Korg Forums

[aron]

Yeah, looks like around $9,400
http://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/inflation.php?amount=1500&year=1978
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[Broadwave]

I've just had the chance to try an original 1974 MM

Very, very nice, but I'm now even happier with my DIY clone as I wasn't sure how close to the original MM it sounded. The only difference I can tell is the behavior of the EGs - mine doesn't "build up" the attack portion, opening up the VCF with each key strike. I can live with that.

If I COULD afford the new one, I would - There's just a certain je ne sais quoi about it. But I need Deepmind 12 first.
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Synth DIY Projects

[jeremykeys]

Has anybody compared it to a Minimoog Vogager? I realize the Voyager has memory but I was wondering just out of curiosity how they compared sound wise or are they both totally different beasties?
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If music is the food of love, play on and play loud!
Gear: Kronos 73, Triton Pro-X, Wavestation EX, Polysix, King Korg, Monotron and Monotron Duo, Minikorg, Moog Grandmother, 1 Roland U-20, Hammond M3, 4 acoustic and 6 electric guitars, 1 Ibanez 5 string bass, a bunch of microphones and other very cool toys, 1 wife and 3 cats!

[aron]

My friend has a Voyager and little phatty etc... Once I get my Mini to play well, I can do a side by side.
So far, I need to fix/replace the 12 pin cinch jones connector for the controllers and the bushings. The mini plays and is really fat sounding and stable considering it's from 74'
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[aron]

hahahah Minimoog 12 pin connector changed and bushings replaced. Plays well!
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[Mosquita Muerta]

I'm sorry guys, my Zebra2 vst plugin sounds much better than any minimoog...

[aron]

I really doubt it. You must not own a Minimoog. And what does "sounds much better" mean? Not only that, there's no way any plugin can even touch my Micromoog as well. Give me a break.
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[nitecrawler]

[SanderXpander]

The Voyager sounds darker and less aggressive than a Mini. For a "static" patch, you can get close using EQ but they really have their own sound.

[BasariStudios]

[jeremykeys]

this is a video of the U-He Zebra 2 vst plug in.

https://youtu.be/d1njGwVHpN0

It's nothing like a Minimoog. Nothing at all. You might as well be comparing a Minimoog to a Korg Wavestation. Both sound good but totally different.

Methinks a Troll!

The Zebra is fine but but but

Beacoup de Whatever!
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If music is the food of love, play on and play loud!
Gear: Kronos 73, Triton Pro-X, Wavestation EX, Polysix, King Korg, Monotron and Monotron Duo, Minikorg, Moog Grandmother, 1 Roland U-20, Hammond M3, 4 acoustic and 6 electric guitars, 1 Ibanez 5 string bass, a bunch of microphones and other very cool toys, 1 wife and 3 cats!

[Kevin Nolan]

Yeah - saying a Minimoog sounds like the Zebra - it's just not that black and white!

[aron]

The minimoog is so fat sounding!!!! I plugged in my Sequential Pro one after the Mini.... oops
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[Mosquita Muerta]

Some of this could be that I’ve focused on Zebra2 for 4+ months. I’ve been able to focus on Zebra2, because Zebra2 takes the handcuffs off and provides everything in a single package that a person CAN focus on. What do I mean? I mean that being able to modulate ANYTHING with ANYTHING is a quantum leap that none of my hardware synths come even close to. The arpeggiator modulation option is the most insane thing in the world. Having all the effects (damn good, fun effects), so many filters, oscillators, waveshapers, additive synthesis, the ability to draw my own oscillators, etc makes me suddenly a mean SOB. It makes me dangerous. I like that. It does it all under one hood and that allows me to get more comfortable and experienced under that one, single hood.

To even get into the argument of a computer gadget sounding inferior seems like kid stuff from my particular vantage point. If the sound of the oscillators is THAT big of deal to you and you’d rather have great “core” sounds at the expense of doing anything cool with them, that’s your cup of tea. I will say that if a person really only wants those same eight sounds that are generally all over the radio that maybe a ROMpler like Nexus may be up your alley or maybe some very specific analog synths. BTW, I don’t view the limited modulation options in on a Prophet 08 or Moog Voyager as being wildly different from a ROMpler. There may be a guy who’s deadly with those analog synths, but I’m not. After using Zebra2, going back to the analog world feels like half your toys were taken away.

For me, the ability to sound unique is the ONLY thing I care about. Me sounds like me, using Zebra2 and he never felt that way using any of the hardware, including my lovely Minimoog.

I like to take notes of my initial impressions with a gadget. Here’s what I wrote down.

–Install went perfectly.

–Presets are a little too good…I almost want to use them. (I’m not a presets guy.)

– I’m getting the kind of sounds I’m into is FAST. (Their Youtube channel is a HUGE help.) I’m hoping to get into “intermediate” sometime this year when it comes to making my own patches from scratch. I’m getting sounds I like in minutes without any of the clearly not-quite-there problem so many of us face with most sounds we try to nail in home recording land.

I want to emphasize that I’m not using the presets. I’m just getting the kind of results I want out of a synth with 20x the satisfaction in 1/20th the time.

– There’s a lot to learn. Zebra2 is comprehensive. It’s clearly designed to be a synth you CAN’T outgrow. The speed of sound creation outweighs this sizeable learning curve. I get the feeling that there’s NOTHING this synth can’t do that I’d ever need.

Note: 4 months later I still feel this synth can do just about anything.

– After about 4 hours of use I’ve decided all my hardware synths must go. I like the sound of Zebra2 better than ANY of the synths I own.

Note: I still feel this way.

– Using Zebra2 as plugin insert (Zebrify) on audio is an absolute blast. I’ve mangled audio just about every way I can think of using the kind of plugins Waves, UAD, or Soundtoys make. A full-featured fully modular synth as an effects unit is an Apache helicopter fighting Julius Caesar. There just isn’t a comparison to the two when you REALLY want to mangle something. I suspect a lot of indie rock bands I deal with who say, “Brandon, do some crazy s**t on this part” are going to be in for a shock. GOOD!

– The number of tutorials on Youtube, particularly by the manufacturer, are VERY VERY inspiring. I can’t say I was all the impressed with their website. They focused on none of the things that are important to me, but I have to say that their Youtube channel is tip top.

– The manual is written by human beings. A synth this in-depth does require manual reading sometimes if you want to tweak. It’s nice when a manual is done well. This one is. Not only is the manual a standable read, it has built in tutorials. This does happen, but not nearly enough. I’ve found these to be ultra helpful.

Moog Bass Vs Zebra2 Bass

The Moog bass sound(s) are fairly legendary. When you fire up a Moog there is a thing to it. It’s hard to deny that. The Moog on its own will give you an evil grin. Trying to wedge the Moog into a fairly dense mix was something that I have never figured out in the 18 months I’ve had it. Trying to shape the tone of the Moog to fit these dense mixes is not something I’ve ever figured out, either. Minus EQ, how do you tame 140Hz on a big Moog bass sound?

Note: Abysynth 5 also has this problem where you have to find ways to ditch that upper bass stuff when using the standard saw. It sometimes takes real work to get that junk out.

With the Zebra2 bass, I use the default saw oscillator. I run it through WaveShaper 3, I fiddle for 30 seconds, I have a very useable bass sound from which to build a song. It has all the grit, nastiness, balls, bla, bla, bla that I want out of my bass sounds without that 140Hz stuff. It’s the sound I thought I’d get out of the Moog by default. Nope.

I don’t want to get into the argument of digital vs analog. I just want to say that I personally DRAMATICALLY prefer having solutions to my problems included in the same box. Having the ability to get THIS detailed, as I’ll discuss later, is something that separates the new thinking from the old ways and allows soft synths to not only compete with old analog hardware but to surpass them.

Awesome Features

Creating Your Own Waveforms
The thing I hate most about the Prophet 08, Moog, and various softsynths I’ve tried is sometimes I need that one sound. What is it? Hell, I don’t know, but it’s a craving I get and the answer to getting it is almost never found in simply playing with the waveform options for a given oscillator.

The ability to draw in your own waveforms for any given oscillator is simply a grand slam. While getting fast at it is an art, I have to say that this is the synth-world equivalent to moving a mic. (Sometimes that one mic placement on a guitar track wasn’t ideal, but no amount of EQing will fix it. Moving a mic could change the fundamental character in a way in which no EQ would be needed. Drawing custom waveforms allows us to get into the heart of the sound and fundamentally change it in ways that are aren’t possible with other synths.)

Seriously, this waveform drawing is the future. If you’ve not spent a few hours with the technique, you’ve missed out on exactly the kind of thing that makes a soft synth like Zebra2 so valuable.

Sound Shaper
Fire up a saw bass. The default initial sound will work. Toss on Sound Shaper. You immediately have tremendous control with just the “depth” and “hiout”. These are most likely very simple EQ-type functions, but they are voiced perfectly to get what you want in literally 2 seconds without pulling out a parametric EQ. I’m not aware of anything this musically intuitive in Massive, Sylenth1, or Absynth. (Absynth’s sound shaper is awesome, too, but more in a completely-mangled-insanity kind of way. “Shaping” isn’t the right word for it.)

The Sound Shaper is very useful on many, many sounds and is a nice alternative to EQ, which is something I generally avoid when making synth sounds.

Filter Drive
Most filters have a drive option which works similar to the Sound Shaper…only different. You can really bring an otherwise boring synth patch to life just by cranking up the Drive on the filter. The vintage filters in particular are outstanding for causing mayhem.

Modulated Reverb
I was a fan of the effects in Sylenth1 because they sounded reminded me of a Friday The Thirteenth movie from 1988. I’m a fan of the Zebra2 effects because they sound like something I could use on 10 different studio projects this week.

In particular, the reverb stands out. It’s a bold sucker capable of some pretty wild stuff. In particular, the ability to modulate the frequency of the reverb has been particularly amazing at the more over the top sounds I employ.

Because Zebra2 has such a great effects section, it’s amazing how many sounds can be done with a simple oscillator and creative effects usage. Bypassing the effects often makes me go, “Oh” in disappointment. This, too, illustrates both my personal tastes and my qualms with my analog synths. I tend to like synths with effects on them and I never liked the additional patch and workflow issues of using/buying additional hardware effects processors for my Prophet 08. This definitely gives Zebra2 an unfair advantage.

Outstanding Extras
The ability to change the screen size is brilliant. The world of 1080p has made once huge screen displays miniscule. If you are like me you have a stupid console in the way that forces you to be 42” away from your screen. I sometimes struggle with plugins where I can’t see the settings. That’s not a problem with Zebra. This is a feature I’ve never seen before and I have to say it makes me feel confident that this company has their crap together.

Very Efficient CPU Usage
CPU is usage is almost non-existant on my AMD 6-core 1090T processor. There are plugins that chew up 25% of my CPU power with one instance. I can’t even see the CPU meter move with Zebra2 using a fairly basic patch. Even on the most intense patch I’ve made so far I’d imagine I’m using maybe 4% CPU usage.

Back To The Old Synths For A Day

For the sake of the his review, I thought I’d tear up an X-girlfriend just to see if I was missing anything. I fired up all my hardware synths for a few hours. There was the “Oh…..wow…..different!” thing that every person with 68 guitars does the day they bought the 68th. The inherent character of each synth was pretty neat, but I never got anything dangerous out of any of them. I made 40 presets in the Prophet a week before I snagged Zebra2. I went through them. Not one of them sounds like a convincted felon made them. They all just kinda sound….the same. Grab 40 random presets I made on Zebra2 and you can imagine me in my mad scientist suit. It’s a different world.

Downsides?

Hmmm. The synth always seems to sound fairly “smooth”…not too far from what a neck pickup does on a high gain guitar. If you go through their presets, ALL of them have this “smooth” quality. The tools are ample to screw that up, but you do have to go out of your way to do so. (Filter drive is great for this.) This isn’t a huge issue, but it may take some getting used to for some. I don’t consider this “smooth” thing a bad thing.

We have encountered a few bugs here and there, but reliability has been 99.9% and I’m pleased. These bugs do seem to pop up at the most opportune times, but that’s just my usual luck.

Other than that I’m really at a loss. There aren’t any other downsides that I can think of.


Is Zebra2 right for you? Hell, I don’t know. It’s right for me and not just by a little bit. I think it’s better than hardware synths for me, I love the way it sounds, and continually find new things to do in it. I’m sold.

I’ve noticed that I’ve not even felt the need to shop for synths online now that I have Zebra2. How often have you bought a synth and then been satisfied enough to not want any more synths? (This is something the high end compressor and EQ makers can’t figure out.)

I feel that some smart dudes into synths sat down and said, “We all use DAWs and love real synth sounds. How do we make these technologies work perfectly with one another?” There was none of this crap like where UAD will intentionally cripple a plugin to have the same workflow limitations of the hardware box. Instead, the Zebra2 guys seem to be a lot more “forward thinking” like the iZotope guys. How can we make synthesis on a computer BETTER than on a real synth? I think they achieved their goal. :beerbangX:

All in all Zebra2 is a total winner. I can’t imagine a person not finding it awesome if they put 20 hours to really learn it in and out. It just sucks that I bought $4,500 in hardware before figuring out that the $200 Zebra2 is the answer. Speaking of that, make sure to check out their “ Dinosaur Crossgrade“.

Ciao Moog lovers !! Zebra's killed Moog's....

[aron]

My GOD, your post reflects the exact way I felt in 1984/5. I had heard about this amazing new synthesizer by Yamaha. WOW, it could do almost any sound realistically. It didn't have 5 or 6 voices but had 16! Sixteen I said "How much?". They said way under 5 grand. WHAT????
Yeah baby - way under 5 grand. NO WAY!!!!!
I got it and it was amazing. Sleek, brown, with amazing sax, harmonica, mallets and it could even make some analog sounds. And not only was it in tune, it was IN TUNE!!!! It could even do exotic scales - quarter tone scales, no problem. Never mind that it didn't have knobs and you couldn't interact with it like analog synths.....
My Polysix, my friends Prophet, my OBX SUCKED in comparison. It was like I was using a hammer and the DX7 was a scalpel.
Put it through effects and it was like nothing ever heard. AMAZING!
And I was getting better and better at programming it. If you put in the time, you could be amazing and this sucker would blow away any analog synth.
I wasn't the only one! Pop music was going wild with this keyboard - everyone was selling their analogs - crappy old analog gear! Out of tune, only one 1-8 notes max, out of tune. WE DON'T NEED IT!
It was quick, easy to use, fast, had breath control. I liked the sound of the DX7 better than ANY of the synths I own.

I didn't feel the need to lust after the Minimoog, or Odyssey, or Prophet or OB-1 now that I had the DX7. I just wanted more DX7!!!!! What a TX816 is available? Now we are talking!!!!!

Ciao analog lovers !!! The DX7 killed all analogs.....

42 years later the analogs are still going. In the same time, the software guys will either retire or be dead. The software will not run anymore on the new hardware. The company will probably be out of business with no upgrade cycle. IF the user didn't manage to migrate the files, it will be lost. oh well.... where's my ZIP drive?
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Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.