision.
Well, if KORG introduces the Pa5X model, which is a continuation of the Pa4X, and claims that it is a completely new model, which is NOT a continuation of the Pa4X, then it is misleading - a lie - a fraud. (the customer should know about this!!!!!!!!)
I am loyal to my Korg Pa4X and I am happy with it.
1 place before Ketron SD9, Genos ....
Universal, more adaptable.
Well Korg Pa5X from IMPERFECT. Despite the newer and better sounds and that's where it ends.
It has more faults and flaws than all its predecessors combined.
Korg is on the move to repair its REPUTATION and damage to its name.
I would like to have a reliable Korg Pa5X, sequencer, chord recognition from MIDI, Style Creator Boot, import Pa4X backup to Pa5X still not possible !!!!!! not even in OS 1.1.0!!!!!...., and everything missing from Pa4X.
For now, I and many musicians are just waiting for the Pa5X to be as good as the pa4x.


Korg states that it is possible to IMPORT backups only from Pa4X, but during my testing it was from other models such as Pa600, Pa900, Pa1000, Pa3X that the import was OK.


So, if people from KORG are not here and they don't care what we write here, that it has no effect on further development, so I am writing you only my opinion and my experience.





At the price of the Pa5X, the Pa5X is definitely not my choice. Pa4X remains at least until September 2023.

Many musicians are waiting for a good Pa5X and are waiting for a Pa4X out of hand.

[rubenwalters]

i had read at the beginning of the release of the pa5x in the explanations of korg that it is a new instrument with a completely new concept. different to the previous pa series.
also i had read that some midi editing functions are no longer mapped in the pa5x because they are available in every DAW and are even easier to handle than in the keyboard.
in the faq the release plan for further functionalities is described.

if it has bugs they will be fixed for sure. for the functionalities it won't be so sure. but the plan is there and i also assume that this will be done. provided that the demand for pa5x still exists.

i adapt my arrangements to the instrument as i did with the pa3x and pa4x and use the functionalities as they are offered.
i can live with the schedule in the faq. i'm rearranging everything with a new instrument anyway because i want to use new sounds and functions. that's why i won't want to load a backup of the pa4x. i want to build everything from scratch.

since no pa5x will be available in the next few months anyway, the bugs will surely be fixed by the time i finally get one.

[rikkisbears]

i had read at the beginning of the release of the pa5x in the explanations of korg that it is a new instrument with a completely new concept. different to the previous pa series.
also i had read that some midi editing functions are no longer mapped in the pa5x because they are available in every DAW and are even easier to handle than in the keyboard.
in the faq the release plan for further functionalities is described.

Hi, I used to do most of my editing for my style conversions in a pc sequencer and finish them off in the korgs themselves, this concept will work ok for me also once they get the bugs fixed
but,
simple things like being able to shorten a variation from 8 bars to 4 , because 8 bars doesn’t quite work, takes a minute to do in Korg , having to export to daw is far more time consuming.

Intro1/ending1 is a joke. Can’t get rid of that stupid chord , progression ie if you export style to pc , put in a new intro 1, import it back back in, the progression is still there, if you import it back into a New Style, you’ve lost all the settings, sounds etc.
Hopefully just a bug.

Being able to have multiple time signatures in a style, editing in a pc doesn’t give you that option back. Hopefully a bug also.

If it’s a new instrument with a new concept, and not a continuation of previous PA’s they shouldn’t have called it a PA5X, the name is misleading.

[rubenwalters]

thank you - I see ... i never had the opportunity to see or play a pa5x live. still no instrument is available here, so I see some vids on youtube (all showing perfect instrument) or here on the forum (full of bug-reports).

On the pa4x i never used such editing functions. you go much deeper into editing than i do. that's why i probably wouldn't notice so many bugs.

I fully agree with the misleading name pa5x.
Overall, from a distance view it maybe the succession of the pa series. But conceptually in depth much is different. they should have declared this difference much more precisely.

[rikkisbears]

Hi Ruben,
for me style converting/editing is only a hobby, I’ve had all the major brands over the last 35 years, Technics, Yamaha, Roland, Ketron and of course Korg.
For me back in 2007 ( pa800) Korg just stood with its style editing functions, it’s style structure, etc.
It will just be disappointing if they don’t reinstate some of the features and editing functions into PA5x.

Am I sorry I bought it, NO, just hope they get the bugs sorted sooner rather than later, and they get their customer base back on side. Roland stopped making high end arrangers a few years back, Technics totally disappeared early 2000, it’s just sad to see what’s happening here.

[taichi]

Korg had the best arrangers and reputation on the planet. That`s why I purchased all three of them. Love them more each day, no regrets at all. The 4X in a class of its own and second entry arrangers 1000 and 700 beat all the competition.

Now korg have the worst reputation via 5X and look like going under. But they could have remained number 1 for several years to come simply by promoting 4X a little and basic updates to 1000 and 700. That would have left Korg completely in charge.

In the meantime they would have had loads of time to give us the future best arranger on the planet. Time for research and proper testing whilst still making profits from their three Pa flagships.

So what happened ? We will never know because Korg don`t talk to us. They visit this site and will have seen over the last year or two the negative, nasty, call them what you will posts here, demanding a new keyboard. The posts here were relentless, slamming and pressurising Korg when we already had good arrangers. In hindsight we should have been happy with what we have plus minor updates as requested.

Korg at this moment could have been ruling the waves but now they are finished because of their decisions. Yamaha and others are waiting in the wings to take over for good.

[Asena]

Well, KORG decided to not do ANYTHING about it.
I know people that Loved to be a KORG,y, now left it, and many does even not care anymore.
Same GM sound, Same Styles, Same old OS that has been improved yes, but in general SAME!

If we take a look at the other brands, Like MEDELI, yes it is a small company, but look how much they offer, if you like to have it as a sampler Its a killer for 700 euros.

And now the EVENT, is dominating, than who knows what YAMAHA will bring on to market, So, i said day 1, and i,m saying again, RIP KORG, there is nothing more we can do , IF they want to be the Best again, it has to be from Scratch,
OR change to more improved things, New Styles, New sounds, new FRE programs to make anything with the KB sound engine/Sampler. Ad more Sample slots than 30, K ad more things that we loved and WORKED on 4X, fix it in the near time not 2024 and maybe this will make you to stay little longer.

People that LOVES and Adores theis KB i have all respect to you, but for people like me, who loves to edit, making new styles sounds etc, This is a disaster to wait for nothing.

[rikkisbears]

And now the EVENT, is dominating, than who knows what YAMAHA will bring on to market,

People that LOVES and Adores theis KB i have all respect to you, but for people like me, who loves to edit, making new styles sounds etc, This is a disaster to wait for nothing.

Hi Asena, I’m sure many of us are frustrated over styles editing/ creation functions, and the sounds etc.

How do you know if the Ketron Event would suit your needs. As far as I’m aware, there isn’t a manual available yet? If there is, like to have a look at it myself. Just finished watching a 4 hr utube clip with AJ. Fell asleep thru some of it, so have to rewatch those bits. Not convinced I’d choose it over the PA5x ( bugs and all). Not sure if it actually samples, though , could be one of the parts I missed.

Ketron website

Quote User Sounds: 2,5 GB free storage in non-volatile Flash memory (1,5 GB for additional Factory Sound Banks – 1 GB for User samples). Sample Editor: up to 8.192 samples (max 6 seconds per sample).

Bit confused on the above.

He did go through the process of creating a style, but , not on editing.

Interesting keyboard, but, without a manual, hard to know what the details are.

Sounds a bit familiar. Eek.

Somehow doubt Yamaha will drastically change whatever keyboard they bring out next. Yamaha owner’s basically seem content with what they have. If they were going to make a dramatic change, I would have thought they would have done it with the Genos. Why change something that works. I would love to see a better style structure.
Yamaha style structure has pretty much been the same for the last 20 plus years. Ssf2 is better than ssf1, but, you you still only have the
2 cv’s for intro’s / endings, and basically only the 1 for variations & fills. It doesn’t recognise the controller for sustain in the styles, not great for creating piano tracks. If it wasn’t for third party developers like Jorgen Sorrenson, who have developed freebie utility programs for the Yamaha range over the years, editing would be almost impossible. You can’t event list a factory style onboard without unlocking it first ( program supplied by Jorgen), you basically need 3rd party programs to get anywhere as far as editing goes.
At least with Korg we’re not totally dependant on a third party person supplying us with programs ( most of which are free) so that we can edit a style. Ok, so we need a Daw for import/export midi file but there are choices.

I love my sx900 , it’s got some great functions, wish Korg had some of them too. When it comes to style structure and editing, I’ll take Korg any day, just be happy when they get a few more of the bugs sorted.
Be ecstatic if they add more of the great functions we had on the earlier korgs.

[taichi]

Only a fool would have got rid of his 4X. Why do it ? What a bad decision you people made. I would rather get rid of my car than my 4X. At home, studio or venues people are knocked out by the sound and performance. Add midi to style converter and simple editing, WOW. What a sensation the 4X is.

So why did a few people on this site get rid of their 4X ? Did they have one in the first place ? Have they got one foot in the Korg camp ? Regular posters praising 5X and Korg are gradually becoming evident and exposed.

At the end of the day love your Pa4X, treasure it for as long as you can.

[rikkisbears]

Only a fool would have got rid of his 4X. Why do it ? What a bad decision you people made. I would rather get rid of my car than my 4X. At home, studio or venues people are knocked out by the sound and performance. Add midi to style converter and simple editing, WOW. What a sensation the 4X is.

So why did a few people on this site get rid of their 4X ? Did they have one in the first place ? Have they got one foot in the Korg camp ? Regular posters praising 5X and Korg are gradually becoming evident and exposed.

At the end of the day love your Pa4X, treasure it for as long as you can.

Hi , used to be a safe thing to do. Pa3x was better than pa800,
Pa 4x was better than Pa3x, one would have assumed PA5x would be better than Pa4x.
This is my 6 th Korg arranger since the early 90’s. Each model has been an improvement on the last. People who sold their PA4x’s to buy PA5x would have assumed the PA5x would be an improvement on the Pa4x. Why wouldn’t one assume that ,going on past history.
I sold my Pa4x 3 years ago, along with my pa3x and the pa800 finally died. Decided to have a temporary change and spend time on a new Yamaha instead. 3 years hasn’t been so temporary though.
If companies don’t bring out new products, and people buy them, guess what, they go broke.