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aron
Platinum Member
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 1548
Location: Hawaii
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 Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:38 am Post subject: |
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You know what I like about him the most, is his very, very good pitch bend technique. Yes, he's a monster chops player, but his pitch bend technique is very good.
I like the Polysix lead better but man he looks wasted. That cut sounds like Jazz/Fusion. I LOVE IT! 
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Rosen Sound
Approved Merchant
Joined: 06 Jan 2010
Posts: 1056
Location: Los Angeles, California
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:46 am Post subject: |
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Alex you shred bro :O
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aron
Platinum Member
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 1548
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 9:56 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the tip on progsounds. What do you know? He uses a Morley JD-10 (Jerry Donahue) pedal. I got me one.
Ready to go!
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:19 am Post subject: |
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| aron wrote: | | You know what I like about him the most, is his very, very good pitch bend technique. Yes, he's a monster chops player, but his pitch bend technique is very good. |
It's because he mods his DX7 pitch bend to a differential pitch wheel:
http://www.panix.com/~jens/dphi.par |
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aron
Platinum Member
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 1548
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 10:48 am Post subject: |
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I don't recall seeing him use that controller on the DX7ii. Anyway, all that does is add another controller that provides a smoother vibrato if I read that correctly. I think it's only adding an offset voltage to the wiper of the pitch bend wheel.
His pitch bend technique itself is great.
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 12:08 pm Post subject: |
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He's using the pitchbend as usual. The knob above was an experimental force translation device (whatever that means!). I bet he modded every DX7 to have differential pitch wheels. That just aids his otherwise excellent bending technique.  |
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aron
Platinum Member
Joined: 27 Jan 2011
Posts: 1548
Location: Hawaii
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 4:50 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | differential pitch wheels |
What do you mean by this? That schematic showed that he does mod his keyboards (very cool). But all it does is add another controller that adds a variable bias to the pitch wheel. So yes, by moving that piece of metal he gets vibrato. But where is the mention of the differential pitch wheel?
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plisken
Junior Member
Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Jon Lord wrote: | | plisken wrote: |
If it were only that easy! It took me around 6 years to get the lead where you hear at now >.> Funny enough it took Jens himself about 6 years to finish his lead too I think. |
Interesting fact, do you have more info about that? I like the evolution of his sound even if it has been the 'same' for a long time now... I think. I don't listen to stratovarius anymore tbh, I stopped listening after Elements PT2, I'm more into Jens solo work, his lead is amazing on his Fission record. Just a shame that he does not seem to do any solo records anymore. But the lead in all his strato records is more or less the same atleast.
I also like the tone he is using on his polysix here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RcdDK8fl8pM
And btw, that lead demo, is that from the Kronos or is that from your earlier recreation? Did you follow the guide on progsounds when creating the base of the sound or have you 'analyzed' it by yourself? |
Yeah Jens' lead did evolve through out stratovarius. In the studio on Episode and Visions, his first albums he actually uses his polysix for the leads. Also the very first few shows he played with stratovarius he only used his polysix.
Meanwhile he was working on his JV-1080, lead sounds, harpsichord, strings, choir, etc. He did use the JV-1080 in episode but I believe that's when he first got it. Up until around the Destiny album his lead tone live change quite a bit, until he got what he was looking for. By the time they recorded Destiny he finally finished it.
Then it changed a little on Infinite, then a little more on Elements, and now with polaris and elysium its changed once more. All small changes, some changes are as small as tweaking the settings on the Morley.
BUT! my favorite incarnation of his lead I think does not actually come from his work in stratovarius. Its from his leads in Sonata Arctica's Winterheart's Guild album. Here is an example, he plays a lead in the intro of the song then solo in the middle.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=685br8I_SpU&feature=related
The man is a beast 0_0
Also I agree, his solo work is awesome! I really wish he would do some more!
The lead is from my JV-1080 running through the Morley JD-10. I will try and port it to the kronos but I for see some serious problems with getting it even sound close. We will see happens I guess though! Would be awesome if I didnt have to carry all the rack gear for 1 sound! lol.
As for the progsounds guide, thats how I started out. Trying to follow the guide and make. But really it didnt get me anywhere at all =(. You learn the useful stuff about making a distorted lead sound on keyboards and its good for that but Jens' p6emu lead is NOTHING and I really mean almost NOTHING like what that guide says to do.
My first year when I was trying to make his lead, I followed the guide like it was the law, bad choice on my part. Then I decided ok, no one I know of has come up with anything even close to the lead sound with this guide. So I decided to re-verse engineer the lead sound and best as I could. Starting with the facts I knew. JV-1080 and Morley JD-10. And basically created the lead from scratch, trying every possible setting in every possible way. I knew I was going in the right direction because my incarnations of the lead were starting to sound like Jens' early versions of it. At one point I had the exact same lead that aron linked in the first video. So I just kept going from there, tried to learn as much as possible about programming and sound design meanwhile to help me figure it out.
In the end I finally got it. The ONLY thing im trying to figure out is how he got it sound like he did on that Sonata Arctica album.
| robbinhood wrote: | | Alex you shred bro :O |
Thanks man =) the lead changed very slightly since you last heard it, almost not a noticeable difference.
| EvilDragon wrote: | | He's using the pitchbend as usual. The knob above was an experimental force translation device (whatever that means!). I bet he modded every DX7 to have differential pitch wheels. That just aids his otherwise excellent bending technique. |
Actually he only did it on just that one DX7 I believe. He used to use it live a lot but then stopped, lol. Not sure why. But yeah I agree with aron, Jens' really perfected the use of the pitch bend.
Oh also his lead sound it self has a parameter that makes the pitch bend sound awesome too, not only his playing.
Last edited by plisken on Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:01 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| aron wrote: | | Quote: | | differential pitch wheels |
What do you mean by this? That schematic showed that he does mod his keyboards (very cool). But all it does is add another controller that adds a variable bias to the pitch wheel. So yes, by moving that piece of metal he gets vibrato. But where is the mention of the differential pitch wheel? |
No, he doesn't get vibrato by that piece of metal he added, as I figured. It's just the amount of bias that gets added, or something (going from the default flat zone around the center to no flat zone around the center, I guess).
Basically, with differential pitch wheel he's removing the flat zone around the center of the pitch wheel, which makes the vibrato right (and not half rectified as on his first sketch on that page).
BTW I've almost 100% nailed that intro solo from The Cage, and I have a transcription of it for anyone who wants it. It wasn't easy! F.ucking awesome lead playing. Did it on my X5D, no external effects (but then again I didn't aim to get Jens' lead tone, I used my own):
http://www.box.com/shared/u21jla3qdr |
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Jon Lord
Senior Member
Joined: 07 Sep 2007
Posts: 452
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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| EvilDragon wrote: | | aron wrote: | | Quote: | | differential pitch wheels |
What do you mean by this? That schematic showed that he does mod his keyboards (very cool). But all it does is add another controller that adds a variable bias to the pitch wheel. So yes, by moving that piece of metal he gets vibrato. But where is the mention of the differential pitch wheel? |
No, he doesn't get vibrato by that piece of metal he added, as I figured. It's just the amount of bias that gets added, or something (going from the default flat zone around the center to no flat zone around the center, I guess).
Basically, with differential pitch wheel he's removing the flat zone around the center of the pitch wheel, which makes the vibrato right (and not half rectified as on his first sketch on that page).
BTW I've almost 100% nailed that intro solo from The Cage, and I have a transcription of it for anyone who wants it. It wasn't easy! F.ucking awesome lead playing. Did it on my X5D, no external effects (but then again I didn't aim to get Jens' lead tone, I used my own):
http://www.box.com/shared/u21jla3qdr |
Nice playing, that's one tought solo to learn (atleast for me  ), but I would love to have the transcription for future reference for myself. If you could send it to " contact ( at ) korgpatches. com " I would be grateful.
Thats one of my favorite solos of Jens that I actually would love to learn to play, the second of them being the solo from Elements (what a amazing solo)
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EvilDragon
Platinum Member
Joined: 24 Nov 2005
Posts: 1992
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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I'm posting it "live" for everyone to download, so I don't have to bother with PMs I also included the fingering I think works best for this. However, feel free to suit yourself! 
Just listened to the solo from Elements (I never really listened Strato, can't stand Kotipelto's damn squealing), it's bloody awesome! Also sounds a bit easier to play than The Cage. |
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plisken
Junior Member
Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, elements is one of my favorite jens solos too. That guy is awesome 0_0
I couldnt never find any notation for it though so I could learn it. Might have to end up figuring it out by ear >.> |
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mediamike19063
Joined: 23 Oct 2010
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| I hate to bring up an old thread...maybe I'm wrong? I downloaded this file and attempted to upload to the Kronos and got an error message stating "File Unavailable..." any clues? I know I already posted this but I wanted to make sure I referenced the file this time..Thanks all for your help! |
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KeyboardWeirdo
Joined: 23 Feb 2013
Posts: 1
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| Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 1:39 pm Post subject: |
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That leadsound is amazing, maybe closest to the real thing.
I dont own KRONOS but Im wondering if this patch could be translated into polysix emulation on legacy? Would you mind giving the specs of your polysix ex setup? Maybe a picture? |
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plisken
Junior Member
Joined: 25 Jan 2011
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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ah lol its been a while since I have seen this thread, forgot about it. Well last time I posted here I said I might figure out the elements solo by ear.
Fast Forward 2 years
https://soundcloud.com/plisken/solaria-elements-solo-rough
Its a rough take but still!
warning : the mp3 is a little loud. I would mix it better but its been a while since I recorded this and cant find the session file anymore >.> |
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