New KORG PA3X Le!!

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Mon Sep 22, 2014 1:35 pm

Hi Antony

Ahh... the thing that comes to mind is that it will affect the sounding chords especially when we play lets say 2 note lower pieces (not intended to be part of chord) where the chord should only be triggered by 3 notes and when the chord is a minor, a major could result....

Hmmmmmm... very limiting

thanx

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Mon Sep 22, 2014 2:01 pm

Veren wrote:what frustrates is that there is no separate effects for upper that is not affected by styles and sts's.
thanx.

Wrong ... you can assign an effect slot exclusively for any STS lower or any of 3 upper sounds using FXB / Insert FX and
assigning track to lower or any or all !
RIC ... is this an acronym

As concerning about fingered mode 3 , Ted & me were very clear there :
http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/ ... ce90a5898c

DonM · Post by **DonM** » Mon Sep 22, 2014 7:29 pm

I have protested vehemently on the 900 forum about the lack of fingered 3 chord recognition. I was waiting to see the PA4x when it arrives, but i will not consider it if it lacks this feature.
DonM

Fransman · Post by **Fransman** » Mon Sep 22, 2014 7:50 pm

DonM wrote:I have protested vehemently on the 900 forum about the lack of fingered 3 chord recognition. I was waiting to see the PA4x when it arrives, but i will not consider it if it lacks this feature.
DonM

I always play in fingered 3 chord recognition mode, so for me this is also a very serious issue.
I was considering to maybe step over to PA900 or PA3XLE somewhere in the (near) future,
but as long as this issue exists, I will keep my PA800.
Never had any problem with it so far (fingers crossed).

Seems to me that this is just a software (OS) issue, not too difficult to repair in an OS update?

DonM · Post by **DonM** » Mon Sep 22, 2014 9:07 pm

The Fingered 3 mode allows you to play a chord, release the keys, then play left hand notes and the chord doesn't change until you hit 3 notes together again.
It is also much less prone to give you false chord changes if your fingering is a little sloppy.

DonM

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:20 am

Hi Antony

"RIC" from writing E-mails simply means "Reading In Copy"

WRT (with regards to) effects, let me be more clear, is it possible to have a set of STS's that do not change with styles and the effects all remain with original setting apart from those that are tempo dependant etc.

This is something the Yamahas allow and when playing styles with user defined STS's and then want to switch to a different Factory style that could fit the intended song (and adding in Indian drum loops via pads to add flavour... this for on the fly music) and THEN the STS sounds all change whereas I intend to use the exact sounds with effects for most of the performance.

I cannot/do not want to go and change the STS's of the other styles but also do not want their STS's to pull through when changing styles.

Thank you and appreciated

pippuzzo · Post by **pippuzzo** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:26 am

AntonySharmman wrote: After Pa600 this important Fingered 3 mode has been vanished and turned into 2 fingered mode actually !!!

I tried, as a test, using the Pa3X fingered 1 (that seems more similar to the behavior of the fingered used in the last models as explained) and I feel fine with this chord recognition.
I'm using the Expert mode all the time (it trigger chords with one note too) and never experienced all those issues of false chord triggering or similar btw. I'm not use to play single notes with the left hand since I mostly jam playing full chords, but as always each of us has a different playing mode and possibly reintroducing the fingered 3 will stop definitely the discussion. It has been here for long time, no discussion, when removed, big discussion, so the solution for Korg seems simple here.

AntonySharmman wrote: pippuzzo erase/copy/delete stuff are not a nightmare in Pa3X but just a few more buttons to press and as I said
it's just an OS update ... so simple !

also the fingered 3 reintroduction it is an os update, that you feel like a big problem. That's not for me but I respect each other opinion, so simple!
I won't bore anybody with the list of buttons and forms to open to make f.e. a copy of a style (you have to enter in style record or save it in a disk and reload it - that's everything but straighforward) while this in new models are just two easy and intuitive clicks, but I didn't say it's impossible it is difficult.
I've good memory of these functions available in my old Tyros and reverting back to the archaic Pa3X file handling (including banks) it looks to me going back 20 years. I use a lot of these and to me it is an issue, no question, it has a lot of sense that Korg literally copied in the new products this function from Yamaha products fortunately.
This it is just my opinion, that hopefully I like to be respected like I do.

Best

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 6:47 am

Hi Antony

Thanks for the link and it does explain a lot. I also like Teds suggestions on the assigned pedal capabilities however there could be much more other possibilities too. I think korg uses the term "Freely" too freely as the sliders, pedal assignments and switches are very far from being freely assignable.

And the naming "Pa3x Le" is truly misguiding and something that korg should consider long and hard before putting out to the public or production as it give the newbies the impression that there is a new and better PA3x out there and for those knowing the "LE" designation, it gives them the impression that it is a scaled down version of the PA3x. Both are grossly incorrect as it should have been named "PA900 Pro" or so. The 3X bit takes away a lot from the legacy of the PA3x... basically brings it down as the X range was suppose to be their best..... very dishonest branding/designation IMO.

Thank you though for your time and guidance... and same to all on this forum

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 11:29 am

Veren wrote:is it possible to have a set of STS's that do not change with styles and the effects all remain with original settings

Yes but all STS Globally ... Write your first performance/1st STS the effects you like and then lock Global STS preferences changes .
At next reboot all Style's STS will have the same effects.
Not needed to mention that I totally disagree to waste STS features of Pa3X ...

Thought IMO link is clear and also Don already gave a good example , I'll write another example , so ...
- A skilled arranger user always uses chord memory in order to release his left hand due to use controller like Y/X/Sw 1-3 or Fill/Var.
If the only acceptable "expert" chord recognition mode of Pa900/LE is used then when playing for instance a complex chord like A7-9 ( A-Bd-C#-E )
and release your hand by math accuracy the last released notes will re-trigger scanning mode and result to a totally different chord & Bass
since the last released note (in mS) will be the Bb that will trigger A# unison harmony in expert mode and A#major in fingered mode !!!
- Some will happen when you want to use rhythmic patterns with an el.piano by your left hand , changing all time chord or chord root in split mode.
- Also we can't play unison octaves or duets using left-right hands using for instance a spited piano sound in split mode , since any latest
recognition mode will interfere in our playing , changing chords !

I always use all above playing methods and those modes really "kill" me , forcing me playing like an amateur , precisely releasing my left hand
fingers only in next chord change in order to avoid chord misleading , this is totally unacceptable !

I'm able to know what is software possible to change since I'm skilled in that , therefore I don't worry for erase/copy staff , it's a "piece
of cake" , just a few lines of code ... will definitely be in Pa4X !
That I really concern about is the recognition philosophy of KogPa , and in this case they will never update this ...
Be open mind and look a step beyond this !

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 12:09 pm

Hi Antony

Thank you for the STS guidance

WRT fingered 3 link: I think you misread my response as i basically said/agreed that the link clarifies the issues... so yes most arranger players should be using the kbds in this manner to get full potential ... i do and genuinely understand the concerns with the exclusion of fingered 3 as i am always looking for ways to free my left hand and legs to activate some other feature or setup to lessen the repetitions of CVs, change dynamics to create intensity, play lower Strings fills without affecting the sounding chord until necessary and on my fingering and still control nuances/articulations of upper.

Thanks

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 12:19 pm

Veren my example has a general purpose for all , I know what you wrote !

To end this , Pa3X Limited Edition is the next in the hierarchy of PaSeries in circulation , so can be welcomed in a reasonable
price of 1900-2100 euros that will justify the extra cost , including extra keys , 4 fill buttons , 2 wooden sides and a better
body structure compared with Pa900 , since it's a software clone of Pa900 , minus PA cost of Pa900 !
All the rest have already been explained .

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 12:37 pm

Hi Antony ... Cool thanx

WRT STS: will it retain the instruments too for each STS?

Although off topic:
I do like to know your opinion on "freely" assignable sliders etc. more importantly do you believe that sliders, switches and pedals (to an extent) should be more geared to style from a morphing perspective rater than the simple style up/down? ... from a programming perspective is it possible especially on the 3X.

These are arrangers as the controls should at least primarily affect the style/arrangements...change patches, CVs, groove/swing of drum patterns, intensity, harder left playing affecting Cutoff and PB on style tracks are just a few to name.

thanx and appreciated

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 1:13 pm

Veren wrote:I do however like to know your opinion on "freely" assignable sliders etc. more importantly do you believe that sliders, switches and pedals (to an extent) should be more geared to style from a morphing perspective rater than the simple style up/down? ... from a programming perspective is it possible especially on the 3X.

These are arrangers as the controls should at least primarily affect the style/arrangements...change patches, CVs, groove/swing of drum patterns, intensity, harder left playing affecting Cutoff and PB on style tracks are just a few to name.

Though this post belongs to Pa3X improving chapter ...
There are a lot of functions that still lack in PaSeries to improve realtime controls !
For example ,
- We have no AMS option to send OSC Amp/filters to sliders , that prevents for instance to control drawbars of an custom sampled organ ,
or a multi oscillator sampled analog synthesizer , or a multi instruments sounds.
- We need filter and velocity parameters in style editor for every style to control orchestra's volume feel based on AT or
filters controlled by sliders.
- We need more legato parameters in a OSC , individual legato efficiency area , separation of legato & legato up/down switching options.
- We need switching mode of SW1-3 in toggle and one-shot mode.
- We need samples disk streaming mode to dramatically improve user samples magnitude !
and many others that not need to mention in order to have all control potentials of styles & sounds !

Waiting for Pa4X release , as you've probably understood !

Veren · Post by **Veren** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 1:22 pm

Hi Antony

On the BAll... spot On

... have any kbd have the capability to stream user samples from HD etc on demand?

Do you expect 4X to be significantly/radically different and if so, to what extent... what you think the new inclusions will be?

thank you

AntonySharmman · Post by **AntonySharmman** » Tue Sep 23, 2014 1:27 pm

Veren wrote:... have any kbd have the capability to stream user samples from HD etc on demand?

Korg Kronos ... up to 55 Gb samples streaming from SSD ... check my Kronos EXS Libraries website ...