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RESTART OF 4X On Stage :(
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Asena
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Joined: 03 Mar 2004
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Location: Sweden/Malmoe

PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 1:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Attensione Paolo, you have a PM From Global music Wink
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BR
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Joined: 19 Oct 2004
Posts: 1493
Location: USA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Asena wrote:
......
And this time Even from PAOLO, so i,m here to help US, not only me. And i,m replaying to Paolo now, so let see if we can catch this bad Bugg.
Again guys Thank you all, Love from me to all of you out there Smile

As you mentioned we are here like a small family and our goal is to make music (professionally or as hobby)
and reports any problem regarding our product (for example Pa4X in this case) in order to
have a stable working keyboard and helping each other.

It would be very hepfull too if Paolo can communicate with us here at least regarding
this annoying Rebooting issue with NEXT-V3.0.1 and if there is any update soon.
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karmathanever
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Joined: 12 Jan 2004
Posts: 10393

PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Asena

I so very much feel your pain and frustration with this problem.
If I was as busy as you (musically) I would be screaming and wondering what to do with my PA4X - sell it? Burn it? etc Wink !!!!

I hope you can get a reaction from Korg about this - even an acknowledgement would be a little more comforting.

I see that you are trying to contact Paolo.
Paolo is our friend here and has done so much for us in the past but I do know that he no longer has the same control regarding the PA series since the Korg internal re-structure.
It would be good to know exactly who we should be contacting - I do not think Paolo is able to comment any more but I guess at least, he could pass on your message.

Asena - you are good person and greatly respected and appreciated here on our forums - thank you for trying to push this further.
I will make some local enquiries through our distributors and see if I can get some contact details etc...

Take care

Pete Very Happy
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Paolo@Korg
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Joined: 07 Dec 2002
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

karmathanever wrote:
We need a reaction from Korg even if it's a tiny one like "...we're working on it..."

"We're working on it!"

There are a few things we have fixed with the next OS version. In the meantime, as long as detailed reports come from beta testers and users, we can include more cases in our fixes.

Each situation is different, at least slightly. Someone's problem may never happen in the instruments in our labs, or in the hands of the other users. It depends on the data being processed, and each set or data is different.

So, each time we can examine a bug report, we can remove the causes of an issue that can affect a single user, and is a potential harm for other users with a similar (but not identical) set of data. The more user data we can analyze in case of bugs, the better.

The new OS is coming. No official release date, however, apart for "very soon”.

Paolo


Last edited by Paolo@Korg on Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:14 pm; edited 1 time in total
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kleant
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Joined: 10 May 2013
Posts: 106

PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you Paolo, thank you Korg at least some fresh air and some official statement not pointless instructions from members who know nothing more than any other member Smile

Great to know that a new update its coming soon very excited and I hope and pray apart from the reported Bug fixes to add 1 or 2 extra USER STYLE BANKS or at least increase the page number.

Keep up the good work!

Thank you again Smile
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BR
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Joined: 19 Oct 2004
Posts: 1493
Location: USA

PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paolo@Korg wrote:
...... The more user data we can analyze in case of bugs, the better......
Paolo

Thank you Paolo for your reply and cooperation.

Just a suggestion:
How about testing the Pa4X in your lab with the data of users that have directly this rebooting issue in their Pa4X?
Asking the users to send you their data (.SET) to test by your Korg team in order to troubleshoot and isolate the issue.
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Paolo@Korg
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi BR,
BR wrote:
How about testing the Pa4X in your lab with the data of users that have directly this rebooting issue in their Pa4X?

I agree that this is the only way to catch the problems, so it is what we try to do when these issues are reported.

Paolo
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karmathanever
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2019 12:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Paolo

Really appreciate knowing the status.

Kind regards

Pete Very Happy
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Korghelper
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Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 584

PostPosted: Mon Jun 24, 2019 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I’d probably suggest that those with intermittent issues at the very least post their OS, SN# (so Korg can internally track manufacturer batch and component differences), voltage (in case there’s a correlation there), and name any third party sample sets they always preload.

The lack of stuff like this not only hinders Korg from spotting possible culprits, but also prevents us from spotting common causes. Plus, more details might prevent the knee-jerk responses of ‘Nothing wrong with MY PA4’ once those that post them realize that their PA4 may have a different OS, voltage, manufacturer batch, or may be loaded with sample sets they don’t use.

Those that have never suffered a problem could also help, for a change(!), by detailing the same information, allowing us (and Korg) to perhaps spot similarities in trouble free units.

Bug fixing is never a simple issue, and needs patience and understanding from BOTH sides of the issue... unless an issue affects everyone (and it’s pretty rare those get out in the wild) the issue is rarely improved by one side battling the other. Those without the issue are as responsible as those with it to help find as speedy a fix as possible, and those with the issue need to be patient and realize new OS’s can’t be coded overnight!

Pull together, and you won’t have to pull as hard!
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karmathanever
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 12:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Korghelper wrote:
I’d probably suggest that those with intermittent issues at the very least post their OS, SN# (so Korg can internally track manufacturer batch and component differences), voltage (in case there’s a correlation there), and name any third party sample sets they always preload.

The lack of stuff like this not only hinders Korg from spotting possible culprits, but also prevents us from spotting common causes. Plus, more details might prevent the knee-jerk responses of ‘Nothing wrong with MY PA4’ once those that post them realize that their PA4 may have a different OS, voltage, manufacturer batch, or may be loaded with sample sets they don’t use.

Those that have never suffered a problem could also help, for a change(!), by detailing the same information, allowing us (and Korg) to perhaps spot similarities in trouble free units.

Bug fixing is never a simple issue, and needs patience and understanding from BOTH sides of the issue... unless an issue affects everyone (and it’s pretty rare those get out in the wild) the issue is rarely improved by one side battling the other. Those without the issue are as responsible as those with it to help find as speedy a fix as possible, and those with the issue need to be patient and realize new OS’s can’t be coded overnight!

Pull together, and you won’t have to pull as hard!

+1000
Thank you!!!

I'll say again, Korg need more details in order to capture intermittent and non-reproducible problems.
Without all the detail it would be near impossible to "test" and debug.

I relate this to a problem with my son's new car - within a 2 week period the car will just instantly stop as if the ignition was turned off but restarts immediately after and then might not happen for many days. It took nearly a year to "fix" purely by continually replacing parts - still don't know exactly why it happened.

Korg is faced with the same dilemma here but at least, so far, it does seem that it is OS 3.0.x that may have the bug.

I have said earlier that I am more than prepared to test out anyone's data on my PA4X if desired. I am also keen to know if I really have this bug or not.

Cheers

Pete Very Happy
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Korghelper
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 4:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Certain forums ask that bug reporting follow a standard template where the reporters have to format their problem in a predefined fashion. Perhaps we should adopt something along those lines?

Model# - SN# - OS# - voltage

Repeatable issue or not.

If repeatable, step by step to reproduce the issue.

If not, anecdotal examples of whether issue occurs at home/gig/after how long/during what operation/how often problem occurs etc.

But probably one of the most useful things to help Korg focus on the issues would be to keep bitching about changes in operation off of bug threads!

The same strident voices determined to bring up their problems over and over despite them not being bugs but changes to the OS (which is another thing altogether) does nothing but dilute Korg’s focus. The clearer we can present the data, the more likely it is to be addressed. Rambling threads rarely produce results...

[/b]
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mintjamman
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Joined: 11 Oct 2015
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2019 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Reading through the obvious frustrations presented we all know the pain of a instrument randomly shutting down mid performance.

What is important is that Paolo has shown up and communicated that Korg are working on this problem and that this will calm folks a little, there is nothing worse than an issue like this and people think their concerns are falling on deaf ears and having a direct post from Paolo is indeed welcome.

As yet I have not had such a shutdown since V3 and V3.1 so cannot contribute anything on that front although I have had two freezes when saving data in Sequencer mode but cannot reliably replicate why that happened.

I did contact Paolo a couple of months back about the new V3 Organ makeover but never heard anything from him on that score but hope that Korg review all such feedback with a view to making changes when users define such issues.
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Korghelper
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 30, 2019 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Paolo@Korg wrote:
karmathanever wrote:
We need a reaction from Korg even if it's a tiny one like "...we're working on it..."

"We're working on it!"

There are a few things we have fixed with the next OS version. In the meantime, as long as detailed reports come from beta testers and users, we can include more cases in our fixes.

Each situation is different, at least slightly. Someone's problem may never happen in the instruments in our labs, or in the hands of the other users. It depends on the data being processed, and each set or data is different.

So, each time we can examine a bug report, we can remove the causes of an issue that can affect a single user, and is a potential harm for other users with a similar (but not identical) set of data. The more user data we can analyze in case of bugs, the better.

The new OS is coming. No official release date, however, apart for "very soon”.

Paolo


While it's nice to hear from Paolo, in truth, this answer is a non-answer, when taken in context of a thread specifically about random reboots. "There are a few things we have fixed with the next OS version" doesn't mention whether the reboots are one of them..! Nor whether they have ever been able to get an in-lab PA4X to reboot.
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karmathanever
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Korghelper wrote:
Nor whether they have ever been able to get an in-lab PA4X to reboot

...and that is the worst nightmare when troubleshooting software problems.
Hopefully Korg can obtain the full data from an owner who is experiencing this issue and then they can maybe get closer to a result.
Several of us are not experiencing this which makes the troubleshooting harder.

mintjamman wrote:
What is important is that Paolo has shown up and communicated that Korg are working on this problem and that this will calm folks a little, there is nothing worse than an issue like this and people think their concerns are falling on deaf ears and having a direct post from Paolo is indeed welcome.

+1
I, too, am personally grateful that Paolo has acknowledged the issue and confirmed that the OS is being looked at etc....

Cheers

Pete Very Happy
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...and play lots of music Very Happy
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Korghelper
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it actually is true that the new OS has fixed some things, why not go ahead and tell us what they are, Paolo?

That way, those with issues that have been fixed can relax a bit, and those with issues that have not can concentrate on providing better data on the problem....

We are all (mostly!) grownups here. You won’t spoil Christmas by telling us what we are getting!
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