Korg Forums

burningbusch wrote:

Bruce Lychee wrote:Using keyswitches isn't great for live playing. It is extremely useful for recording however and would make complete sense on a workstation like the Kronos. At the very least more articulations should be available.

As for the Jupiter, I don't think people really understand how different the articulations are from programs like EastWest or Kontakt. They function very differently and SN articulations are much more suited to playing.

For recording, keyswitches are completely unnecessary as you can use Program Change to instantly get any program within the Kronos. All are available at any time. This is very different from software-based samplers. You plop a PC into the sequence just as you would a keyswitch note.

We don't have any details about the Korg Legendary Strings library but if it's a semi-serious attempt it should have either sections or numerous articulations or possibly both.

I think I have a pretty good handle on how the JP80 works. I do see (and have only found in my demoing) only a "Strings" for ensemble strings listed with sustain, staccato, pizz and tremolo articulations. That's pretty basic stuff, the kind of thing you'd expect from really any ROMpler. I'm hoping the Karo/Korg string libraries are several notches up from this.

You know the articulations you find in pro string libraries (marcato, spiccato, con sordino, détaché, crescendos & diminuendos, fortepiano, sforzato, legato, portato, staccato...) are included because they are in the scores. Working with these articulations can be a PITA, but it makes all the difference in the world when they are properly applied in the music.

Busch.

Hi BB - Bruce is right, the JP is entirely different to simply selecting 'arcticulations'. Most of the things you list are actually dynamics and technique.

How the JP works is determines dynamically, which effect/articulation/dynamic you are actually playing and responds. For example, the SN acoustic cello on the JP (there are only 2) and you can change to 3 techniques (normal, staccato and pizz). You then have two swtiches ch that can add marcato to any of those listed above.

However, I can get col legno without selecting such a setting - cos there isn't one. It simply happen by me playing it in a certain way within a passage. It's enormously clever. How it treats synth and acoustic brass is (no pun intended) breath-taking!

To return topic to Karo libraries - I have the KSL for the OASYS and they are astonishingly good. And yes, there are dozens and dozens of different 'articulations' for each sound - ie philharmonic strings, quartet, chamber, vienna; way too may to list! Then there are all the individual instruments at different dynamics and articulations. The quality is excellent and I regularly use the sounds.

Word of caution however from an old O user - if you use the on board seq, don't compose a song with onboard sounds then decide to load up Karo libraries to get 'that violin sound'. Doesn't work. The KSL is so large it more or less takes up the whole memory so wipes the onboard multisamples (KSF) so your already recorded tracks don't sound as they should (ie they longer use the onboard samples, they use the Karo ones).

Vice versa applies!

aron wrote: To me there are plenty of other cool reason to use the Jupiter besides the "acoustic" emulations.

What would those reasons be, if not the acoustic emulations, one of the core feature on that instrument?
But that discussion definitely doesn't belong here, so I don't expect an answer/opinion.

It's in general synthesizers where it belongs and has amazingly very little posts.

cello wrote:
Hi BB - Bruce is right, the JP is entirely different to simply selecting 'arcticulations'. Most of the things you list are actually dynamics and technique.

How the JP works is determines dynamically, which effect/articulation/dynamic you are actually playing and responds. For example, the SN acoustic cello on the JP (there are only 2) and you can change to 3 techniques (normal, staccato and pizz). You then have two swtiches ch that can add marcato to any of those listed above.

However, I can get col legno without selecting such a setting - cos there isn't one. It simply happen by me playing it in a certain way within a passage. It's enormously clever. How it treats synth and acoustic brass is (no pun intended) breath-taking!

To return topic to Karo libraries - I have the KSL for the OASYS and they are astonishingly good. And yes, there are dozens and dozens of different 'articulations' for each sound - ie philharmonic strings, quartet, chamber, vienna; way too may to list! Then there are all the individual instruments at different dynamics and articulations. The quality is excellent and I regularly use the sounds.

Word of caution however from an old O user - if you use the on board seq, don't compose a song with onboard sounds then decide to load up Karo libraries to get 'that violin sound'. Doesn't work. The KSL is so large it more or less takes up the whole memory so wipes the onboard multisamples (KSF) so your already recorded tracks don't sound as they should (ie they longer use the onboard samples, they use the Karo ones).

Vice versa applies!

Thanks, for that info. I wish I was more knocked out by the overall sound of the ensemble strings on the JP80. Plus, some things like staccato just don't sound right to me. I noticed you reference the cello. I was under the impression the solo instruments like violin and cello have more expression capabilities then the ensemble. Is that incorrect?

Ensemble strings are the heart and soul of the orchestra. Kurzweil understands this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PakObEhD ... re=related

BTW, the Karo libraries for the Kronos are EXs Expansion Sample Series, so they are played from the SSD. There should be no need to load/unload.

Busch.

I would add that the libraries include the dynamic 'articulations' as well as things like runs because, while you can emulate them using MIDI, most people feel they just don't sound the same as having the instrument(s) actually play them.

Busch.

burningbusch wrote:I noticed you reference the cello. I was under the impression the solo instruments like violin and cello have more expression capabilities then the ensemble. Is that incorrect?

Ensemble strings are the heart and soul of the orchestra. Kurzweil understands this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PakObEhD ... re=related

BTW, the Karo libraries for the Kronos are EXs Expansion Sample Series, so they are played from the SSD. There should be no need to load/unload.

Busch.

The solo instruments do have more expression capabilities, yes.

Forgot about the SSD

To be honest, that youtube video doesn't do the instrument justice. I think more than anything it's the piece that's being played that doesn't help!

Yeah, it sounds... too flat and sterile, even if we discount the fact that there's not enough reverb on that demo.

burningbusch wrote:BTW, the Karo libraries for the Kronos are EXs Expansion Sample Series, so they are played from the SSD.

How did Karo create an EXs?
Have Korg provided them with a software tool to convert a multisample into an EXs?
If so, could Korg release that software so that Kronos users could create their own EXs from user samples so that they could be streamed from SSD, or, even better, could Korg include that function into the sampler features of the Kronos?

I believe Karo is working closely with Korg in order to create an EXs. That is, Karo provides samples and programming, and Korg does the rest to make it an EXs.

EXer wrote: If so, could Korg release that software so that Kronos users could create their own EXs from user samples so that they could be streamed from SSD, or, even better, could Korg include that function into the sampler features of the Kronos?

I doubt Korg will ever do this. Korg wants to make sure all of the existing Korg content that streams from SSD works perfectly (pianos and drums).

It's not a problem to put a faster SSD inside to ensure better streaming speeds.

..."To be honest, that youtube video doesn't do the instrument justice. I think more than anything it's the piece that's being played that doesn't help!..."

Actually, in general, its the AMP envelope more than anything, as well the playing.

If the EX12 "Austrian Piano" is actually a Bosendorfer (Imperial?) then $249 is money very well spent to have this.

I can scrape together $249 for a Bosendorfer sound library but actually purchasing a real Bosendorfer is not something I foresee in my immediate (or long term) future.

Was the prices announced for any other EX-es than drum library? I don't see where you read the price of EX12 is 249$

Arp_ wrote:Was the prices announced for any other EX-es than drum library? I don't see where you read the price of EX12 is 249$

Actually I didn't.... I made the (stupid?) assumption that each EX sound library would cost the same.