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Korg Kross 2 or a Roland Juno DS61
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Biggles
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Joined: 31 Aug 2017
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:35 pm    Post subject: Korg Kross 2 or a Roland Juno DS61 Reply with quote

I am looking to get either or of the keyboards in the title.

I have tried the Juno and like it but have yet to try the Kross.

Any comments or advice or suggestions welcome.

Edit
I am after a workstation and synth just for hobbyist type use and one that I can easily transport to local venues.

DAW integration is a low priority as I have a controller keyboard already.

I do have a Korg arranger which is to heavy for me to safely transport hence something lighter and without inbuit speakers and amp as I already have a small lightweight amp that meets my needs.
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Biggles
Lancashire, UK


Last edited by Biggles on Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:02 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Koekepan
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Joined: 27 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Absent context, this is a hard question to answer.

Can you explain what your purpose would be? Or your primary desired feature?

Does it need to be a full, standalone workstation capable of recording, sound tweaking and mastering all the way to a .wav on an SD card? Do you value tight DAW integration? Is it basically going to be a controller + soundbank attached to a laptop?

What's your envisaged use?
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Edited original to add more info.
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Biggles
Lancashire, UK
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Koekepan
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Joined: 27 Sep 2016
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 26, 2018 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Roland Juno DS61 is not a workstation. Not really.

A keyboard workstation is something that will let you compose, arrange and record a complex piece of music without external devices. It's an all-in-one studio. The Roland doesn't do a good job of getting there. If this is what you mean by saying that you need a workstation, the Kross is, of the two, the hands-down winner.

If what you really mean is that you need a stage keyboard synthesiser with a wide range of sounds and controllers, then either of the two might meet your need, and it's then a matter of which interface and soundbank suits you better - and without specific use cases, it's harder to really pin down which might better meet your need.
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KalvinB



Joined: 03 Dec 2017
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 11:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was trying to make the same decision back in December. I was looking for a synth for live performances and something to add to the sounds I already had with a number of Yamaha synths (and something lighter in weight than my MOTIF!). Music stores in my area had neither the Kross 2 nor the DS61 in stock to try so I took a chance on ordering the Kross 2 (61), thinking it was slightly newer than the DS61 and had some sampling capabilities. I've been exploring the features of the Kross 2 since it arrived and while I'm not totally happy with it, the Kross 2 is a good synth for it's price point.

I do like that it has some sampling features (although somewhat limited) and a built in sequencer. The programs and combi's are "OK" but I don't think they're anything special. I'm using mostly acoustic piano, electric piano. and organ sounds in live situations and to me those Korg "bread and butter" sounds are "thin" and aren't as good as the ones on my older Yamaha MX (I didn't have a DS-61 to compare either of them to). Technical support for this synth through Korg is almost non-existent. Even though the Kross 2 has been out for several months Korg has yet to release an editor for it, the Korg driver is funky (on my Windows 7 machine I could get audio over USB but not MIDI with the Korg driver installed. I had to disable the Korg driver to get MIDI info to the computer. See Meatball Fulton's post on this site for audio over USB problems).

It's all a matter of what you need in a synth and your individual preferences for the sound. Audition both the Kross 2 and DS-61 if you can (and Yamaha MX if you haven't tried it) to see which one you prefer.
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 10:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks Kalvin

I have played the Juno but not the Kross.

The Juno was great and after watching the online tutorials I do have to say that I have reservations with the Kross, navigating the menu system does seem overly complicated.

It is my major gripe of my 700 the navigation is not user friendly.

Planning on going to my music store tomorrow to test out both side by side.

As for Yamaha, they are not even on the same planet for my consideration, never ever will I buy one of their machines.
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Biggles
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wladymeer



Joined: 24 Feb 2011
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Location: Serbia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here you are some quick mark-ups

Kross 2 has
• multi-sampling feature with 128MB for user samples
• more user storage + all patches/combis could be edited re-written if needed.
In numbers, this means:
1280 vs 256 in Programs
and
896 vs 128 in Combinations
• more pads (16), more intuitive for on-the-fly jammin'
• smaller and lighter body-factor, more airplane-friendly (935x269x88 @ 3.8kg vs 1008x300x97 @ 5.3kg)

Juno-DS61 has
• slot for loading Axial Sound Library (orchestral sounds or world collection are actually nice add-ons)
• more knobs (4 vs 2)
• dedicated buttons for octave / transpose functions that DOES NOT cut sound off
• "sound remain" option for transition between Programs (doesn't work in Combi though)
• numeric (digit) input for patches - yep, you have to jog the wheel for 511 user patches to jump from 473 back to 020 and then all the way up to 496 on Kross
• Reverb and delay effect that can be used together. Yep, Kross can only use 110ms delay if combined with reverb.

So, none of those can be told to be a complete winner. If you're into modern sounds and you're not some patch programmer, my guess is that Juno-DS experience would be more appealing to you as it derives from Fantom engine which was superior to Triton (which seems to me to be the core of the Kross). This is especially audbile if you compare sounds with effects turned off - and if you're into live performance, you know you will have to make a sacrifice for some programs FX.

Juno-DS also has more polished OS for live performance, but on the other hand has small user storage and that's big deal-breaker for me.

This is year 2018 and someone should tell those companies that it's not even funny to limit us with numbers that are coming from decades ago... I mean.

But, on the other hand, same could be said to Korg - it would be nice to see one OS update that would resolve issues with their low-budget products and not just move towards next NAMM.
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Using: Kurzweil PC3K6, Korg TRITON-RACK, Akai MINIAK, Akai SYNTHSTATION49, Waldorf BLOFELD, Novation X-STATION 61, Roland AX-SYNTH
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 28, 2018 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Many thanks for such a detailed response.
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Biggles
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well an hour today in a great store swapping from the Kross 2 to a DS 61 and back again multiple times has left me even more confused.

I really want the Korg to work for me but its menu system is just so unfriendly and I do not seem to be able to do anything quick and easy.

By contrast the Juno is so easy to navigate.

But the Korg sounds better, is lighter and would be easier for me to transport.

Oh what to do?
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Biggles
Lancashire, UK
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Koekepan
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 03, 2018 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ask yourself: can I learn a menu system?

If the answer is "No!" then get a Roland.

Otherwise, consider the KORG.
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KalvinB



Joined: 03 Dec 2017
Posts: 20

PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 4:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Biggles. I'm glad you got to try both synths out in the store. The Kross 2 menus are a pain but if you prefer the Korg sound to the Roland ask yourself how often you'll really be using the menu system. I'm setting up my most used Programs and Combi's in the "Favorites" buttons for live use. You'll still need to use the menus if you want to set up your own Combi's or edit voices (until Korg releases an editor for the Kross 2!), for processing samples, and for Global settings. You can download the Kross 2 manual (no, it's not an easy read but it does help) and look through it to see how much you'll really need to use the onboard menu. Good luck with it!
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 10:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have had a read of part of the manual and found
.
LAYER/SPLIT button
The Quick Layer/Split function lets you adjust settings by pressing the front panel LAYER/SPLIT button.
Note: This function is available if Program mode is selected. It is not available in Combination mode.
Note: It is not available when selecting favorites.
.
So it looks as though you cannot use a split keyboard and have favourites and combos.

Having a split and easily use setup for the split and quick instrument selection (particularly right hand) is looking as though it is my main requirement.

With the Kross when using a split keyboard you have to mess around in the menu system to get the sound balance right yet with the Roland you have two physical sliders, one for upper and the other for lower.

So for live performances the Roland looks by far a better buy.

Time to go back to my music store and have a final playoff.

Back to reading the manaul.
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Biggles
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KalvinB



Joined: 03 Dec 2017
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the layer/split function is supposed to be for a "quick setup" (which it isn't!) for one time use. As I understand it you set up a layer or split the way you like it and if you want to keep it you need to save it as a Combi to the Kross 2 ram and to an SD card. Once it's stored you can call it up as a favorite.

I finally got to play a DS-61 last week and while I liked it I wasn't totally pleased with its functions either. The two physical volume sliders on the Roland would be much more useful in a live situation rather than messing with the "real time" buttons and knobs on the Korg (the larger Yamaha synths I have use 4 sliders for 4 voices/splits/layers).

I have yet to find the perfect syth, so you have to decide what works best for you (or whatever you can "live with"!). A "final playoff" will help you decide.
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Biggles
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 04, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers Kalvin.

After reading half the manual my eyes are red rimmed and my head hurts.

It is starting to make some sort of sense.

Sure the School of Manual Writers have as their motto ........

si id difficile est via nostra est

Hope the online translation is accurate or I could be in bother.
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Biggles
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kingkorgkross



Joined: 01 Feb 2018
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 05, 2018 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Biggles!

I purchased a Korg Kross about 6 months ago and was considering the Roland as well.

IMO, you should go for the korg kross if you've had a Korg arranger before. The reason is the keybed.

I've always found the height of the roland keys to be very small compared to a Yamaha or a Korg, I tend to use multiple keyboards based on situations rather than relying on 1 workstation/arranger for everything. It is often a pain to switch to and from a Roland.
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