CX3 questions

Devnor · Post by **Devnor** » Thu Feb 10, 2011 7:59 pm

Is the CX3 organ & leslie sims the same as Oasys and modelled CX3 discontinued years ago? Is it possible to control drawbar settings in Kronos remotely from something like a Hammond XK3C drawbar? I really love the keybed & control surface on the XK3C but it's not giving me heavy distortion sounds I crave.

Thanks!

RichF · Post by **RichF** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:07 am

[EDIT] The CX-3 drawbars can't be controlled via external drawbars, sorry.

One notable difference from our other (2000 version) CX-3 implementation- In KRONOS, the CX-3 engine's polyphony has been boosted to 200 voices.

Of course, you can also use additional effects (including REMS amplifier modeling), to get whatever kind of overdrive you're looking for.

-Rich

BillW · Post by **BillW** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:41 pm

Well, there were 2 versions of the CX-3...one from around 1980 and another from around 2000. The Kronos is based on the 2000 version.

Devnor · Post by **Devnor** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:08 pm

RichF wrote:[EDIT] The CX-3 drawbars can't be controlled via external drawbars, sorry.

Ok so the CX3 drawbar settings cannot be controlled remotely via MIDI but they can be adjusted from the Kronos front panel faders?

RichF · Post by **RichF** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:09 pm

That's correct.

[EDIT] No it's not.

They can be controlled via SysEx, but not via control change messages.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:31 pm

That's kind of bummer.

Devnor · Post by **Devnor** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 7:53 pm

Thanks for clarification Rich!

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 8:43 pm

I would add that Hammond has a very peculiar way of it send out CC data for its drawbars. It crams all of the data for the drawbars of a manual into ONE CC. Most clones use a different MIDI CC (nine per manual) for each drawbar making it much easier to remap. I think there are a few software-based B3 clones that remap the Hammond data but I don't know of any hardware clones that do.

Busch.

Devnor · Post by **Devnor** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:23 pm

Thanks Busch you're right. As the bottom bar goes from level 0 to 8, the CC value goes from 0-8, then next higher bar sends 9-17 and so on. Closer inspection of the XK3C midi chart shows the bars can receive on different channels (12-29) but big fat X in the transmit column anyway. Gah thanks Hammond.

StephenKay · Post by **StephenKay** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 9:49 pm

Devnor wrote:
RichF wrote:[EDIT] The CX-3 drawbars can't be controlled via external drawbars, sorry.
Ok so the CX3 drawbar settings cannot be controlled remotely via MIDI but they can be adjusted from the Kronos front panel faders?

RichF wrote:That's correct.

Are you sure about that, Rich? When I have a CX3 patch loaded here, and I move the front panel sliders, the drawbars move, and the sliders transmit SysEx over MIDI. Therefore, I am assuming that you could program an external fader box that is capable of sending sysex messages, and it would work the same way. (Just no easy CC assignment...)

GiantSonicRobot · Post by **GiantSonicRobot** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:32 pm

If the CX-3 drawbars really can't be controlled via MIDI, this means that you can't reasonably use it with an external sequencer / DAW.
After all it doesn't make much sense to record an organ (where moving the drawbars is an essential part of the performance) if Kronos can't play back what has been recorded.

Seems like a major oversight to me.

StephenKay · Post by **StephenKay** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:50 pm

GiantSonicRobot wrote:If the CX-3 drawbars really can't be controlled via MIDI, this means that you can't reasonably use it with an external sequencer / DAW.
After all it doesn't make much sense to record an organ (where moving the drawbars is an essential part of the performance) if Kronos can't play back what has been recorded.

Seems like a major oversight to me.

Like I said, when you move the drawbars, it transmits sysex. So this can be recorded in any DAW, or the internal sequencer. Therefore, it should also be able to be controlled by an external fader box, that is capable of being programmed with sysex messages.

burningbusch · Post by **burningbusch** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:57 pm

Devnor wrote:Thanks Busch you're right. As the bottom bar goes from level 0 to 8, the CC value goes from 0-8, then next higher bar sends 9-17 and so on. Closer inspection of the XK3C midi chart shows the bars can receive on different channels (12-29) but big fat X in the transmit column anyway. Gah thanks Hammond.

Yes, but if you look further down that list you'll see CC# 80, 81, 82 which are the drawbars in that compressed format I was talking about. Now assuming Stephen Kay is correct, the MIDI Solutions Event Processor might do the trick. It can remap, even to SysEx.

http://www.midisolutions.com/prodevp.htm

Busch.

EvilDragon · Post by **EvilDragon** » Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:12 pm

I'd rather use CCs than SysEx for controlling drawbars, personally.

So yeah, I find it as a drawback indeed.

RichF · Post by **RichF** » Sat Feb 12, 2011 12:18 am

Hi folks,

Sorry, further clarification needed... Yes, the drawbars can be controlled by MIDI, but not by CC messages... Only SysEx. So, you can automate them, but simply hooking up a standard MIDI controller with sliders won't do the trick unless you can map the sliders to [EDIT] SysEx messages.

Apologies for the confusion, it's my fault. I must be losing my mind, I recorded drawbar automation in a studio last week.