Korg Forums

Hector Space · Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 10:15 am Post subject: Kronos USB A and Midi output

Do the Kronos USB A type ports support midi output?
I’ve setup a combi with the correct channel number, an EXT2 timbre set the MSB and LSB bank select and program change number. When the combi is selected it sends the correct data out the Kronos Midi DIN out (as checked on MidiOX) but does not appear to send anything out the USB A type connector that is attached to the synth I wish to control (RD2000)

If I connect the RD2000 midi din in to the Kronos midi din out it works. But this destroys the value and simplicity of the single FAST usb link between the two. Which I’ve found improves the latency when playing many notes.

I’ve found nothing in the manual(S) that clearly states they do or don’t.

So are the Kronos USB A type ports MIDI input only?

PCFREE · Posted: Tue Jul 27, 2021 3:42 pm Post subject:

Hi Hector

Unfortunately not. They only support midi in.
_________________
Kurzweil K2700, Korg Nautilus 61, Yamaha MODX6

....as we forgive those who synthesize against us!!

Hector Space · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 10:31 am Post subject:

Thanks.. I’m in shock.. seems rather a short sighted omission. I’m wondering why Korg felt that this was OK.

Especially when you consider the Kronos USB support is otherwise pretty comprehensive.

It seems to me that it is inconsistent with Korg’s concept of the workstation keyboard. One that replaces the need for a DAW… If it truly did replace a DAW then it’s type A USB connectors would support bi-directional midi.

I can only assume there’s a good reason they don’t. Shame they couldn’t be honest and direct about it.

SeedyLee · Posted: Wed Jul 28, 2021 12:27 pm Post subject:

They were honest and direct about it, IMHO. Remember that the Kronos didn’t ship with USB MIDI support on the USB-A connectors - it was a feature added later with the proviso that it only supports incoming MIDI.

Though I do agree it gets tiring trying to read between the lines of these things.
_________________
Current Equipment:
Korg Kronos 2 88, Reface CS, Roland JV-1080, TE OP1, Moog Subsequent 37, Korg ARP Odyssey, Allen & Heath Zed 18, Adam F5, MOTU MIDI Express XT, Lexicon MX200 & MPX1, Yamaha QY700, Yamaha AW16G, Tascam DP008ex, Zoom H6, Organelle, Roland J6 & JU06A

Previous: Triton LE 61/Sampling/64MB/4GB SCSI, MS2000BR, Kronos 1 61, Monotribe, NanoKontrol, NanoKeys, Kaossilator II, Casio HT3000, Roland VP-03, Reface DX, Novation Mininova, MPC One

Hector Space · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:10 am Post subject:

I suppose I came to the party late so I missed that part of the Kronos’s history. Like I say if the manual clearly stated what the USB A type ports support then it would have been a 30min job to understand instead of a couple days.

I suppose I should be grateful the Kronos supports midi in via usb A since that is the best and most elegant solution to coupling up my RD2000 to the K2 in a gig rig.

Just a shame I’ve now got two sets of patches(Programs on the RD and Combis on the K2) to set for each song.

Before you state I could simply add a midi din cable from the K2 for RD program control.. Currently the RD2000 midi input is hogged by my midi bass pedals so I’d have to add a midi merge box… blah blah.. and yet more gear to setup.

The only other streamlined option seems to be to use an external zone on the RD to send combi changes to the K2 via the G channel.. the downside is it’s a zone used up on the Roland and some of the cc messages sent from the RD to the K2 on program entry get lost when the combi change is sent from that program. So it’s better the other way round.

I guess midi merge will be the solution. Hay ho.

PCFREE · Posted: Thu Jul 29, 2021 10:25 pm Post subject:

Obvious question, Hector…

I presume you’re already using the USB B connector on the Kronos for something else - that’s why you’re asking about the USB A?
Otherwise, that would be the way forward
_________________
Kurzweil K2700, Korg Nautilus 61, Yamaha MODX6

....as we forgive those who synthesize against us!!

Hector Space · Posted: Fri Jul 30, 2021 10:08 am Post subject:

Well I’ve discounted usb b because it needs an external host e.g. a computer/tablet/notebook.. and then this in turn relies on passing midi via the host to and from the Kronos and RD2000.

I have no intention in taking a computer or notebook to gigs in addition to the Kronos as otherwise what’s the point of the Kronos ?

Most tablets only support a single usb e.g. my iPad. So there would need to be an additional box. Either a hub or a descent into a midi sport 2x2 midi din unit.

And in any case adding usb through via any device will compromise the latency and timing determinism. Because the intermediate device has to unpacked, process, repack and transmit every message received. Even if it only did this and nothing else (honest!) it would add variable delays.

I’ve spent a fair amount of time with the K playing its pianos via external keyboards like the RD2000 and Casio Privia PX5S. There are two things that make a noticeable temporal difference. 1. Is not stealing 2 (minimised by turning all other timbres off and cutting out sympathetic resonance). Midi USB via the K2 usb A port (as opposed to midi DIN).

Hector Space · Posted: Fri Aug 06, 2021 10:53 am Post subject:

It seems I maybe about to eat my words!!!
I’ve just put together a usb midi host box that enables the interconnection of usb type b ports and avoids needing a pc/Mac/tablet between the two connecting instruments.

The box is a Raspberry Pi model B which has two type a USB ports. I’ve installed a simple piece of script (there are several ways this can be done and they are available in several places on the web) that enables the direct bi directional connection, via the Linux ALSA sub system, between the RD2000 on one port and the Kronos on the other port.

It works! And it works very well!! In fact I’d say that it is faster and a less prone to flammy ness than using the Kronos type A USB port to connect the RD2000.

So with exception of not being able to turn off the Kronos's out pouring on the Gth channel, I have a solution which is actually faster and hence more musical than the previous way of connecting.

I will also add (extra egg on face!) that changing the position at which the Kronos adds its velocity curve adjustment from pre midi out to post (global) makes a huge difference to the way velocity from external keyboards like the RD2000 is interpreted. I’d assumed wrongly that the Kronos vanilla response would be pretty much standard so given the quality of the Roland’s keyboard it should just be a matter of some minor tweaks in the SGX2 engine… wrong!

Just switching from pre to post makes a huge difference to the playability of those big pianos…

So now the Jap grands have some accessible subtlety and the German grands are really quite beautiful…

And with the Pi usb host the whole system is very precise.. almost like playing a real piano!

Whoop!!