Kronos first hand impressions

GregC · Post by **GregC** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:12 am

Synthoid wrote:So this means the Kronos has hit stores there?

Oops....never mind. I didn't read the whole post.

how about you edit your post for accuracy.

Synthoid · Post by **Synthoid** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:26 am

I was going to, then saw an online music dealer stating the Kronos will be in stock on March 13.

http://www.americanmusical.com/Item--i- ... NOS61-LIST

McHale · Post by **McHale** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:30 am

Synthoid wrote:I was going to, then saw an online music dealer stating the Kronos will be in stock on March 13.

http://www.americanmusical.com/Item--i- ... NOS61-LIST

They're wrong. It's been confirmed already...

GregC · Post by **GregC** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:37 am

Synthoid wrote:I was going to, then saw an online music dealer stating the Kronos will be in stock on March 13.

http://www.americanmusical.com/Item--i- ... NOS61-LIST

c'mon Scott. I know you don't believe everything you read on Internet retail sites.

Us folks that have pre-ordered know the latest & have the facts.

Mis-information is not our friend.

Randelph · Post by **Randelph** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:01 am

Unicorn wrote:

3d party involvement doesn't just mean Korg buying great sound libraries and including them in the purchase price.

3d party involvement could also mean Korg entering into some kind of partnership, like Yamaha did with Keyfax to create Motifator.com, so that there's a marketplace for 3d party sounds.

This seems like a no-brainer to me: because the interested 3d party has something to gain, like Keyfax, a lot of the work and the running of the site falls to a 3d party. Meanwhile, there's a Korg sanctioned place for 3d party sounds/samples/etc. to flourish; non-official sites don't tend to do as well. Or, to take another example: look at the Apple store- 3d party apps are a large part of Apples success.

Randelph · Post by **Randelph** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:02 am

Unicorn wrote:

KORG, please hear me - you guys still have an opportunity of building up a game changer if you get the Third Party partnerships right. Think of KARO, NI, OWD and so many good firms around who know how to record and program sample based instruments.

3d party involvement doesn't just mean Korg buying great sound libraries and including them in the purchase price.

3d party involvement could also mean Korg entering into some kind of partnership, like Yamaha did with Keyfax to create Motifator.com, so that there's a marketplace for 3d party sounds.

This seems like a no-brainer to me: because the interested 3d party has something to gain, like Keyfax, a lot of the work and the running of the site falls to a 3d party. Meanwhile, there's a Korg sanctioned place for 3d party sounds/samples/etc. to flourish; non-official sites don't tend to do as well. Or, to take another example: look at the Apple store- 3d party apps are a large part of Apples success.

Synthoid · Post by **Synthoid** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:10 am

GregC wrote:c'mon Scott. I know you don't believe everything you read on Internet retail sites.

Exactly.

Obviously this information is incorrect... but I didn't know that an hour ago. With all the information flying around about the Kronos, it's hard to know what to believe.

Unicorn · Post by **Unicorn** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:04 am

Randelph wrote:Unicorn wrote:
KORG, please hear me - you guys still have an opportunity of building up a game changer if you get the Third Party partnerships right. Think of KARO, NI, OWD and so many good firms around who know how to record and program sample based instruments.
3d party involvement doesn't just mean Korg buying great sound libraries and including them in the purchase price.

3d party involvement could also mean Korg entering into some kind of partnership, like Yamaha did with Keyfax to create Motifator.com, so that there's a marketplace for 3d party sounds.

This seems like a no-brainer to me: because the interested 3d party has something to gain, like Keyfax, a lot of the work and the running of the site falls to a 3d party. Meanwhile, there's a Korg sanctioned place for 3d party sounds/samples/etc. to flourish; non-official sites don't tend to do as well. Or, to take another example: look at the Apple store- 3d party apps are a large part of Apples success.

Exactly.. Otherwise after using and abusing it for first 3-4 months it will (I know, it WILL) sit in the corner like just another expensive boxed/ closed ended sound module with no expandability, the way it happened with Oasys (6-7 expansions in 4 years for a 8000$ workstation including the crappy Str1 and substandard HD1 when KONTAKT sells for just 400$? That's bull****). KORG is not good at keeping the users excited with new sounds at good frequency. Plus, they are running a risk of being sold (speculations on this forum).

The facts are: KORG has not pre-announced/ promised any expansions (learning from Oasys in a rather bad way, they are trying to fool users once again, a large number them this time by reaching the consumer segment!!), plus, they have not opened up the platform. No user samples/ 3rd party libraries. Thanks to KARO helped the buggers in the past.

Why only KARO? Do they have a special and exclusive commercial arrangement with KORG?

GiantSonicRobot · Post by **GiantSonicRobot** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 8:21 am

Unicorn wrote:Why only KARO? Do they have a special and exclusive commercial arrangement with KORG?

I suppose that the OASYS simply didn't sell in numbers anywhere near what's necessary to create a good business opportunity for third party companies. Consequently, almost no one got on board. Why should they?
With Kronos however, being sold at a price point which suggests much higher numbers in unit sales, the situation will be different. There will be much more interest from third party vendors to create products.

Dannyboy · Post by **Dannyboy** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:06 am

McHale wrote:You wrote that whole thing on your iPhone? You probably need a nap after writing all that!

Thanks for the quick review...

Yep that was exactly what I did. And I found out today at wake up that this post has already 2 pages. Will try to catch up during the day.

ozy wrote: being under oath, albeit not totally sound of mind,

I hereby declare the following:

“Dannyboy” is NOT, repeat NOT, a nickname I use for posting my reviews twice.

Yep I can confirm I am not ozy

danatkorg wrote: Something was miscommunicated here, apparently. VMT is not supported with user samples.

Thank you Dan. I knew (if anything, from reading your remarks on the subject in this Forum) Mirbella was not accurate on this; on the other hand I did not want to argue with him, since he did an excellent preview overall (always IMHO).

And Dan: many many congratulations to the developing team for this astonishing piece of gear.

robbinhood wrote:Im gonna assume "gates of mordor" is probably the most epic, mind-blowing preset ever created?

I don't think I have said that; only that I liked that Combi and wanted to have it on the Kronos as well (which, as Dan confirmed, is exactly what happens).

And what you hear in that YouTube video is so far from the massive sound you actually get out of the OASYS (and arguably Kronos), that should warn everybody once again NOT to judge how a keyboard sounds out of YouTube videos.

Unicorn wrote:Thank you for confirming the issues with the quality of HD1

Did not say there is an issue; just reported that from what I heard (in a very noisy environment) this looked like the very same OASYS samples (at least for brass and strings, but I might be wrong) and therefore the same criticism applied.

Also I think this is due partly to the fact that the other MODEL engines are so different from the rompler concept that when you hear HD1 you think "oh well this is not so cool as the other stuff I heard" and in fact HD1 was sort of relegated by Mirabella at the end of the presentation.

For example, there was an ethnic instrument simulated by STR-1. I did not recognize what instrument it was but I can tell you that it looked like someone was plucking the instrument in front of you (and I never got the same impression before). Very very nice engine.

More later.

-------
Dan

Rosen Sound · Post by **Rosen Sound** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:42 am

Dannyboy wrote:
robbinhood wrote:Im gonna assume "gates of mordor" is probably the most epic, mind-blowing preset ever created?
I don't think I have said that; only that I liked that Combi and wanted to have it on the Kronos as well (which, as Dan confirmed, is exactly what happens).

And what you hear in that YouTube video is so far from the massive sound you actually get out of the OASYS (and arguably Kronos), that should warn everybody once again NOT to judge how a keyboard sounds out of YouTube videos.

Youre trying to tell me that a patch called GATES OF MORDOR shouldnt be assumed to be the most incredible thing ever?!
MORDORRR

Citizen Klaus · Post by **Citizen Klaus** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 4:36 pm

Unicorn wrote:Exactly.. Otherwise after using and abusing it for first 3-4 months it will (I know, it WILL) sit in the corner like just another expensive boxed/ closed ended sound module with no expandability, the way it happened with Oasys (6-7 expansions in 4 years for a 8000$ workstation including the crappy Str1 and substandard HD1 when KONTAKT sells for just 400$? That's bull****). KORG is not good at keeping the users excited with new sounds at good frequency. Plus, they are running a risk of being sold (speculations on this forum).

Why whould Korg be obligated to continually provide users with new samples or synth engines for free when virtually no other manufacturer does that?

The facts are: KORG has not pre-announced/ promised any expansions (learning from Oasys in a rather bad way, they are trying to fool users once again, a large number them this time by reaching the consumer segment!!),

Fooling users?

Korg has announced what will be available at launch; nothing more. The only people who could get "fooled" by that are people who somehow believe that buying a workstation entitles them to continuous freebies.

Where did this idea come from that Korg should ply its customer base with continuous updates when, for the entire history of the electronic keyboard/synthesizer industry, virtually nobody has done so? (There have been a few isolated exceptions, but the industry as a whole generally follows this pattern -- including the DAW/softsynth sector.) Granted, lately more manufacturers have been releasing OS updates for their synths and workstations, but these generally just add little functions here and there, not huge sample libraries or new synth engines.

Otherwise, it has nearly always been the case that you buy what's in the box, and then later buy the successor model if you want improvements.

plus, they have not opened up the platform. No user samples/ 3rd party libraries. Thanks to KARO helped the buggers in the past.

Why only KARO? Do they have a special and exclusive commercial arrangement with KORG?

Huh?

The Kronos suppports user samples just fine. They just have to be loaded into sample RAM rather than use disk streaming. And there are plenty of companies that have put out OASYS samples besides KARO. You just have to do a google search.

Unicorn · Post by **Unicorn** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:50 pm

Citizen Klaus wrote:
Unicorn wrote:Exactly.. Otherwise after using and abusing it for first 3-4 months it will (I know, it WILL) sit in the corner like just another expensive boxed/ closed ended sound module with no expandability, the way it happened with Oasys (6-7 expansions in 4 years for a 8000$ workstation including the crappy Str1 and substandard HD1 when KONTAKT sells for just 400$? That's bull****). KORG is not good at keeping the users excited with new sounds at good frequency. Plus, they are running a risk of being sold (speculations on this forum).
Why whould Korg be obligated to continually provide users with new samples or synth engines for free when virtually no other manufacturer does that?

Even in the old O1/W days these machines were expandable and it is more a common sense and a general expectation that the machine in 2011 HAS to be expandable. The "Game Changer" (disk streaming) is useless if user samples can be run only from RAM, which is fundamentally limited to the size of 2GB. So all that KRONOS will stream from disk is the crappy old KORG samples. Quality of HD1 is a deal breaker to me. If it is not for you, go and buy it my friend.

cello · Post by **cello** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 9:55 pm

Citizen Klaus wrote:Why whould Korg be obligated to continually provide users with new samples or synth engines for free when virtually no other manufacturer does that?

Unless of course they happened to call the instrument 'Open' and categorically state there would be updates/upgrades. Care for an EXf anyone?

And they actually build a button (paying for the hardware and it's installation) and state in the manual that it is for future functionality.

danatkorg · Post by **danatkorg** » Mon Mar 07, 2011 10:45 pm

Hi Neil,

cello wrote:
Citizen Klaus wrote:Why whould Korg be obligated to continually provide users with new samples or synth engines for free when virtually no other manufacturer does that?
Unless of course they happened to call the instrument 'Open' and categorically state there would be updates/upgrades. Care for an EXf anyone?

And they actually build a button (paying for the hardware and it's installation) and state in the manual that it is for future functionality.

As you've noted, you bought your OASYS on the used market in September 2010, months after the announcement of discontinuation. At the time, you even wrote explicitly:

cello wrote:Don't care about the arguments about whether it's supported or not, or discontinued or whatever - like a cello, you use it for the instrument that it is - not what it might be or could be or should be... and I can't wait!

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... 367#347367

Re updates: there were many; see my previous replies on the subject.

Re the Function button: see my earlier posts on the subject.

Best regards,

Dan