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Nightmare!
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dumeril7
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Joined: 15 May 2011
Posts: 143
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm really sorry you're having so many issues with this touchscreen. I don't see any other way for you to move forward except to either get your M3 fixed, or abandon it and get a new keyboard.

D7
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madbeatzyo111
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I remember Alland talking about cleaning inside the gap between the touchscreen and the frame and how it fixed an issue with the touchscreen, but I can't seem to find that thread anymore. Here's a similar one with the same idea. Long shot I know...

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=40049
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gurn
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 02, 2011 11:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dumeril7 wrote:
I'm really sorry you're having so many issues with this touchscreen. I don't see any other way for you to move forward except to either get your M3 fixed, or abandon it and get a new keyboard.

D7
----------------
Madbeatzyo111 wrote:

I remember Alland talking about cleaning inside the gap between the touchscreen and the frame and how it fixed an issue with the touchscreen, but I can't seem to find that thread anymore. Here's a similar one with the same idea. Long shot I know...

http://www.korgforums.com/forum/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=40049


Nearest Korg repair shop to me is Singapore.

I still have the sounds. I still have KARMA. And that's why I bought this synth -- for KARMA. The screen still is good except for that important upper right hand menu area. Any recordings I make with it will basically have to be live digital audio now. No multi-tracking. No saving or loading SNGs or PCG's.

I did one factory reset already. I'm thinking of doing another one.

Not being able to copy a combi into the sequencer kills MIDI and multiple-tracking for me. I guess I can learn to sync it to my computer sequencer.

Thanks Madbeatz. I'll check the thread out and try it before doing a factory reset. A reset is a real gamble here. If that doesn't solve the problem, I will not be able to load my non-factory PCG's, which I rely on a lot.

I'll keep y'all posted.
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Asia: Korg M3m, Yamaha MU90R, Yamaha MU100, Kawai K1r (alive), Roland RS50, Axiom 61 & 25.

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gurn
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I took a chance. I knew the risk. I did a factory reset. (Turn on w/control reset, & 1,2 held down).

My worst fears came true. My touch screen doesn't work and I can't load the the sounds I had on-board to begin with.

My M3m is now a door-stop or something I can stack stuff on,
until I can make a trip to Singapore to drop it off.

Good thing I finished my current projects. I won't be using the M3m for a long time now.
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Mike Bunker
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Joined: 12 Feb 2008
Posts: 103
Location: Clearwater, FL USA

PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, I see an MU100 in your footer. I have an MU100R, great synth from Yamaha, and very much like a Roland Sound Canvas. Very expressive rackmount with Yamaha XS extras.
-Mike
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gurn
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 04, 2011 11:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have solved it - for now at least. Here is how I did it.

I have suspected gravity had something to do with my M3m screen problem.
It's only the top-right of the screen that normally gives problems. Lower
parts of the screen function.

(1) Last night, I reset it once again.

(2) Then I turned the M3m upside down and left it on all night.

(3) I woke up six hours later. I turned it over and I did a touch-screen
calibration. For the first time in 24 hours -- it calibrates.

(4) Then I go into the global menu and see if I can load the PCG's. It works.
MIDI page 0 works. Most importantly, the menu at the top-right
of the touch screen works.

(5) So I go into my disk drives and start loading PCG's.
That has always been the problem. Can't do that or save or load SNG's
w/o that top right touch-screen menu.

Voila! They loaded.

My M3m is back in business for now. It's no longer a door-stop.
I don't need to fly to Singapore.

I can't say for certain turning it upside down was a solution.

But next time I have the problem, I'm going to turn it up-side down,
power it on & let it sit for several hours.

YMMV. But it worked for me.

Mike Bunker wrote:
Wow, I see an MU100 in your footer. I have an MU100R, great synth from Yamaha, and very much like a Roland Sound Canvas. Very expressive rackmount with Yamaha XS extras.
-Mike


For years, I was an XG guy. I still am for basic MIDI sequencing.
I love Roland gear. But XG made more sense to me.

KORG was the only brand with KARMA. And KARMA was specifically what I
wanted. I don't regret the switch. But I still love how Roland gear sounds and
operates. I think Rolands are over-priced. But my next synth will be a Fantom
module.

I have owned 3 Korg synths. 2 of them have had touch-screen problems.
But I specifically wanted the M3m & KARMA. I knew exactly what I wanted to
do. This purchase, I didn't even consider any other brands. I wanted an M3m
w/pads & KARMA.

Here's my rig. You can see the MU100 mid-right & directly below it,
the MU90R. I use the MU100 for MIDI playback. I use the MU90R for MIDI
sequencing (not on the M3m). The M3m I control w/a Roland RS50.

My normal piano sound is the MU90R with a touch of an old 8 bit Kawai K1r string pad blended with it. The old K1r is the bottom rack unit you see.


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Asia: Korg M3m, Yamaha MU90R, Yamaha MU100, Kawai K1r (alive), Roland RS50, Axiom 61 & 25.

US: Korg Triton Le, Roland RS9, 2 Kawai K1's (dead).

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Mike Bunker
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gurn,
Turning it upside-down; doesn't that make you think that there is something loose on the back side of the touch screen? If that happened to me I would have taken it apart to look for something obvious.
-Mike
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dumeril7
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Joined: 15 May 2011
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Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Majorly happy that you have at least a temporary fix, Gurn.

Perhaps the combination of heat and being at an angle causes the fluid under the top membrane to flow down, leaving the top part of the screen dry and unresponsive to touch. If that's the case, I would re-arrange my set up so that I could lay the M3M flat instead of angled.

D7
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gurn
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 05, 2011 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mike Bunker wrote:
Gurn,
Turning it upside-down; doesn't that make you think that there is something loose on the back side of the touch screen? If that happened to me I would have taken it apart to look for something obvious.
-Mike


Maybe. I know I opened it to put the 1Gig SSD in it & pre-load all 4 EXB banks. Maybe something got loose?
But I didn't touch anything near the touch screen assembly.

I am in no hurry to open it up again. I just powered it on again. It works like it was new. (knock on wood). And it's love all over again.
This synth sounds so much better than anything I've owned.

dumeril7 wrote:
Majorly happy that you have at least a temporary fix, Gurn.

Perhaps the combination of heat and being at an angle causes the fluid under the top membrane to flow down, leaving the top part of the screen dry and unresponsive to touch. If that's the case, I would re-arrange my set up so that I could lay the M3M flat instead of angled.

D7


I've suspected that all along. I don't know.

I know this. The only time in the last few months it has worked right,
was after I turned it upside down and left it on for six hours.

Pretty strange. But thank God. It would have cost me a fortune to have
this repaired. At least two round trips to Singapore. Hotels. This is a HUGE lucky break for me.

EDIT: I left it on awhile & the top-right touch-screen problem came back while I was typing here.
30-60 minutes, like clockwork. So I turned it upside down again. And it will be on all night again.

BUT...I know now DO NOT do a reset. I can limp along with this only as a
synth - not a sequencer or sampler. I'm not going to run a [reset 1,2] on it
again & risk all the hassle & expense of a repair.

One lesson learned.
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Asia: Korg M3m, Yamaha MU90R, Yamaha MU100, Kawai K1r (alive), Roland RS50, Axiom 61 & 25.

US: Korg Triton Le, Roland RS9, 2 Kawai K1's (dead).

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madbeatzyo111
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 06, 2011 10:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Very nice gurn! I think this validates the model that the conductive gel of the touchscreen interface is flowing with the help of gravity (and also heat probably). I think it might help if you cooled the screen while in use with a fan maybe (or coldpack!). That would help slow down the re-flow.
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gurn
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 07, 2011 3:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

madbeatzyo111 wrote:
Very nice gurn! I think this validates the model that the conductive gel of the touchscreen interface is flowing with the help of gravity (and also heat probably). I think it might help if you cooled the screen while in use with a fan maybe (or coldpack!). That would help slow down the re-flow.


I think you're right. I have put the unit through very heavy use for three days.

I am going to test it for 2 weeks. I hope I've solved the problem.
Unfortunately, I have to change my gear workflow to allow the M3m
to lie flat.

That may be the lesson here.
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Asia: Korg M3m, Yamaha MU90R, Yamaha MU100, Kawai K1r (alive), Roland RS50, Axiom 61 & 25.

US: Korg Triton Le, Roland RS9, 2 Kawai K1's (dead).

Guitars out the wazoo.


Last edited by gurn on Sun Sep 18, 2011 6:35 am; edited 1 time in total
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gurn
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 4:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

FINAL REPORT:

Rigorous testing for eleven days. I was going to report after 14 days.
But the results now are clear after 11.

I hope Korg reads this.

1. IMO, the biggest cause of my touch-screen failures was gravity.

2. A secondary cause was heat.

3. I put the M3m through a very heavy work schedule for the past 11 days.
It has been on at least four hours per day. The weather has been very hot. I
have not ventilated the M3m at all.

At the beginning & end of each session, I would test the upper-right hand
touch screen command. That is the area where failure always occurred.

When the M3m was sitting upright like the photo below, failure was inevitable
after 30-60 minutes of use.



After I laid it flat like this, the failures stopped, even after 4 hours of use.



Twice I left the unit on all night. And the top right menu would still work
in the morning.

The past two days, the weather has been hotter than normal. And I have
experienced two failures. But --- and this is very important --- I was able to
correct them by recalibrating the touch-screen. No re-start was necessary.

When the unit was sitting straight up - I could not do that. The re-calibrate
function would always fail on the upper square of the screen.

I have learned:

The M3m touch-screen is gravity-sensitive. My screen will ALWAYS fail if the
unit is sitting upright. Failure will come within the first hour of use.

My M3m will almost NEVER fail if it is lying flat.

Maybe in a cool location there will be fewer failures. But my experience tells
me the #1 problem here was gravity -- not heat. Why? Because the failures
always started in the top part of the screen.

Korg - I'm very confident about this. The problem may be specific to my unit.
I have not tested other units, obviously. But I don't know why other units
would not have the same problem.

This is a great synth. I love it. And I'm very happy that I have managed this
serious problem. I was very worried about this.

My recommendation to Korg would be to design synths that could be
operated with buttons and knobs - if a touch-screen fails.

Unfortunately, that is impossible with the M3. The upper-right hand part of
the touch-screen cannot be bypassed for a lot of important functions like loading and saving.
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Asia: Korg M3m, Yamaha MU90R, Yamaha MU100, Kawai K1r (alive), Roland RS50, Axiom 61 & 25.

US: Korg Triton Le, Roland RS9, 2 Kawai K1's (dead).

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_joe_
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Joined: 16 Jul 2010
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 12:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

gurn wrote:




Good thing you actually posted photos of your rig.
I think that the M3M was never meant to be used in a vertical position.
Notice that the keybed flip doesn't allow you to raise the Module the same amount as the Radias Rack, people were complaining because they wanted a more vertical position.
Also another detail to think about, is the naming. it's called a "Table Top" and it has back feet so it can lay flat on a table.
I'm sure Korg tested the M3 in the most severe conditions, but forgot (or didn't think someone would use it like that) to test it in an almost 90 degree vertical position.

Just my opinion as an add-on to your rather painful experimentation.

Joe
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McHale
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gravity is not the reason there was a failure. It should work in any angle you place it, even upside down. I suspect there's something a little loose inside. I'd open it and verify every connection - that should resolve your issues.
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Mad Warrior



Joined: 11 Aug 2007
Posts: 25
Location: Saint-Petersburg, Russia

PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2011 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi!
I have the same problem with touchscreen.
Can't use upper right corner. Calibration doesn't help.

My sotry:
I've bought my M3-M used on eBay this spring. I used it not very much. May be about 2-4 hours a week. It was always in near horizontal position. And there were no problems. In August I moved to a new place. I decided to place it in vertical position. Such placement seems very convinient to me. It was quite hot in a room in August (about 30 Celsius degrees). I used M3 much that days, 4-8 hours every day. In a few days I had the same problem as gurn had. Calibration and reset doesn't help. It operated good sometimes for 20-30 minutes after being turned off for a long time.

I've disassembled my M3, checked all conections inside, cleaned the screen. But the problem remained. So I've put it on the shelf until better times (just don't have enough time to mess with it).
Yesterday I've found gurn's post. And I've tried the same thing. I've put it upside down for 2 hours turned on. After that upper right corner became active but only about one time of ten (not very good, but better than it was). I've put M3 upside down and turned on again and used hot hairdryer on screen for about 20-30 seconds. And wow! After that touchscreen works perfect! No problems all evening. (I am using it in horizontal position now)

So I think the gravity and temperature play big role. Probably we shouldn't use M3 in vertical position in hot places or may be not only in hot places. It is a pity for me, because it is so convinient to place it so. =(
Lucky that I'm from Russia. As you know it is very cold here almost all the time. And bears knock at our doors... Wink

I will test it further and will post my observations.

Best regards!
And sorry for my bad english...
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