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DAW Integration questions (for Dan, Rich or Jerry)
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Michael Blue
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 2:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a burning topic for many potential KRONOS buyers.

Whether or not I take a $1,500+ hit on my OASYS and raise an additional $6-700 to buy a KRONOS 88 at launch completely depends on the functionality of this feature.

Could we PLEASE get some very clear info on how this works; what functions we will and will not be able to achieve out of the box?

A video (or 3) would be VERY helpful and appreciated here.

THANK YOU!

~M
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billysynth1
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 3:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

-
I have already asked if Korg will put together a Tutorial Video for all our questions and concerns. Dan did answer it was a good idea...but he did not indicate if it would actually happen.

I think a new thread should be started for:
"Request for Kronos Video Tutorial."
and we can request what we would like to be shown.
I'm sure RichF can do this for us if he has time.

We can use this tutorial while waiting for the release of Kronos and can generate more questions as needed.

Open Labs provide three tutorials a week on thier O-Live site. You get a real insight into thier instruments.

Can not see why Korg cant put one together....what you need a Hollywood
director and producer? lol hahaha

Billy
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nowtime
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Joined: 27 Aug 2009
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 3:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Michael Blue wrote:
This is a burning topic for many potential KRONOS buyers.

Whether or not I take a $1,500+ hit on my OASYS and raise an additional $6-700 to buy a KRONOS 88 at launch completely depends on the functionality of this feature.

Could we PLEASE get some very clear info on how this works; what functions we will and will not be able to achieve out of the box?

A video (or 3) would be VERY helpful and appreciated here.

THANK YOU!

~M


Oh man, I would not bet on being happy with such a feature. Even if it appears to work in some tutorial video. This is not exactly Korg's specialty is it?
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Michael Blue
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 21, 2011 5:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

nowtime wrote:
...This is not exactly Korg's specialty is it?



Historically, no. The OASYS had NO USB integration to speak of, and it's my single biggest gripe with living with it on a daily basis.
...But the comment "as a plug-in" rings in my head.
Time - and technology - march on, let's hope Korg has implemented some of it here.
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jahrome
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 2:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Question: Will Korg workstations ever be able to save projects in a format easily readable by a DAW? Or directly open a project created on a DAW?

Motif series projects are saved in Cubase format. It would be awesome if Kronos (or future workstation) could import or export in Pro Tools format.
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 3:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It would already be good if I could save all my Kronos settings with my ProTools session...

Even better if I could transfer by USB my 16 parts...

Completely awesome if I could easily transfer files (samples and songs) from the SSD to the computer by USB...

And simply speechless if I could load/save or import/export songs in OMF...

So let see how good Korg will be from this happiness and satisfaction scale Wink

Phil
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Vadim
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

SpIdErWeB wrote:


Even better if I could transfer by USB my 16 parts...



would that be practical? since having a good amount of MIDI notes coming out of computer to any external keyboard/module introduces MIDI jitter, MIDI notes not being all exactly on time. (by "good amount of midi notes" I mean at least about 8 tracks, each about 3 notes at the same time)
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 22, 2011 4:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what? Midi jitter is everywhere... How would it be different to have it from your Kronos to your computer in USB or having it from Kronos Midi Out to your Computer Midi In? Most of the case, your Midi interface for the computer will still be in USB or Firewire anyway.

When I lay down a sequence on the MPC to my ProTools, I still do have to send all MIDI notes (which are often more than 8 tracks with 3 notes)...

And by transfer the 16 Parts, I mean Audio Stream of the Combi Parts to the Computer for Total Integration...

Phil
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Vadim
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

if you have hardware weqencer like MPC than the MIDI jitter is unnoticeable, but sending midi from computer to hardware it gets very noticeable after some tracks. sending 16 midi tracks to external midi is virtually useless, unless all of the tracks are pad sounds or slow strings.
I think 8 channels over USb is the most that would be usefull. or Even better: using software synths, except that there aren't much good sounding software synths like KRONOS, Motif, fantom. (there are some good drums and orchestral plugins/libraries but no all-around multi itmbral synth)
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry but I still don't get it... If you ever used a Midi Interface with your computer (Motu, M-Audio, etc...), and send some sequence made on your midi hardware sequencer (Workstation, MPC, etc...), you already went jitter issues... and I'm even not mention the 10-bit conversion due to serial asynchronous communication format of Midi 1.0

So, there's no difference between this case and the case to send midi tracks directly over the USB to the computer...

USB 2.0 is 480 Mbit/s... when Midi in 8-N-1 format is 31 kbits/s per channel max. So even with 16 channels, you won't overload the USB port...

In conclusion: We actually don't care because it's even not what I was talking about... again, I was talking about Audio Streaming and not Midi.

EOF,
Phil
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mjames4208
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

i always thought jitter was to do with audio.... MIDI is not audio.
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, technically it could be (the same way there was a sort of jitter back in the day of old-school Midi sequencer too).

But it's not noticeable... and less an issue than Audio which requires way way more bandwidth than midi (roughly 172 kB/s for a 16/44.1 stereo track).

Phil
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mjames4208
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MIDI has nothing to do with JITTER!
jitter is about audio in the digital domain i.e digital audio converters.
remember how CD players sounded back in the early 80... bright and harsh?
that is jitter...
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mjames4208
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue43/jitter.htm
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SpIdErWeB
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 24, 2011 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MIDI is technically also exposed to latency/jitter since there's also possible conversion and clock issues. However, as mentioned it's not noticeable...

In the other hand I still don't why we keep talking about Midi since it wasn't at all what I wrote in the first place.

I repete clearly for a freaking last time: I MEANT Audio Streaming of the 16 parts from Kronos to Computer... (such Total Integration)

Phil
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