Korg R3 Vs Novation Ultranova Synth.

richardw · Post by **richardw** » Tue Oct 04, 2011 11:45 pm

Hello Everyone,

I am seriously considering the purchase of a hardware synth for music experimentation. I LOVE the R3 sounds but am somewhat concerned about the hardware issues mentioned on the forums, in particular the problems with knobs and pots/encoders. While I might buy the R3 even with the issues, it does concern me that this device might spend time in the shop for repairs both in and out of warranty (which will cost me money).

Does anyone have any experience with the Ultranova? I also like the sound from this synth, though not as much as the R3. However, like the Korg R3, the knobs appear to be somewhat "wiggly" indicating that the pots are not solidly attached to either a panel or the circuit board. Are the Novation products (Ultranova or other Novation keyboards) subject to similar issues that are displayed by the Korg R3? Is the Ultranova a higher quality instrument?

Any observations or comments would be appreciated.

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 12:24 am

after looking into it i realize its a hard decision(although i hated the novation ultranova when i tried it out for the first time)

The novation ultranova isn't built quite as well as the r3, but thehy are very similar in build quality- you'll be able to do more with an r3 since it has two timbres, the r3 is good for pads and ambience and its vocoder can be programmed to sound spectacular. it is also very good for polysynth sounds(vintage and todays electro plucks) and electric pianos/organs. But for everything else, the novation ultranova is better, the ultranova is very good at bass and lead, although for other things its kind of lackluster.
it depends on what your looking for.
build quality like i said, is very similar.
If you want to be like Chuckie or Afrojack i would reccomend the novation ultranova- as Chuckie has actually made some awesome soundpacks for the ultranova.

If all you want is really good electro house sounds get a novation ultranova

if you want good everything else, trance techno and maybe some prog rock sounds get an r3

the r3 is more versatile in my opinion, it can do everything(albiet some things not as well as others)

and the novation ultranova is not very versatile, and is only good at creating kick*** electro house sounds.

But they are both pretty good. its your decision.

dflan83 · Post by **dflan83** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:23 am

Well if this is any consolation, I sold the ultranova after owning it for months and bought the radias instead. I'm completely satisfied with the radias. The big deal breaker for me was the mono timbrality of the synth. And after owning a nova (which was my first synth) it just didn't make the cut.

The sound of the ultranova was a turnoff as well. The pads all sounded the same and most of the presets I found unuseable with very few gems. Thats not to say you can't make your own, but if your going to use the nova name, it better be a damn good synth. In the end it sounded cold and digital. I also found it annoying to only have one instance oh the editor open in cubase.

Why I got the radias instead
1 radias has more synthesis types
2 radias multi timbral
3 I like the smaller module of the radias
4 the"wave tables" on the ultranova were bad
5 novation doesn't have great customer support

The radias doesn't have that standard synth sound. Meaning when I play I don't feel like I'm just using a hardware vst.

Anyway that is just my two cents. In the end the grass was greener with korg

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:27 am

the novation ultranova is underrated, its not a very good OVERALL synth, but it is very good for electro. and the drum samples and cool control methods make it pretty cool.

The overall sound is lackluster, but the filters are sick.

If you were choosing between radias and novation ultranova, i would no matter what go with the radias however.

but your choosing between r3 and ultranova, so its a hard decision. try it before you buy it is all i have to say.

dflan83 · Post by **dflan83** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 1:30 am

I agree it did have some sick electro sounds but would agree with the above for versatility I give the r3 the upper hand.

CharlesFerraro · Post by **CharlesFerraro** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 5:10 am

If you're going to record tracks into your DAW use the Ultranova. Multitimbrality wouldn't matter in that case. Its still a capable synth for live use though.

If you can do without the vocoder, save yourself some money and get the Venom. I think that would be the best option.

EDIT: PS this is your first synth? The Ultranova would be just fine for a first-timer.

richardw · Post by **richardw** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:46 pm

Thank you all for your comments and observations. This is helpful info. Yes, this is going to be my first synth. I want something that is not too limiting, and well under a thousand dollars (to start with). I know that at this price point there will be some compromises in functions and build quality, but to be honest, I would not know what to do with a high-end instrument. Those are for musicians with knowledge and experience in music synthesis.

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Wed Oct 05, 2011 11:55 pm

i would get a access virus ti snow because you can snag one for less than a thousand dollars on ebay or at a outlet

CharlesFerraro · Post by **CharlesFerraro** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 1:22 am

richardw wrote:Yes, this is going to be my first synth. I want something that is not too limiting, and well under a thousand dollars (to start with). I know that at this price point there will be some compromises in functions and build quality, but to be honest, I would not know what to do with a high-end instrument.

Should be fine with just one timbre. It means you wont be able to run multiple instances of the synth engine. Consequently, that means you can't do key splits, a feature I highly doubt you'll miss.

As for build features the ultranova actually has aftertouch which is rare for a keyboard in its range. That makes it a valuable MIDI controller.
What you don't get is an audio interface built into the unit like the Venom or Snow so you would need an external sound card that connects to your comp if you don't already have one. Note that the synth and the interface will each take up a usb port on your computer so you may want to get a port splitter like this:
http://www.amazon.com/Belkin-4-Port-Ult ... B000Q8UAWY

I wouldn't suggest the R3 for a first timer unless you find a good deal on the price. You can't run the editor like a VST plug-in and it also doesn't sync up with the unit itself. So if you were to start controlling the R3 from the face, you would need to 'recieve' (update) the patch into editor to see (and save) the changes you made while tinkering hands-on. Kind of defeats the purpose of hardware. If you don't have a DAW though, the R3 is as good an option as the other synths brought up in the thread.

Again, how bad do you need that vocoder? Look into the M-Audio Venom.

richardw · Post by **richardw** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:39 am

To be honest, I have not considered the Venom, I think I will take a look at it. The keyboard is 4 octaves (rather than three). Vocoding is interesting, but not essential for me right now. The Ultranova vocoder sounds OK, the R3 vocoder is pretty good.

Going back to my first post, the mechanical aspects of some of these devices gives me some concern (loose knobs and long-term durability). I am familiar with the Akai Miniak; built like a tank--too bad it has such a poor user interface--hard to edit the sounds.

Anyway, it looks like I have some homework to do--Many, many choices...

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:07 pm

What kind of joker are you?, YOU ACTUALLY RECCOMEND THE VENOM? lol. what a joke. Whatever you do, dont buy the venom its the worst synth for the best price. soncistate reviewed it and said that it was only "ok" and cheaply built. Ultranova is also another "ok" and cheaply built synth, but its not as horrible as the venom, and it has some good sounds in it.
Get the R3 or die.

everything else in the price range you have sucks so get the r3.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:20 pm

Whatever you do, dont (sic) take Morshu too seriously. He's either trolling for fun or actually clueless about the subject matter. I would hate for you (the OP) to base an investment of hard earned money on his ramblings. I think you've been directed to some cool options for your cash. Make sure to actually go and try them out. Sometimes a certain sound or UI just speaks to you more than another and that's not something anyone here can tell you about.

Morshu · Post by **Morshu** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 9:59 pm

Alesis Micron

Synthesis: analog modeling (subtractive), noise generator, FM
Polyphony: up to 8 voices
Timbrality: up to 8 parts
Oscillators: 3 per voice with continuously variable waveshapes, sync, linear and exponential FM, Ring Mod, routable modulation matrix per voice.
Filters: 2 multi-mode resonating filters per voice with 16 filter types
Modulation: 2 LFOs with multiple wave shapes, sample and hold, tracking generator, freely routable modulation matrix per voice
Effects: 4 drive effects, 1 per part; master effects
Sequencing: step sequencer, arpeggiator, drum machine/rhythm sequencer, and phrase sequencer
Program memory: up to 1,000 programs and multi-timbral setups
Velocity sensitive: Yes
Keyboard: 37-key, synth action
External control: MIDI in/out/thru
Inputs: 2 balanced 1/4” TRS, mic
Outputs: 2 balanced 1/4” TRS, 1/4” TRS headphone
Pedal Inputs: Assignable expression pedal, sustain pedal

Price: 350$

KORG MS2000

Polyphony
4 voices

Timbrality
2

Oscillator
2 (or 4) oscillators per voice

LFO
2

Synthesis type
Virtual analog Subtractive

Filter
1 resonant lowpass/highpass/bandpass

Attenuator
2 ADSR

Aftertouch
Yes (set to MIDI1 or MIDI2 and assign
target parameter via Virtual Patch bay)

Velocity sensitive
Yes

Memory
128 patches

Effects
Chorus, delay, EQ, flanger, phaser,
ring modulator, vocoder

Input/output

Keyboard
44 keys

External control
MIDI

Rating: 4.2/5
Price: 250-350$

Access Virus Ti snow module

Type: Synth/ module/
Synthesis Type: Subtractive/Wavetable
Polyphony:
Max: 50
Typical in use: 10-20
Multi-timbral (number of parts): 4
Oscillators per Voice :
Min : 1
Max : 3
Controllers :
Effects :
Number of FX units : many
Number of different effects : delay,verb, chorus, distortion eq, vocoder, phaser, ring mod
Keyboard :
Number of Keys :
Can send on simultaneous MIDI channels
Responds to : velocity, after-touch
Sounds can be split by :
Memory :
Patches : 512
Performances : 64
Inputs and Outputs :
Number of Audio Outs (excluding Phones) : 2
Number of Audio Ins : 2
Number of MIDI Outs (excluding Thru) : 1
Number of MIDI Ins : 1
Rating: 5/5
Price: 1300$ approx. if your lucky you can pick up one for 900 on ebay

Roland JP8000

Polyphony - 8 voices
Oscillators - 2 Roland Analog Modeling DSP oscillators: Saw, Square (PWM), Triangle (PWM), Super Saw (7 de-tuned Saws), Triangle Mod, Feedback OSC, noise
Timbres: 2
Filter - Resonant 12/24dB/oct low pass / band pass / hi pass; ring modulator
Effects - Onboard digital delay and chorus
Memory - 128 preset patches, 128 user patches, 64 performances, 64 user performances
Arpeg/Seq - Powerful vintage-style arpeggiator with beat patterns; Programmable real-time Phrase Sequencing (RPS) functions
Keyboard - 49 keys (with velocity)
Control - MIDI (2 parts)
Rating: 4.5/5
Price: 600-700$

Yamaha DX7

Polyphony - 16 Voices
Oscillators - 16 bit Digital 6 operator FM.
#Instruments - (1) Monotimbral
LFO - Sine/Square/Tri/SAW up/SAW Down/Random
VCA - 6 Envelope generators 8 parameters each
Keyboard - 61 keys (w/ velocity and aftertouch)
Memory - 32 Patches
Control - MIDI
Rating 4/5
Price 300$

Polyphony - Monophonic
Oscillators - 1 VCO
LFO - Vibrato, Tremolo
Arpeg/Seq - Sequencer: 100 notes, 1 pattern. Rhythm Machine: March, Waltz, Swing, Rock, Samba, Beguine, Bossa Nova
Effects - None
Keyboard - 29 tiny keys (with 3-position octave switch)
Memory - 1 user patch, 5 preset sounds, 10 built-in rhythm patterns
Control - None
rating 9001/5
price 25-50$

Alesis Andromeda

Polyphony - 16 voices
Timbres: 16 part multitimbral
Oscillators - 2 oscillators (with subs) per voice, 5 waveforms available (sine, triangle, square, up saw, down saw)
Filter - 32 total - 2-pole multimode resonating filter per voice, 4-pole lowpass resonating filter per voice
Effects - Digital reverb, chorus, echo, analog distortion, quad pitch-shifting, flange, and more
Arpeg/Seq - Arpeggiator: Up, Down, Up/Down, Random; Sequencer: 16-step, analog style; both have MIDI sync
Keyboard - 61 keys (velocity and aftertouch sensitive)
Memory - Program Memory: 256 preset and 128 user-defined
Mix Memory: 128 user-defined
Memory Card Slot: PCMCIA-format
Control - MIDI (16-parts)
Rating: 1000000000000000000000/5
Price: 4000$

I THINK WE ALL KNOW WHICH ONE IS THE WINNER- ITS EITHER THE CASIO VL-1 OR THE ALESIS ANDROMEDA

but yea this is probably the best list of synth choices for you, they are all pretty awesome.
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ravenmek · Post by **ravenmek** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 3:37 pm

Well, I had a novation Xio and was a good synth for the money, So I suppouse that the ultranova is a good synth (specially, with the wavetables... I LOVE wavetables). Now I have an Akai Miniak and is a beautiful and powerful synth, sounds great and It must be cheap (except you live in a third world country, like me, 1100 dollars)

richardw · Post by **richardw** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 12:00 am

WOW---That is expensive. Miniak's go for between US $300-$400 dollars or so. It sounds very gooood, just a pain to program patches. I tried one out at my local GC, and found it difficult to modify sounds (one dial programming makes it step-by-step SLOW. That's why I am looking for something with more controls to work with (at a beginners price point). E-bay is definitely a possibility.