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Hello Donald Fagen fans!!

Considering that most of the different synthesis types developed for the original Oasys prototype (and the Oasys PCI, the Prophecy, the Z1 and so on) have found their way into the modern Oasys as we know it, I am a bit curious if we'll ever see the Electric Piano modelling stuff as an EXi...

The new Roland workstation Fantom G has some new expansion slot that can house the new ARX type cards. It seems Roland has at last begun to develop expansion cards based on physical modeling rather than sample sets.

Anyway, one of the cards is an EP modeling card, and by the looks of it I can imagine getting a G just for that!!

I am a BIG TIME SUCKER for great EP:s, and I would die and go to heaven if Korg were ever to release an EXi based on modeling.. (a la Logics EVP88 or AAS Lounge Lizard 3)

Everytime I sit down and play a patch on any synth that is based on samples I start listening for loop points, velocity switching etc. Probably the result of growing up with early sample based synths with little memory..

As you know, a sample is an almost perfect still picture of an instrument at a given time, and trying to make it come alive is a bit like trying to make a movie out of too few pictures.. If you're gonna make a movie, use a film camera (modeling)!!

Anyway, there are still a few banks that haven't been filled by Korg, and I'm afraid we're not gonna see flute/wind/reed modeling any time soon (if ever), considering the EXs 3. Which leaves us the EP stuff, right?..

An electric piano (such as the Rhodes) is an amazing instrument. Going from sweet and soft to raw and punchy is so easy.. It sits so well in a mix!

Ok, sorry for this potentially boring post. I just dream of having modeling EP:s in my Oasys..

curvebender wrote:
Ok, sorry for this potentially boring post. I just dream of having modeling EP:s in my Oasys..

Nothing to say sorry about, I am a big fan of rhodes sounds myself and I would love modeling EP for the Oasys.

Although I must admit I am very happy with the EP's from the MOD-7 (not only the EP's ) especially the way to control them and change character, but those are FM's

Oh yeah, MOD-7 style EP:s are great, and indeed very playable!

But, it's quite different from the Rhodes stuff. I mean, the sampled Rhodes in the Oasys are not bad, but the beauty of modeling is the large amount of control over almost every aspect of the sound producing mechanisms, and you can never ever get that with samples.

curvebender wrote:It seems Roland has at last begun to develop expansion cards based on physical modeling rather than sample sets.

The actual technology is yet to be known. It sounds a whole lot like samples or wavetables to me, albeit with a very nice interface. I very, very much doubt that it uses physical modeling per se.

- Dan

Last time I mentioned an EP EXi Peter (of the blogasys flavour) said "STR-1", and I still haven't gotten around to exploring that avenue.

Daz.

danatkorg wrote:
The actual technology is yet to be known. It sounds a whole lot like samples or wavetables to me, albeit with a very nice interface. I very, very much doubt that it uses physical modeling per se.

Yeah I'm glad you think that way too Dan...I was wondering myself are we talking sample manipulation here or modeling.I must admit though the ARX drum card looks very cool.

As for an EP Exi,well any Exi's are welcome by me,I wouldn't say its on my priority list but if one comes along then great.This amazing obsession with Electric Piano's.....it must be me but I've never understood it really although one of my all time fave pieces of music wouldn't sound the same without one, the unmistakable Fender Rhodes.... on "Angela" by Bob James. Awesome tune.

STR-1 has some great EPs ,E-067 Dirty STR-1 E.Piano......fine example and so is the E-012 Classic STR-1 E Piano.

danatkorg wrote:

curvebender wrote:It seems Roland has at last begun to develop expansion cards based on physical modeling rather than sample sets.

The actual technology is yet to be known. It sounds a whole lot like samples or wavetables to me, albeit with a very nice interface. I very, very much doubt that it uses physical modeling per se.

- Dan

Really? Well, dissapointing if that's the case!

But in any case (!), why do you doubt it "very very much"?..

And concerning the STR-1: Yes, there are som sweet EP:s there, and as I mentioned in some other post, I guess maybe a plucked string could be transformed, at least partially, into a "hammer strikes tine"-sound, as the tine could be seen as a very thick string.

But still, the Korg Z1 has an EP oscillator model, and since nearly all the other models have ended up in the Oasys (heavily upgraded), I was just wondering about the possibilities of the EP modeling being made into an EXi..

Daz wrote:Last time I mentioned an EP EXi Peter (of the blogasys flavour) said "STR-1", and I still haven't gotten around to exploring that avenue.

Daz.

While I haven't advanced further on it, a few of the STR-1 programs I made about a year ago explore it's tuned bell/electric piano possibilities and sound incredibly rich. There's a reference to that sound set in the sticky thread to the oasys resource list, and I think I called those program 'ethnic piano (1,2,...)' or something similar. The velocity response to harmonic richness in excellent. Note that those programs are quite crude in programing and are actually a little over the top for practical use, but nevertheless reveal something of the incredible potential of STR-1, which with more programming could produce excellent electric pianos.

Kevin.

I'm very interested in getting that classic rhodes sound on the OASYS without samples as well. I agree that the STR-1 EPs and MOD-7 EPs are good, but I haven't been able to create an authentic sounding rhodes on the OASYS just yet either. However, this may be due to my amateur programming skills...

I've compared the transients from a 'rhodes' created using STR-1 to that of a fender rhodes sample using an oscilloscope. Some characteristics are close, but others are quite different. There's a randomness that's difficult to duplicate. Has anyone had any success with this? I would be indebted to you if you could provide a .PCG file. I would really like to invest some time into this and provide a .PCG myself.

If not a specific EXi by Korg, a tutorial on how to take our EP patches to that next level would be amazing!!

curvebender wrote:
Really? Well, dissapointing if that's the case!

Not necessarily; the sound is the important thing, imo.

curvebender wrote:But in any case (!), why do you doubt it "very very much"?..

As part of being at Korg R&D, I've been working with physical models since the early 1990s. It just doesn't sound like it.

Also, Roland to my knowledge has never released a product which used physical modeling (they've been much more into additive/resynthesis, as in the Variphrase products). It would be strange for their first such product to be an add-on card.

Best regards,

Dan

danatkorg wrote:

curvebender wrote:It seems Roland has at last begun to develop expansion cards based on physical modeling rather than sample sets.

The actual technology is yet to be known. It sounds a whole lot like samples or wavetables to me, albeit with a very nice interface. I very, very much doubt that it uses physical modeling per se.

- Dan

Dan is right, not physical modeling, they're always sample based.

I would really like an expansion dedicated to bass and guitars like the brass and woodwinds EXs instead of EP EXi. I can pay a lot for a real guitar (both acoustic and electric) and bass(both acoustic and electric) EXs.
A free sound set like the M3 is welcomed too.

Oh my God, I just discovered MOD-7 019: VJS Reed E.Piano!!!

How did I miss this great EP?!!!

Ok then, no sleep for me tonight..

Again..

curvebender wrote:Oh my God, I just discovered MOD-7 019: VJS Reed E.Piano!!!

How did I miss this great EP?!!!

Ok then, no sleep for me tonight..

Again..

Glad you like it!
Btw, the main sound of this Program uses only VPM Oscillators 1 and 2; the other four VPM Oscillators only come into play when you move the Vector Joystick out of the center. Osc 2 provides a sine wave, with optional feedback and ring mod via VJS modulation; Osc 1 processes this through a waveshaper, using one of the Pickup tables. If you didn't need the ring mod to happen before the waveshaper, you could do all of this with a single oscillator.

Try making small changes to the Waveshaper Offset in Osc 1, and see how this affects the sound. If you're so inspired, try assigning an AMS modulator to control the Offset. (Note that this can change at note-on only - but you could still use a knob to modulate it, to dial in different sounds).

For more info on this approach to electric piano sounds, see the Waveshaping->Using Offset section of "Synthesis with the MOD-7: a guided tour," and also the description of the Pickup tables.

Best regards,

Dan

Great patch! I hadn't hear this one either. Thanks for the tip Dan!!