NAMM 2025 Rumor - New flagship incoming?

[thethirdapple]

Regarding KRONOS, Some additional info (confirmation) and pic from NAMM… via JerrytheK, via fb…

https://forums.musicplayer.com/topic/1 ... nt-3029216

…
We took videos but I’ll have to edit it as it was actually quite long. I’ve noted some bulletpoints from our conversations.

KRONOS 3 Initial Findings:
No Fan- quieter for studio work, improved thermal management, no internal moving parts. This in theory will make it more reliable.
New Screen, matte texture- more responsive, no need to use finger nail or stylus. Matte finish that’s more resistant to glare. No controls for brightness
Boot Time with preload PCG that includes the new EXs: 48 seconds vs 2:20 on my Kronos 2. That’s 66% better
3 full program banks…

PEACE
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[stuartpryer]

Hi,

This is my current list of things we know about the new Kronos......

KRONOS - Fourth Generation

Covid and component supply shortages for main board and regulation issues with the power supply meant Kronus 2 was discontinued. Luke Korg uk.

The Kronos 3 Boots in 48 seconds around 3x faster was 220 sec Kronos 2
new chip and main board - Probably Arm chip
No fan - only uses 40w power
120gb ssd - twice Kronos 2 size
NB. Can’t use new main board in Kronos 2 or earlier - Luciano Korg
Uses 32 bit bespoke Linux operating system so RAM limited to 4GB still.

New 8 inch screen - anti-reflection and more responsive due to main boards improved speed and the new touch screen.

Fatar TP/8SK keybed 61 note and RH3 in 73 and 88 note - Keybeds are exactly the same as previous Kronos all with channel after-touch.

Comes with new O.S. 3.2
Bank CC new progs
Bank DD Best of Sound designers libraries progs

Includes italian F piano - a Fazioli, Chopin Piano Pleyel tuned to A430hz.

KRS-08: Best of Triton Bank EE and below Banks CC and DD
KRS-04: Essential Keyboards Splits & Layers
KRS-05: Ensemble Combinations
KRS-06: CX-3 Signature sounds
More multi-samples
Italian (FAZIOLI F 308 concert grand) - Piano Sample (EXs21 SGX-2 Italian F Piano)
256 brand new programs showcasing the new multi-samples

Bank E new combi bank
Bank F new combi bank

Namm units running OS 3.1.5 (January 2025)
Updated OS 3.2.0 and sounds in May 2025 for existing Kronos users too.

All Black powder coated body, black vector joy sticking and dark wood end cheeks
Shipping in May.

KRONOS 61 - £2,649.00 / $2,999.99 US
KRONOS 73 - £2,949.00 / $3,299.99 US
KRONOS 88 - £3,199.00 / $3,599.99 US

see these videos on Kronos 3...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7vizvfDziA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_HTGfFNTv2I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KrmDl1Z2cAs

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=948aJjXZzf0

https://www.guitarcenter.com/KORG/KRONO ... 2PGvbFvM0u

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W4PhQafcjaw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rr2cJSj5WGo


Korg UK and USA Kronos 3 web pages.

https://www.korg.co.uk/products/kronos

https://www.korg.com/us/products/synthesizers/kronos3/


PS. If links don't work just copy and paste into your browser.

cheers

Stu

Fatar 61 note keybed details ....

[KK]

NB. Can’t use new main board in Kronos 2 or earlier - Luciano Korg

If true, that would be really, really stupid from Korg.

[stuartpryer]

Hi,

The new chipset and screen and other daughter boards are all required to work together and that plugging in just a new main board to a Kronos 2 or earlier won't work? The main board chipset and screen are new and will have a different driver set. Not sure about the other daughter boards? It also has a new power supply. Korg would like you to buy a new Kronos 3.

Ive just loaded another video where Luciano from Korg won't reveal the new cpu - he was smiling. Im putting money on an arm processor. He said we will have to wait until 'the first strip down' by a user. The modwave, Wavestate and Opsix use a Raspberry pi.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W4PhQafcjaw

stu

[KK]

Korg would like you to buy a new Kronos 3.

Indeed. Unfortunately, the 2025 version is just a K2 with new sounds and different PS, MOBO and LCD because those old things can't be found anymore. The quicker bootup is rather meh and the argument that the LCD responds quicker is 100 % placebo. I tried what the guy does in the video and my K2 LCD responds just as quick. Also, possibly the only other PCB that may differ in the 2025 version is the OMAP that connects the LCD and includes the security chip for authorization stuff (KLM-3002 in K/KX, KLM-3360 in a K2).

Owners of previous Kronos models paid the big price when they bought their units. IMHO Korg should honor them if they prefer to repair their K, KX or K2 due to a MOBO or LCD problem. In short, the owner of a previous Kronos needing a new MOBO because it died should be able to get the new one, along with a new OMAP PCB if that is also needed. That would still be much less expensive that buying a Kronos v2025. At least, it is likely the new PS is interchangeable. Oh and about guessing what's inside the v2025, I would think they went with some mSATA SSD like in the Nautilus.

[bpoodoo]

The Kronos 3 Boots in 48 seconds around 3x faster was 220 sec Kronos 2

But is the Kronos 3 loading a smaller set of default sound libraries?

[stuartpryer]

Hi,

I reckon it's the same libraries as the Kronos 2 loads at boot. It would not be difficult to speed up the boot time significantly by replacing the old Intel Atom processor with modern Arm processor and faster chip set and that's where the time gains come from.

cheers

Stu

[KK]

Also, some years ago when I updated my K2's SSD to a larger and especially better quality one, with the same amount of libraries loaded (basically at the RAM limit so 0 Mb left) the boot time since then is reduced by 17 seconds. Before = 2:33, now = 2:16.

[SeedyLee]

A few things. Firstly, I very much doubt that they’ve moved to ARM for the simple fact that they are making the updated OS available for the older Kronos 2 - I just couldn’t imagine them doing that if they weren’t sharing a common operating system between the two versions, though anything is possible and I would love to be proven wrong!

The faster boot times I suspect are due to architectural changes, more so than an increase in raw CPU speed. A big part of the previous Kronos’ boot time was cryptographic verification of the operating system at boot time, as well as reading samples and the operating system from the encrypted loopback devices. My guess is that the increase in boot speed is due to software changes, perhaps using UEFI secure boot to verify the kernel, and leveraging CPu cryptographic instruction sets for reading from the loopback devices. In fact, with motivation, the old Kronos could be made to boot in about the same amount of time (using all the factory libraries).

Nice to see there’s no fan - fixing that fan, and the fan noise, was the bane of my ownership of the K1. Turns out it’s not so simple to replace and also be quiet!

I suspect the PSU won’t be interchangeable between the K2 and K3 - given the 40W power draw, down from 60 (and higher with the K1), I’m guessing they will use the same linear power supply as the the Nautilus - which should also be quieter.

Regarding the mainboard, and replacement parts for the K1 and K2, Korg really do need to be better at carrying spares inventory, but they put a lot of the onus for this onto distributors. For what it’s worth, the Australia distributor seem to be pretty good by comparison, and last time I checked they did have access to replacement motherboards for the K2. In fact, my K2 is still under warranty, so they’d better!

Finally, surprised to see it has a Fatar action in the 61 key version - my understanding is that the original Kronos 61 used an in-house action that Korg inherited from the now defunct Technics, whereby they also took over the tooling. This would be a change and the first time in a long time that Korg have used a Fatar action. I believe the M3, Krome, Kross and Kronos have all used the in-house action?

[stuartpryer]

Hi,

Here are my thoughts.

Firstly Luciano from Korg USA refers to the 61 note keybed as being an SK keybed. Fatar make the TP8/SK 61 note keybed, a premium keybed. So it's the SK bit which might suggest its Fatar. I could be wrong. I know other big manufacturers use this one.

The Intel Atom processor is no longer made so unless Korg use a batch of old processors then I can't see it being one of them. The closest processor made like an Atom is something like an Intel N4000/N75. The low power consumption might suggest an Arm processor but it could be a low end Intel but the unit only uses 40w max. Luciano would not commit so its wait and see till the first strip down. People have hacked the Kronos and got fast boot times using a modern processor and chipset without any significant change to the operating system. The Opsix, Wavestate and ModWave use a Raspberry Pi processor so Korg might have moved away from Intel? Just my guesswork. We really need to see inside the new Kronos. I really hope they don't solder in the SSD drive?

All of this is detective work at the moment.

Cheers

Stu

[SeedyLee]

I’d be happy if it was a Fatar keybed in the new Kronos to be sure, but it’s a deeper mechanical design with the fulcrum point further recessed than the one used in previous models. Korg’s website still has the 61 key model as being the “natural touch” 61, the same moniker they’ve used in the past.

I thought the natural touch keybed was quite nice to play on previous models, but it wasn’t as robust as I would like.

I’m trying to find the article about Korg taking over Technics keyboard manufacturing facility about 15 years ago. If Korg have in fact being manufacturing their own 61 note Keynes, I wonder if that’s still viable? Whilst they manufacture their own keybeds for the Kross, Microkorg, Modwave etc, they all use a completely different unsprung design, and 61 keys is definitely not as common as it was nearly two decades ago! Manufacturing the sprung 61 key keybed for the Kronos, Nautilus and SE models probably doesn’t make financial sense any longer? Just speculating.

As for a move to ARM, it is worth noting that the Nautilus also has 40W of power draw using an Asrock IMB-140D, which interestingly is EOL.

People in the past have certainly achieved faster boot times by swapping the motherboard and/or SSD but not to the degree here. The issue isn’t data transfer speeds, or the CPU’s ability to process a few gigabytes of data quickly: it’s the encryption. I modded my Kronos 1 to copy the encrypted loopback devices to regular block storage, and was able to achieve boot times around the one minute mark with no change to the factory SSD or motherboard. I suspect modern CPUs have a far richer instruction set, as well as secure boot, to handle such things much more transparently and I am _guessing_ that is where the speed gains come from (and Korg would get these benefits just by running a new kernel).

[BlackForest]

Yes, I am still working on the new modern-OS rewrite of the KARMA software, with a completely new modern look and the ability to run as a plugin. I will have more to say about that at some point in the future.

Just to leave Stephen's announcement not completely uncommented...great to see!!

[nitecrawler]

[/quote]It's true I said this in the past, awhile ago, but I could not comment on recent developments - until now. There's no "further development" on the version of KARMA in it - but it's the same KARMA that's always been in there. Which I'm happy about. I had the new one here, to put a new remix of my Challenger demo in it, and it's a beauty.
[/quote]

Look forward to seeing what you have in store.