Korg Forums

Probably has been asked 100 times before, but still...

Do you think it's worth it's price? I mean, for my solo performances I would love to make my own phrases, and with MV it seems so simple! Just play a phrase and then convert it to a GE and transfer to your Karma... sounds very easy!

I will probably get banned for this, but is there a way to get it for free? I respect their work, copyrights and all, but I just don't feel like paying 150 bucks for a 6 year old software, for a canceled product!!!

Stephen Kay spent years developing this software and almost went bankrupt to follow his dream. Without his efforts there would never have been a Korg Karma and no KARMA technology.

Do you believe he should not have a fair reward? Would you work night and day for five years for nothing?

Piracy is theft. You'll find no welcome for thieves here.

Kind regards.

Sure, it had it's value 6 years ago, but now? Usually you can get old software for 10 bucks in bargain bins. Nobody buys Karmas anyway - since they are canceled, 2 years ago! And bought an old(er) technology, just because I don't wanted to pay the full price, for a modern technology, like M3.

Besides it's an editor software, which in 99 of 100 cases comes for free with a product, which is already expensive as it is, and in this case, it's just a must have, if you want to edit Karma parameters.
Like I said, I respect his work, but they just can't ask money every time they make a fix.
Next thing you know, you will have to pay for OS updates of hardware synth and editor/librarians! What about customer service? Or don't we deserve to have some rights too?

Kay won't earn anything from it? Than buying from second hands is a theft also - because the company doesn't make any profit from it. Or do I have to send 2000 USD to Kay, to make up for it?

OMFG I just stole Karma from Stephen Kay!

> Just trying to be reasonable, I have my customer rights too!!! Right to have free editor software!!! And providing free editors is a tradition.
But indeed, fighting for your rights is a crime noways, so yes - it makes me a thief...

PS: this wasn't my question - I would gladly pay 150 bucks, if it useful! So is it, or not?

If the Karma you buy comes with a copy of MW, you still won't be able to use it until you receive a license and code to do so from Karma Lab. The software uses a PACE code which is specific to each computer licenced.

And yes, this is Stephen Kay's livelihood. It's not a hobby.

EJ2 wrote:And yes, this is Stephen Kay's livelihood. It's not a hobby.

That's very very nice, but he can't keep ask money for it for an other 20 years, now can he? Like I said, lot's of 7-6 year old software you can get for free/very cheap and legal!!! Why should Karma MW be any different? Besides - there are people in the world who work 100x harder and earn 1000x less... (not me). And who cares about them? No one (and not me/you).

I'll buy it, because Karma for me is pretty useless without, but I must say that my respect for his work, it seriously decreased It's rip off, IMHO - buying something, just realize that you have to buy something else also, if you want to make it to work, as you like, and pay more...
Customer service?
Or don't I have a right to be unsatisfied also? Oh yeah, that's right - I don't have any rights, because I "stole" my Karma!

SynthAntonius wrote:

EJ2 wrote:And yes, this is Stephen Kay's livelihood. It's not a hobby.

That's very very nice, but he can't keep ask money for it for an other 20 years, now can he? Like I said, lot's of 7-6 year old software you can get for free/very cheap and legal!!! Why should Karma MW be any different? Besides - there are people in the world who work 100x harder and earn 1000x less... (not me). And who cares about them? No one (and not me/you).

I'll buy it, because Karma for me is pretty useless without, but I must say that my respect for his work, it seriously decreased

I must say, you've got a serious attitude problem. How do you know anything about how hard I work, or how much money I make?

The Karma Keyboard works quite well without the software. If you want the extra functions and features it supplies, then you have to buy it. It takes my time and my efforts to support it, and I'm not doing it for free. Korg may have discontinued the Karma Workstation, but I didn't discontinue the software (not yet anyway). People are now expecting me to make it work on Vista - who pays for that?

What is your "job"? What do you get paid money for? Will you do it for free because some other person is whining about how he shouldn't have to pay for it?

SynthAntonius wrote:Do you think it's worth it's price?

Absolutely - every cent - have you actually seen what this software can do?

SynthAntonius wrote:I just don't feel like paying 150 bucks for a 6 year old software, for a canceled product!!!

Simple - then don't buy it - it will be your loss.

SynthAntonius wrote:I will probably get banned for this, but is there a way to get it for free?

Pirating/copying software ultimately makes everything more expensive in the end plus it is disrespectful to Mr Kay and also ILLEGAL.
As a moderator on these forums I confirm that banning would be most appropriate in such circumstances...
The Karma keyboard is an amazing breakthrough in keyboard technology - it might be "old" in your opinion but what would you compare it with today??

SynthAntonius wrote:Usually you can get old software for 10 bucks in bargain bins

You mean like WINDOWS 95, Doom II....??? Come on, this comment is an insult to Stephen. You clearly do not appreciate the amount of effort that has been expended to produce this. This is one piece of software that could justifiably increase in price - it's way way above your average out-of-date "bargain bin" editor.

SynthAntonius wrote:....Like I said, I respect his work, but they just can't ask money every time they make a fix.....
....but I must say that my respect for his work, it seriously decreased .....

So what are you really saying here? This is a contradiction of terms... if you respected "his" work you would appreciate how much "they" do deserve for their efforts.

SynthAntonius wrote:Next thing you know, you will have to pay for OS updates of hardware synth and editor/librarians!

I own the Karma and other Korg products, and have received many updates, new features, enhancements etc from Korg at no cost. This IS customer service. Why do you feel that you, a second-hand keyboard buyer, should get all this for free? Does buying second-hand really make you an entitled Korg customer??

I am saddened by these types of attitudes and unrealistic, illogical, and unfair expectations. The thing I am most fired up about is the disrespect for Stephen.

I sincerely hope you get to enjoy the amazing Karma but please don't proceed with ideas of copying software - go buy it - it's superb!!

Pete

I already said I'm going to buy it, jeez...

Actually - I was talking about things like Half Life Episode 1 - Yes, I bought it in a store, for 5 euro.... and it's was only 2 years old back then. That's just an example - this is what I do all the time, just wait till they loose their value and I buy 5 games @ the price of 1.

Well, this is the 2nd Korg that I own, and second one that has to be sent to a repair shop - and no, it's not because of bad maintenance - but because of the poor manufacturing. So yes - my respect for Korg products went down (since the first topic)... to explain "contradiction"

And I've sent a letter to Korg customer service (my Karma is busted) - guess what - no answer!
I've sent them all to a Korg (official) dealer - I've been waiting for more than a moth now, and for GODS SAKE! THEY ARE STILL JUST LYING THERE! NOBODY EVEN BOTHERED TO SENT THEM TO THE KORG REPAIR SHOP! < so at least an other month to go!
And you all took your time to criticize my attitude, but no one answered my thread about Karma problem. I guess bastards like me don't deserve support, huh...
And now I have to pay more for MW...

> Karmathanever - And just because I've bought from second hands doesn't make me a Korg costumer - yes, I agree - so what you gonna do about it? Sue me and throw me to jail? So you say buying from second hands is a theft also?

I not complaining (or as you said, "whining"), because I don't want to pay - I payed 5 times more for Fantom x8 only - I can afford MW , I just don't like your politics, that's all!

Sorry, Stephen, but this my opinion about Korg. What would you think, if you were me?
I still would buy KPIII and maybe one of electribes, though...

Nah, just forget it, everybody - we could discuss it for ages, without any results... sorry if I insulted somebody - especially Stephen - I regret that I've started this topic. This is just the way I think, and I have my reasons also...

I guess I do have a bad attitude...

SynthAntonius wrote:I already said I'm going to buy it, jeez...

Nah, just forget it, everybody - we could discuss it for ages, without any results... sorry if I insulted somebody - especially Stephen - I regret that I've started this topic. This is just the way I think, and I have my reasons also...

I guess I do have a bad attitude...

Nice to see SynthAntonius be respectful and I can understand some his original gripes, but I think Mr. Kay's software is a little different from other software programs...

I shouldn't say this since I have not bought a Karma yet, but will soon... but I can see the Karma becoming one of those synths everyone will want, but not be able to find someday.

It seems that a lot of synths have later vintage lives more so than there original release dates and soon disappear from the music seen.

I'm glad the Mr. Kay is selling his MW software. Unlike most software that becomes obsolete so fast, the usefulness of his software will never fade since it allows you to go spelunking through the inner caverns of the Karma. Hopefully there won't be a day when someone will want this ability but not be able to find a copy of MW.

How many synths can you think of that had a second and third life way after they were discontinued or are no longer easily accessible?

Karma will be one of these synths someday and I hope I have mine before prices skyrocket and they become scarce.

If Mr. Kay stops selling this software, there will be a lot of sad musicians in the future.

Just my opinion.
Dennis

I am very happy with my Karma, and am curious about the MW software.

I use a Mac and a PC in my home studio. I'm considering moving from a G5 to an Intel-based Mac, and upgrading to OSX 10.6. However this will break many of my programs and require updates and upgrades.

My XP pc has failed again and I'm deciding between rebuilding it under XP, which seems to fail every 6 months or so, or migrating to Windows 7, which will be even more costly in terms of upgrades and updates than the Mac migration.

To my knowledge, Karma MW was never released for OSX and I am fairly confident that I won't be able to get it running under 10.6. But what are the plans for support for Karma MW going forward? Is it worth it to buy it for XP and then lock my pc into running XP forever? Or could MW run from XP in a Virtual Machine? This would make the most sense if it could, because I could make a backup of an XP virtual machine in an hour or so then keep it offsite on a USB drive.

So many music programs I've paid for over the years have gone the way of the dodo: Opcode Vision, Galaxy Plus Editors, various synths for OS9, etc.
I'm tired of having to buy upgrades just to keep things running, but Apple & Microsoft have pretty much determined that every few years I need to run a new OS whether or not _I_ want something new. Somehow, I feel that hardware synths are STILL a better value because they live in the real, physical world, and operate pretty much the same way from day to day without fear of imminent upgrades.