Korg Forums

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 6:52 pm**

McHale wrote: The "Analog Tune" (simulates oscillator drift) setting that the RADIAS has: Should be a standard parameter on all engines as it makes a huge difference when trying to create analog-like sounds without using a VA.

From what I can tell, the THICKNESS parameter is the equivalent.

"Unison voices will be detuned in an asymmetric way, increasing the complexity of the detune, and changing the way in which the different pitches beat against one another. This creates an effect similar to vintage analog synthesizers, in which oscillators were frequently slightly out of tune. Higher numbers increase the effect."

This is part of the UNISON section includes # of VOICES, DETUNE, STEREO SPREAD and THICKNESS. These are found in the COMMON PARAMETERS in the HD-1 and most of the EXis (not in CX-3 for example).

Busch.

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 7:10 pm**

burningbusch wrote: From what I can tell, the THICKNESS parameter is the equivalent.

"Unison voices will be detuned in an asymmetric way, increasing the complexity of the detune, and changing the way in which the different pitches beat against one another. This creates an effect similar to vintage analog synthesizers, in which oscillators were frequently slightly out of tune. Higher numbers increase the effect."

This is part of the UNISON section includes # of VOICES, DETUNE, STEREO SPREAD and THICKNESS. These are found in the COMMON PARAMETERS in the HD-1 and most of the EXis (not in CX-3 for example).

This does sound similar and possibly more controllable (except that it specifies unison voices only). I don't understand why the Triton, M50 or M3 doesn't have this parameter. The "Analog Tune" parameter of the RADIAS and EXB-RADIAS is just a simple setting of amount of drift and it gets randomly applied to any voice. It's effect is amazing.

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:03 pm**

McHale wrote:There are LOTS of features through the years that they have left out of the Kronos. I used to assume that newer synths would have all the features (especially the easy ones) from previous synths. Nope.

Here are a few easy to implement features that come to mind:[/quote]

I have good news about several of these.

McHale wrote:The Chord Memory feature: you'd be surprised how neat this feature is.

I agree; it's cool! It's also on the OASYS and KRONOS. From "Using Chord Mode" in the OASYS Operation Guide:

Chord mode lets you choose one of the chords assigned to the Pads, and then play it from the keyboard. The chord is transposed according to the note that you play; the played note specifies the lowest note of the chord, and the higher notes are transposed to match. As when playing chords from the Pads themselves, each note in the chord can have a different stored velocity, scaled by the played note.

In addition to using the on‐screen parameters, you can turn Chord mode on and off via SW1/2 or the Foot Switch, and change chords simply by pressing the Pads. In Combination and Sequencer modes, you can make these settings for each Timbre or Track, as desired. Naturally, you can control all of this via MIDI as well.

Chord mode can duplicate the way that similar features worked on classic analog synths (such as the original Polysix), but it can also use all of the Voice Assign options to create different effects–such as mono legato chords with fingered portamento, or poly chords that overlap one another.

Finally, note that you don’t have to use Chord mode to play full chords; you can also use it to create more subtle effects, such as stacked octaves or fifths. You can even adjust the relative levels of these additional pitches via the stored velocities of the individual chord notes.

McHale wrote:Live Mono/Poly switching: When you switched from poly to mono, it layered and slightly detuned all the voices. This is one of my most missed features of the DW-8000.

On the OASYS and KRONOS, unison (including number of voices, detune etc.) is programmable, polyphonic, and can be turned on and off from a front panel button via Tone Adjust.

McHale wrote:The "Analog Tune" (simulates oscillator drift) setting that the RADIAS has: Should be a standard parameter on all engines as it makes a huge difference when trying to create analog-like sounds without using a VA.

Random tuning is a standard parameter, available to all engines.

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:05 pm**

Hand drawn waveform isn't here. oh shoot!

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:09 pm**

danatkorg wrote:Chord mode lets you choose one of the chords assigned to the Pads, and then play it from the keyboard. The chord is transposed according to the note that you play; the played note specifies the lowest note of the chord, and the higher notes are transposed to match. As when playing chords from the Pads themselves, each note in the chord can have a different stored velocity, scaled by the played note.

In addition to using the on‐screen parameters, you can turn Chord mode on and off via SW1/2 or the Foot Switch, and change chords simply by pressing the Pads. In Combination and Sequencer modes, you can make these settings for each Timbre or Track, as desired. Naturally, you can control all of this via MIDI as well.

Chord mode can duplicate the way that similar features worked on classic analog synths (such as the original Polysix), but it can also use all of the Voice Assign options to create different effects–such as mono legato chords with fingered portamento, or poly chords that overlap one another.

Finally, note that you don’t have to use Chord mode to play full chords; you can also use it to create more subtle effects, such as stacked octaves or fifths. You can even adjust the relative levels of these additional pitches via the stored velocities of the individual chord notes.

I know you're not used to such things from me

but many thanks for this info! Didn't know about it

And could be really useful for me. Just shows how much thought and engineering went into these boards.

So just in case you've fallen off your chair

, here it is again - Many thanks Dan!

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:13 pm**

burningbusch wrote:The screen resolution on the Kronos is a significant improvement over previous Korg screens:

Kronos: 800 X 600, 8" screen
OASYS: 640 x 480, 10.4" screen
M3: 320 X 240, 5.7" screen
Roland G: 800 x 480, 8.5" screen
iPad: 1024 x 768, 9.7" screen

It would be interesting if Korg could provide the pixel per inch (ppi) on the Kronos. It's not going to match the iPad's 132 ppi but it's going to be very good--the best in any workstation keyboard.

Busch.

Doing some simple maths with screen size, pixel account in each side and pixel ratio between sides (assuming square pixels):
For 1024x768 and 9.7" (iPad): 132 ppi
For 800 x 600 and 8" (Kronos): 125 ppi

Rgds.

Posted: **Sun Feb 20, 2011 8:14 pm**

danatkorg wrote:I have good news about several of these.

Holy crap. That is good news. I don't know how anyone could NOT want to buy a Kronos. I was under the impression that those were only available to specific engines (chord mode - PolySix, Analog Tune - AL-1, etc.).

Thanks for the info. This (sadly) really brightened my day!

-Mc

p.s. now how about that 73/76 key semi-weighted.

Posted: **Wed Feb 23, 2011 4:06 pm**

Moss resonant osc
Ability to load Legacy m1 patches
Ability to load Legacy wavestation patches
Ability to load Wavestation sysex
Ability to load Wavestation wavesequences
Ability to load Korg karma patches / ge's etc

In general the big issue i have is that i spend years programming these synths and building sound collections then they release a new synth with all the old waveforms + and very similiar structures and yet zero backward compatability on some level to old libraries where patches are concerned.

I have a huge collection of wavestation wavesequences which wont load in anything and yet the Kronos does wavesequencing and has all the old presets ?

I think the Korg legacy / m1 patch archive again is a huge resource
which should have been added onto the Kronos , it has a unique flavour and an M1 engine in the Kronos would have nailed it for me but we always want a little more dont we .

Posted: **Wed Feb 23, 2011 11:40 pm**

McHale wrote:
robinkle wrote:I dunno how it worked though. Hand drawn waveforms on such an old synth. This time we have a display, and Korg have yet to use the potential of the huge colour touch display.
You would slider the slider up and down for a couple seconds. You could get some really interesting sounds that way. I actually really liked this feature.

I still have my DSS-1. You can get some unique tones by drawing your own waveforms. But I think a problem is that you don't really know how you should move the slider to get a particular tone that you might be going for. That is, for a given tone you want, how do you know what the waveform should look like? (Aside from the obvious rule that moving the slider up and down faster produces more high overtones.) It seems it's better used as a trial-and-error type of thing, like a random patch generator.
I think a more practical approach is additive, were you can more directly add the harmonics you think you want. For example, Camel Audio's Alchemy has a good additive engine and GUI for this.

Posted: **Thu Feb 24, 2011 5:02 pm**

JimH wrote:
McHale wrote:
robinkle wrote:I dunno how it worked though. Hand drawn waveforms on such an old synth. This time we have a display, and Korg have yet to use the potential of the huge colour touch display.
You would slider the slider up and down for a couple seconds. You could get some really interesting sounds that way. I actually really liked this feature.
I still have my DSS-1. You can get some unique tones by drawing your own waveforms. But I think a problem is that you don't really know how you should move the slider to get a particular tone that you might be going for. That is, for a given tone you want, how do you know what the waveform should look like? (Aside from the obvious rule that moving the slider up and down faster produces more high overtones.) It seems it's better used as a trial-and-error type of thing, like a random patch generator.
I think a more practical approach is additive, were you can more directly add the harmonics you think you want. For example, Camel Audio's Alchemy has a good additive engine and GUI for this.

I see what you mean. But I'm thinking that when you can see the waveform you are making on a huge display, you will learn how to make the tone you want. There is a theoretical explanation to why the waveform sounds like it does, and you could use that knowledge to edit the waveform and get what you are after, the same way you do FM synthesis and other types.

Now I got even more ideas.. When the waveform is built up on certain grid, like a chess board, you can have one point(an edge of the waveform) to modulate from A1 to D5 as an example, so you can shape the waveform over time. with envelopes or LFOs. That would be super!

Posted: **Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:16 pm**

EXer wrote:What's missing in Kronos:

¤ [...]

The Kronos has several synthesis engines: S&S, VA, physical modelling (although some important algorithms like brass and reed instruments that were included in the Z1/MOSS board are missing), phase mod. (aka FM), but an important one is missing, that Korg has already implemented in the DSS-1:

¤ additive synthesis, with advanced specs such as you could find on a Kawai K5000 (the best additive synth !) that let you control the harmonic content of the sound over time in a very refined way, enhanced with advanced editing possibilities on the large touch screen and with a resynthesis function.

Posted: **Thu Feb 24, 2011 11:27 pm**

danatkorg wrote:
McHale wrote:
McHale wrote:The Chord Memory feature: you'd be surprised how neat this feature is.
I agree; it's cool! It's also on the OASYS and KRONOS. From "Using Chord Mode" in the OASYS Operation Guide:

Chord mode lets you choose one of the chords assigned to the Pads, and then play it from the keyboard. The chord is transposed according to the note that you play; the played note specifies the lowest note of the chord, and the higher notes are transposed to match. As when playing chords from the Pads themselves, each note in the chord can have a different stored velocity, scaled by the played note.
I currently use chord mode on my M3 for a situation where I need to play a chord that is too wide to play withn one hand ('cos the other hand is playing my other keyboard)... will the Kronos be able to offer a matching feature where some of the keys (in place of pads on the M3) could play an entirey different programmed chord?

Posted: **Fri Feb 25, 2011 12:57 am**

DaveBoulden wrote:
danatkorg wrote:
McHale wrote:The Chord Memory feature: you'd be surprised how neat this feature is.
I agree; it's cool! It's also on the OASYS and KRONOS. From "Using Chord Mode" in the OASYS Operation Guide:

Chord mode lets you choose one of the chords assigned to the Pads, and then play it from the keyboard. The chord is transposed according to the note that you play; the played note specifies the lowest note of the chord, and the higher notes are transposed to match. As when playing chords from the Pads themselves, each note in the chord can have a different stored velocity, scaled by the played note.
I currently use chord mode on my M3 for a situation where I need to play a chord that is too wide to play withn one hand ('cos the other hand is playing my other keyboard)... will the Kronos be able to offer a matching feature where some of the keys (in place of pads on the M3) could play an entirey different programmed chord?

Kronos already has a "virtual pad" mode where the surface of the touchscreen is converted into 8 pads that work like those on the M3/OASYS. You can do the same things with them: assign chords to them (up to 8 notes simultaneously per pad), trigger KARMA sequences, send note/CC data, etc.

In the shots I've seen of the UI, the pads are laid horizontally across the screen; they're long, vertical rectangles instead of squares. Since the screen isn't velocity-sensitive, the vertical axis of each pad is mapped to velocity. Touch the top of the pad for maximum velocity, the bottom for minimum, and everything in between. There's also an on-screen switch to disable the velocity function, IIRC.

Posted: **Fri Feb 25, 2011 1:11 am**

Cool, that does the job I need it to then!

Posted: **Fri Feb 25, 2011 9:18 am**

EXer wrote:

¤ additive synthesis, with advanced specs such as you could find on a Kawai K5000 (the best additive synth !) that let you control the harmonic content of the sound over time in a very refined way, enhanced with advanced editing possibilities on the large touch screen and with a resynthesis function.

+1

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Whats missing in KRONOS..

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