Korg Forums

[Kontrol49]

We all know how fast Technology changes and how many synths there are on the market,However one thing that has really baffled me...

I've owned an Oasys from 2008,until 3 years ago,then upgraded(if you can call it that)to a Kronos MK2

The Kronos is just an extension of the Original Oasys Keyboard that was released in 2005,so that makes the base Technology 12 years old..Korg added the Piano/EP Updates to the original engines from Oasys into Kronos other than cosmetics and few peripheral storage options and internal circuits everything else has remained the same on paper.

Were Korg really ahead of their time In 2005 or has the technology really never been challenged or bettered by any of the Other Worksation manufacturers or has the Workstation as a concept just seen a slump..

The others are reluctant to build something to give Korg some competition,We've seen things like the JP80 and Montage as such but nothing that really gives the user so many internal engine options and everything else to compose music in one package,or at least something more on par with Kronos the other synth are luxury instruments but nothing more than simply Performance synths not workstations,they seem light weight in comparison to Kronos specs.

What do you guys think about it....there has never been anything to rival or better Oasys/Kronos...Why?Both Roland and Yamaha and dare I say Kurzweil also have a great heritage of Workstations so why do they not put out anything to rival the Kronos,12 years is a long time in Music Technology,It can't be just down to costs.

[19naia]

Looking at Roland, FA-0? came out as the next step from Phantom.
Phantom was already well established by the time OASYS came out and there are still Phantom qualities lacking in OASYS/Kronos.

FA seems to also have some qualities lacking in Kronos but it seems FA is a step backwards from Phantom and maybe a half step sideways in a different direction. FA seems to lack the flagship presence that Phantom came out with.

Korg on the other hand, has clearly moved forward even if it seems at a slow pace between OASYS release and Kronos 2 release.
Roland gave FA less physical controls than Phantom(sliders were removed).
Korg gave Kronos less physical controls than OASYS(pads and control meter lights were removed.
Yamaha added montage super knob but I'm not sure if they removed any controls that were on previous yamaha generations.

Yamaha has gone to Montage and that seems like a huge step in a new direction when compared to the previous flagship models by Yamaha. But, still not quite where Kronos is.

When it comes to sound engines, Kronos is impressive side by side with other brand workstations. But when it comes to investing in sounds, all flagship workstations are clearly falling behind VSTs.
The number of mentions of Omnisphere/ keyscape now, is evidence enough that quality sound packs have gone to VST's
They key is that home computers easily pack the processing power and more ,to handle better quality sounds. More RAM is easy for computers, way more powerful processor is standard these days, quality sound card and so on.

Kronos actually works like computers for sure, and sound packs can be added as they release but the processing power, RAM size and more, is very limited.
But that is exactly the growing space Korg has for making future workstations that offer much better than the previous generation.
Seems they will remain behind VSTs and DAW though, unless they want to sell Workstations that cost as much a well endowed Laptop with a worthy suite of DAW & VST's. That will take us back to the days of OASYS steep pricing.

Roland went for simpler and cheaper, Korg went for few changes and cheaper.
But Yamaha with Montage? I don't get it. Maybe it is Yamaha's attempt to bust out of the mold like Korg did with OASYS. If so, then it is a weak leap ahead when compared to Korg's leap into OASYS.
I totally expected Roland to come out with something that equalled or out paced Kronos, maybe it is still in the works and maybe will take a while because beating Kronos is no easy task. Especially when computer software Systems are making the high functionality and high quality sound products.
But FA still has significant things going on that kronos does not. Sampling and physical pads as well as supernatural™. That is enough to be relevant next to Kronos. Yamah super knob? not impressive to me.

Still always going to need a good set of keys on a board and RH3 is doing it for me. If the whole world switches to DAW and VST's tomorrow, they will still need midi Keyboard controllers with good piano keys.
I mean, what good is having Spectrasonics Keyscapes without the key action of Kronos RH3 or similar under such nice sounds?

Something is definitley changed in the progression of workstations but it is not odd that a system like OASYS/Kronos stay relevant for so long after coming out as one of the biggest leaps forward in Workstation history.

Sorry Kurzweil fans, i don't even look up their products to compare anymore even after owning a Kurzweil 88 for 2 years around 1997-1998.

[GregC]

[benny ray]

I don't think Roland or Yamaha is interested in making a workstation either. I

agree right now nothing compares to the KRONOS for an all around

keyboard.
_________________
K2 Kronos 88, Mojo 61, Korg CX3, Roland FANTOM 7

[aron]

I don't know why Yamaha doesn't leverage all the tech they have? They could easily make a virtual analog/virtual acoustic/rompler etc... that would kill.

Maybe that was the EX5 and it probably didn't sell well.
_________________
Korg Kronos, RD-88, Yamaha VL1, Deep Mind 6, Korg Kross, author of unrealBook for iPad.

[jones]

[Mr_SamDoogie]

I guess there is something about generating sound that Korg pulled of on the Oasys and amplified it with the Kronos is something others just can't do. There are so many parameters , and modulation types you can do on the recent korg workstation on the oscillator level I only see in VST.

The sound technology Korg made in the Kronos I've found its quiet a different sonic texture different then any workstation keyboard previously its unreal but Korg took it to the core of things parameters , effect , modulation and what not to each sound and still maintain consistent placing for each sound in within the listeners ear and reigns for what is it six years now.

I almost don't want to say it to have favored the Montage above the Kronos lusting for it for so long but as I am no pro player the Montage just sound gorgeous, I guess the day that one will make it into my humble home studio will be bliss.

(had to edit my comment cause I favor many brands)
_________________
In honor of the Groove and to all whom surrender to it, We say Thank You. And we take it Back.

Korg MW1, Casio PX5S & XW-G1, Roland JD-Xi,Yamaha Montage 7, Roland D-05, Bass Station II, Cubase Elements, Sonar X3 Producer.Handfull of IOs Apps iMPC,Animoog : Korg IMS-20,Module, IM1, Gadget etc.

[spaceman3]

KRONOS.
The greatest music making synthesizer ever created by humans.
Unlimited creative power.

[SanderXpander]

It's easy to underestimate the development path for a product with as many facets as the Kronos. While it is indeed an incremental update over the Oasys, when you add up all the smaller and larger changes they still had a lot of work on it. More than between, say, Motif ES and XF. And that is just the update between Oasys and Kronos. The effort to bring Oasys to market was huge, the price reflected this. Unlike Kronos (mostly), Oasys was a work in progress when it was released. It was sort of a test to see if they could build on and expand the system. But in order to release Oasys with all of its hardware and the three original engines, there was a lot of development before 2005. Let's say they started in 2000? Seems kind of short even, from idea to release. Then Kronos in 2011. If another manufacturer wanted to release something like this, perhaps they could do it in less time, building on what Korg has shown. But they'd still need to move from proprietary DSP to Intel, rewrite their code and/or develop new synth engines, all in addition to the basics of every new board - fresh hardware and more/better samples. 8 years maybe?

I think there were probably doubts about the future of the workstation and Korg bet one way while the others didn't. But in order to "jump in" now and release a competitive product would take a huge amount of time and effort. Add to the that the competition from Native Instruments and Akai who already have good PC platforms and they may figure it's a lost battle. I don't think NI or Akai replace my Kronos for live use yet but it may be a way shorter path there than for Yamaha or Kurz or Roland to develop an entirely new board.

[SanderXpander]

Additionally, Kronos isn't for everyone - Nord still has a sizeable market share with a simple and efficient live UI and good sounds, and the Motif had the edge on the sequencer for many people (no idea why they shot themselves in the foot with that).

[AdDeRoo]

[GregC]

[kbrkr]

The product team presents their product strategy to the product sponsor. In their presentation are time, cost, scope, risk, quality, value projections. to obtain funding, the project team must complete a Business Value assessment and a ROI (Return on Investment). The project sponsor presents the plan to the executive committee who decides which projects in the pipeline will return the most value and return on investment.

An ambitious project such as R&D for a new type of sound generation has the potential to impact the companies entire keyboard and module product lines and thus could make a very strong business value/ROI argument. If the value is only "niche" targeted to a very stratified segment such as the "Motif", the ROI is not going to be as great. Thus, the design team needs to scale back their projections and thus there you have the delicate balance between funding and features.

At the start of the year, the company establishes an annual budget for R&D for the entire company based on market evaluations, economy, staffing levels, cost of materials, etc. The budget is then broken down by product line. There is so much competition amongst the many product owners/sponsors within the company itself for the total musical instrument budget, you can start to see where tradeoffs have to be made if your product does not receive the full funding requested.
_________________
Pa5x, Yamaha Genos, ForeScore

[GregC]

[kronoSphere]

Just one regret (though not so important cause there are other solutions everywhere out)
The drum patterns of the Kronos are very outdated and by far and in a strange way these drum patters have too much unnecessary notes within each of them (take a listen to nowadays pop songsor RnB songs at radio : their drums are much more simple and souple)
And it would be a nice things if at regular times Korg offers (or to buy) an entirely new and whole drum patterns file to replace the one in the actual Kronos that is less to say prehistoric
_________________
trees are going fast.

https://www.lairdeparis.fr

Current Gear : Kronos 88 / Seaboard Rise / Triton Extreme / Sequoia / Motif Rack XS / TC Helicon voicelive rack /Awave 11 / Audio & VSTi plug-ins connected /wide touchscreen / iPad Pro 512.