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Official statement on the status and future of the OASYS
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Charlie
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Joined: 30 Oct 2006
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Location: Austria

PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2010 6:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Pieter: don't put everybody into the same box. I and many others here expressed their thoughts about the up- and downsides of their Oasys-deal (that includes negativ points as well). And I wrote already I don't want to take away anybodys anger. I don't expect anybody to agree with my views - be they negative or positive. But just like you ask for tolerance regarding negative comments I kindly ask you to tolerate positive ones too. I fail to see anything wrong with people being happy with their Oasys-decesion.

@Cello: you gave me a good laugh with your cello-support comment! Laughing It's good to have you here and share your thoughts as you are one of the people who bought the Oasys AFTER it was discontinued. Many of us keep being stuck in their perceptions as lots of old stuff makes it difficult to see their instrument from a somewhat neutral point of view. To me it's quite amazing how emotional some members of this forum become once the up- and downsides of their former buying-decesion are discussed. Humans are amazing creations! Wink
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anatal digilog



Joined: 06 Jan 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cello wrote:
Just my 2cents...[edit]
3000 units x $6000 (have chosen a low average new price) still netted Korg $18,000,000. [edit]

This is completely misleading! We have no exact idea what Korg was charging its dealers for an OASYS - you can't use the $6000 as a price to determine net profit. Typically the retail/list price is 40-50% mark-up from what the dealer pays, and then they sell it for about 20-30% less ('street price'). On top of that, Korg Japan had to 'cover' the costs of paying Korg R&D in California to develop the software over many, many years. I wouldn't be surprised if Korg barely covered their costs in building & selling the OASYS.
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vEddY
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2011 5:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

anatal digilog wrote:

This is completely misleading! We have no exact idea what Korg was charging its dealers for an OASYS - you can't use the $6000 as a price to determine net profit. Typically the retail/list price is 40-50% mark-up from what the dealer pays, and then they sell it for about 20-30% less ('street price'). On top of that, Korg Japan had to 'cover' the costs of paying Korg R&D in California to develop the software over many, many years. I wouldn't be surprised if Korg barely covered their costs in building & selling the OASYS.

Now that's what I call reasonable assumption, it's been awhile. From what information I could gater in the past years, they didn't break even with OASYS. Translation, they didn't cover the costs. And that wasn't the premise upon they built the OASYS. Katoh-san said "all the best you can think of". Or, as someone said, "S-class".
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kenackr
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

As a former music store owner, I can tell you that almost ALL keyboards from the big 3 were usually a "C" mark in retail speak. Retail speak for those who aren't familiar with it, is a "code" of sorts that lets retailers quickly understand what they will normally pay for a product based on the "Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price" (MSRP).

Most of the smaller stores (like mine, under $1 Million in sales) deal with either factory reps or independent rep firms reps, usually in the middle of the store during business hours (if someone didn't show up for work that day). A=50% markup, B= 40% markup, C=30% markup.

The term "markup" was also misleading because it really meant the ratio of Retail Price divided by cost. So an "A" mark really meant your cost was half of the MSRP, B mark meant your cost was 60% of MSRP, and C mark meant your cost was 70% of MSRP. After all, you don't want to have your customer overhear store staff say, "why yes, we actually mark things up by 100% over cost" which is the true mathematical statement of it.

Further, in the general world of retail, if you didn't keep profit margins of at least 40%, it meant you were going down the big toilet bowl in the sky.

So the moral of the story is this: anytime you sell a C mark item (like a keyboard) and give even a small discount (~10%) you were barely covering your costs (including overhead: payroll, taxes, etc adnauseum) and not making much, if any money from it. Why would any rational & sane person sell them, you might wonder? The truth is, anyone who owns or runs a music store is neither rational nor sane. I'm living proof of that. Boo hoo!

So folks, you can pull out your imaginary calculators all you like, but I would bet that when all is said & done and all costs covered, very few people in this world added anything to their retirement account based on sales of the Oasys alone.

Happy Trails, buckaroos! Beer

Ken

PS - ever have a day when you lost $35k/hour? Hows that Pepto Bismal holding up? 3d Faint
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panteli



Joined: 08 Sep 2006
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 9:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is this a joke?

SGX-1 Premium Piano (Acoustic Piano)
EP-1 MDS Electric Piano (Electric Piano)
HD-1 High Definition Synthesizer (PCM Virtual Memory Technology)
AL-1 Analog Synthesizer (Analog Modeling)
CX-3 Tonewheel Organ (Tonewheel Organ Modeling)
STR-1 Plucked String (Physical Modeling)
MOD-7 Waveshaping VPM Synthesizer (VPM Synthesis)
MS-20EX (CMT Analog Modeling)
PolysixEX (CMT Analog Modeling)

Kronos? I think Oasys in a new box....
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cello
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

panteli wrote:
Is this a joke?

SGX-1 Premium Piano (Acoustic Piano)
EP-1 MDS Electric Piano (Electric Piano)
HD-1 High Definition Synthesizer (PCM Virtual Memory Technology)
AL-1 Analog Synthesizer (Analog Modeling)
CX-3 Tonewheel Organ (Tonewheel Organ Modeling)
STR-1 Plucked String (Physical Modeling)
MOD-7 Waveshaping VPM Synthesizer (VPM Synthesis)
MS-20EX (CMT Analog Modeling)
PolysixEX (CMT Analog Modeling)

Kronos? I think Oasys in a new box....


I think you'll find that many of us O users think the same; see other threads in OASYS section including 'time for upgrade/update?'
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t_tangent
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+ 1

Didn't want to say too much before as I didnt want to sound like a selfish lone crusader, but it does seem clear to me that pretty much every other OASYS user feels that Korg have left us high and dry. What irritates me really is that this is now the SECOND time that Korg has let us down. First of all was the huge disappointment when Korg dropped support for the OASYS almost straight after that massive M3 update called M3 EXPANDED. After that initial disappointment a couple of years back, at least we still had the knowledge that OASYS was a one off instrument that had a place in music history, and due to its limited numbers it was still able to hold a reasonable resale value if we did need to sell.

But now Korg has hit us a second time with their new workstation. With the Kronos being pretty much a refined OASYS with some very nice new features which many OASYS users had asked Korg to implement (for example disk streaming, instant and silent program changing) as a result the OASYS resale value will presumably drop considerably.

While I realise that this does occur in other fields of technology I think the most upsetting thing is that Korg have so obviously ignored the OASYS so much, even during the Kronos presentation and it is as if they have swept us under the carpet. Again, equally annoying is that they surely must have known that people would notice that this is basically a revised OASYS. By not even acknowledging the OASYS as the mother of Kronos, it's as if they think that we are all idiots and don't matter.

I hesitate to say this, but it does kind of feel slightly deceitful as well, and I am relieved that by the number of posts in the last few days I am not the only one out there that feels this.

So on the one hand a wonderful new instrument from Korg which I wish them success with, but on the other hand a sense of betrayal by Korg which is a great shame.

Let's just hope that Korg do see the error of their ways and are able to rectify the dissatisfaction that has been expressed yet again. If that becomes the case then I will eat my words, and possibly my shorts.

Tim
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cello
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VERY well put t_tangent

Trust me you are very much not alone on this forum, and several others around the globe (ie non-English speaking boards).

I just don't get how Korg thinks it's okay to treat O users the way they have done - firstly and basically, cutting the OASYS program short, irrespective of investment customers made in light of their promises and then second, to effectively de-value the residual current value of the O.

I too hope that Korg sees the opportunity here to appease the O user base worldwide in some way.
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Akos Janca
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

t_tangent wrote:
...By not even acknowledging the OASYS as the mother of Kronos...



Dear Tim, cello and all,

When I was thinking about what happened and I recognized exactly the above, another thought came into my mind: OASYS is not the mother of KRONOS. Korg is the mother of both. They are siblings, beloved children of Korg.

I try to see the situation from this perspective.

Best regards,
Akos
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cello
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for your positive outlook Akos - and it's good you look at it this way! You're right as well - of course, they are siblings.

I will try to remind myself of your positive way of looking at things but at the moment, I see that one of the children is being hidden away like the ugly sister, but it is the other (favourite child), like Cinderella, that shall go to the ball! Wink
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Akos Janca
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I knew you were going to say it! Wink
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cello
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 16, 2011 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Akos Janca wrote:
I knew you were going to say it! Wink


I know - I'm completely predictable! Embarassed

I will try and do better in the future Wink
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rsaav375



Joined: 26 Feb 2011
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 10:03 am    Post subject: Oasys 'Open Architecture' Reply with quote

Hi everybody,

I just registered to the forum, so I have plenty of information to read (and write Smile)

I am wondering if, after releasing Kronos, Korg would be willing to release the sources for Oasys ... I believe some work is being done already, but an official release from Korg would be a huge kick-off for exploring the true "Open Architecture" capabilities of the Oasys.

Don't you think?

Regards,

Rob
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Charlie
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 26, 2011 12:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's very unlikely ... Rolling Eyes
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bbendorf



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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 8:42 am    Post subject: I love my Oasys but need help getting it repaired Reply with quote

Hello,
My O had its hd fail. I tried for 3 years to get 4 Cd set from Korg support with total denial. I paid so much for expansions etc. I took my O to a service center because hd kept locking up on boot. After 3.4 months at service center and I could not get parts or help from Korg. I loved Korg and they always treated the Oasys customers with respect and a sence of urgency. But now sence Kronos is out and a special credit of $300 for Kronos sounds that is a useless gift, my O is still broken. It locks up, no buttons work and then buzzes on main output. The service center eventually got new screen and hd. But now when I read the USB or try to copy sounds it locks up. 100% un usable. I purchased it in late 2009. Korg NEVER has sent me my 4 free CD set as promised. Nor does Korg post the diagnostic codes or service manuals. Instead they send me spam to buy Kronos sounds.
Does anyone here know where and how to set up my Oasys HD re formatted to current OS? Does anyone know what buttons to hold during boot to run diagnostics so I can order parts? My dealer can't get cd set!! Is this the way others are being treated who blew 10k on a expandable keyboard that would be replaced? I am really upset. Spent 1500 bucks for new screen and HD. Then Korg can't even get proper support to ther repair places. My 0 has been down for 6 months. Please somebody tell me who to call at Korg that can fix my O or tell me a service center near Ventura CA 93030. That Korg will return there phone calls? I can't even sell it because it is broke. If I could sell it then I could buy it back under the new name Kronos.

Please help I loved my Oasys and all the sounds.

If Korg does not help .... Well YouTube could help worn people about how they treat customers Twisted Evil
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