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pa900 vs pa600+TC Helicon

 
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Jackuar



Joined: 29 Sep 2011
Posts: 21

PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:37 am    Post subject: pa900 vs pa600+TC Helicon Reply with quote

Hi everyone,

I just took a look at the specs of both pa600 and pa900. The obvious upgrade in the 900 is double the PCM memory - 192MB which can hold more user sounds and styles??

If I choose to ignore having more memory as a necessity, can I assume that the PA900=PA600+TC Helicon? To me, it appears similar to the S750/S950 series of Yamaha. In which case I would rather get the 600 and a external vocal harmonizer module for almost the same price of pa900 (Current internet sources claim 1899$). The advantage here is that I can get the keyboard right now and may be the VH later for Christmas.

What are the pros-cons of getting 600+external TCH?
Conversely, what are the upgraded / better features in PA900?

I know the product is just released and no review available. But looking at the technical specs which speaks of terms like compressors, sampling, etc. etc. I'm not able to make up my mind.

I had almost made my mind to go with the PA600 and then now comes the 900. If someone can explain whether the 900 is worth its features and price, I'm willing to wait till Christmas to save some more bucks.
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Saswick
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Joined: 17 Nov 2008
Posts: 140
Location: Lancashire UK

PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:17 pm    Post subject: Pa600 Vs Pa900 Reply with quote

Hi Jackuar

You raise a very interesting point regarding the two keyboards. I currently have the Pa600 and the TC Helicon Voicelive Touch. I was looking forward to the Pa900 and I am quite disappointed with the spec. Having studied the manual I have decided to upgrade my TC Helicon to the new Voicelive Touch 2 and keep the Pa600.

The TC Helicon Harmonizer in the Pa900 appears to be the version from the Pa800/Pa2x not from the Pa3x which is much more comprehensive.

I was hoping for 4 outlets as per Pa800/Pa2x but sadly only 2 as in the Pa600.

I don't need the Sampler, increased memory, aftertouch or 2 mp3 players, an additional assignable knob would have been nice but for recording the additional outlets to separate the vocals and keyboard tracks is more important for my needs.

The MP3 recorder would be handy, but for recording and mixing the separate tracks are more important. I use a Zoom R16 which will record 8 track's simultaneously into wav files then dump them into Cubase for mixing.

I am aware that Korg build their keyboards to suit a wide audience and I have been using Korg equipment for many years but this one is not for me, I will stick with the Pa600, which I feel is fantastic value for money, coupled with the TC helicon Voicelive Touch.

The only way up would be the Pa3x at twice the money and even then the separate Vocal Harmonizer is far far more flexible especially in the studio.

Cash wise it will cost £275.00 to upgrade my Voicelive against £1200.00 to change my keyboard, a no brainer.

Kind Regards

Col
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adimatis
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Joined: 10 Feb 2005
Posts: 276
Location: oradea, romania

PostPosted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why disapointed Col? For the price, it still offers a lot and while not revolutionary, the features included makes a worthwhile investment.

If you already have pa600, not so much, but if the differences from pa500 and pa800 will be kept in the new 600/900 tandem, the build quality, the better keybed, aftertouch, harmonizer, extra sounds and styles, sampler, more options in the OS, etc. then I think this will be a whole different story.

I hear many people bashing it, but me I find it a very attractive option. If price is 1850 euro (what I believe was anounced by Korg dealer in my country) it is good. And personally, I do like the looks of it, even tough many seems to not like it.

Anyway, did you noticed that a huge plusof the sampler is the import of soundfont format... Now, that makes some nice possibilities...
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reinstall
Junior Member


Joined: 30 Nov 2006
Posts: 65

PostPosted: Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I m also confused in pa600 vs pa900.

or buy pa600 with this pa system

Medium PA System/Live Sound Package 4 - 200 400
PERSON VOCAL COMBO = XENYX X1222USB 16-Channel
Mixer with USB, HPS3000 Headphone, EUROLIVE B212D,
XM1800S Ultravoice Dynamic Microphone, XLR to XLR
Microphone cable, Phono / Instrument cable and
Speaker Stand.

http://www.rajmusical.com/200-400-person-vocal-combo.html
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Reidoo



Joined: 16 Oct 2015
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In matter of sound..out of the box will a pa600 sound like a pa900. Will at least sound the same or will it be a noticebale difference in sound quality?
(Both instruments on same PA amp...ofc ourse)
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Dolenjcek
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Joined: 24 Apr 2011
Posts: 58
Location: Slovenia

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You will not notice the difference.

I use PA600 and TC Helicon Voice Live Play (connected via headphone 2 aux).
Pa600 - 999€
TC Helicon - 180€
vs
Pa900 - 1850€



If you want evererything in one box, then 900 is your way.
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Reidoo



Joined: 16 Oct 2015
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 4:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dolenjcek wrote:
You will not notice the difference.

I use PA600 and TC Helicon Voice Live Play (connected via headphone 2 aux).
Pa600 - 999€
TC Helicon - 180€
vs
Pa900 - 1850€



If you want evererything in one box, then 900 is your way.


Thank you for your advice.
I have a Pa3xLe (that is a 76 keys pa900)
I went with this option because i am playing piano solo and acompaning with styles and i joped i could do it all in one keyboard.
Unfortunately, as much as i love it, i am thinking to buy an 88 controller or dp and exhange my pa3xLe for a pa900 or 600, since i won't be needing 76 keys... but i am concerned if i will feel a downgrade in style sound quality if i go for pa600...because i sure don't want that.

Strange how they never let you hear them both in the store for the reason they have only one power adaptor and you must close one to open the other one Smile)
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musiccankill
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Joined: 30 May 2010
Posts: 344
Location: Greece

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

PA600 has 256mb factory waverom
Pa900 has 512mb factory waverom
Pa3xle has 576mb factory waverom..
Given these, pa900 and pa3xle will sound almost the same (the difference must be in the piano samples (64mb bigger) but i am not sure for that).
Pa600 will sound weaker so i don't recommend it as you already know the sound of pa3xle!
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Reidoo



Joined: 16 Oct 2015
Posts: 44

PostPosted: Sun Apr 24, 2016 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

musiccankill wrote:
PA600 has 256mb factory waverom
Pa900 has 512mb factory waverom
Pa3xle has 576mb factory waverom..
Given these, pa900 and pa3xle will sound almost the same (the difference must be in the piano samples (64mb bigger) but i am not sure for that).
Pa600 will sound weaker so i don't recommend it as you already know the sound of pa3xle!


Thank you for a clear and sooo helpfull answer !!!!!!
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Bachus
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Joined: 23 Apr 2006
Posts: 2304

PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

musiccankill wrote:
PA600 has 256mb factory waverom
Pa900 has 512mb factory waverom
Pa3xle has 576mb factory waverom..
Given these, pa900 and pa3xle will sound almost the same (the difference must be in the piano samples (64mb bigger) but i am not sure for that).
Pa600 will sound weaker so i don't recommend it as you already know the sound of pa3xle!


It should not sound weaker, there is the same sound engine and dsp unit inside.. The extra 256 MB is ised for extra sounds, overall these sounds might sound better then the pa600 sounds... But styles and pa600 sounds should sound exactly the same on the pa900...
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Bachus
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2016 7:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What would interest me, most, are there any differences between pa600 and pa900 that are not in the specs?
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alfredokiwi
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Joined: 07 Sep 2011
Posts: 187

PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 5:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Is important to clarify that the TC-Helicon technology is not a separate digital voice processor aka second DSP chip. The Pa600, Pa900 and Pa3xLe use an OMAP processor chip is like an ARM + sound DSP chip found on tablets and cellphones. The chip performs the sampling rec & playback and voice harmonizing processes. To do that an AD converter is required for voice input. The voice digitized PCM stream feeds the sampler DSP chip in real-time for harmonizing because the chip is basically a programmable DSP. The DSP cores are dynamical programmed and enabled depending of the type of DSP processes to run (voice harmonizer. mp3 encoding/decoding. sampling. etc) The Pa3XLe and Pa900 both use a similar Pa600 CPU board and audio + MIDI in/out mainboard this means that adding on the Pa600 the AD converter and changing the firmware it will work maybe in the same way as the Pa900 or Pa3xLe.

The problem using a dynamic programmable DSP is the lack of enough raw processing power to run all the functions. From my point of view the Pa3XLe and Pa900 harmonizer quality is enough for events and venues but not for HQ studio recordings. One problem on Pa3xLe is the lack of a true mic compressor using for that the OMAP DSP chip which is very poor maybe not a true compressor at all due the lack of DSP raw power. The expensive model Pa3x has two DSP chips (the former propietary Korg EDS chip and second Texas Instruments DSP chip) giving more headroom for the run of DSP processes with better harmonies and overall performance. And the new Pa4X don`t convinced me at all watching youtube demo videos, here the synth engine and harmonizer maybe use a single OMAP ARM + DSP chip in the same way as Pa600/900 and Pa3xLe with maybe a little more raw DSP processing power but weaker in quality as the previous Pa3X running two DSP chips (Korg EDS chip and Ti DSP chip).

Another big question that came is the lifetime and overall durability of the CPU board. Because the synths are so cheap in hardware specs like a tablet o cell phone it will not last many years, a sad conclusion about the hardware in use on Pa600/900 Pa3XLe and Pa4x.

I recommend to buy another arranger like the older Pa50 and a separate TC-Helicon or Digitech harmonizer because the front end microphone AD circuitry is better using in this way a dedicate full featured DSP with enough raw processing power for harmonies, voice compression, much better effects etc.
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Last edited by alfredokiwi on Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:45 am; edited 1 time in total
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Eduardo_Arg
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Joined: 29 May 2013
Posts: 204
Location: Argentina

PostPosted: Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jackuar:

I must agree with AlfredoKiwi, in the way that if what you want is a good vocal proccesor, stay with your PA600 and go for a TC_Helicon.- I have Voicelive 2, and it's really superb, and specifically dedicated to that job, vocal proccesor.- You only need to conect your PA600 via midi to TC-VoiceLive, and enjoy.-

Technically i can't tell you about differences in deep between PA600/900/3XLE.- I bought last month a PA3xle, and the most important difference between two other keyboard, are significant for me as a keyboardist: 1) best keybed; 2) more memory for pcm and samples, and different multisamples; 3) better cabinet (alluminium vs plastic) and button keys (plastic vs silicone); 4) Pa3xle is made in italy meanwhile all of others becomes from china.-

About sound engine, all of them share's EDS, the only difference are the extender multisamples on PA900/PA3XLE in comparision to PA600, Pa3XLE shares the same piano multisample from SV1 (quite nice).-

Compare new keyboards or arrangers with nineteen it's unnecesary.- 90's keyboards were made to last years and years.- The were limited in memory, but some ROM sounds are awesome.- I also have a Kronos 2, with excellent pianos, strings, etc., but some sound from my oldest JV 2080 sounds better than Kronos (for example acoustic Pianos and some Strings).-

But technology is what it is.- New keyboards, are simple to use, lightweight, and for those who use sequencer, with powerfull ones like Kronos, this means the solution on one and only keyboard (old days i use Rolanc MC50 mkii to produce midi sequences).-

You must test any keyboard before, and be sure to make the tests with the same amp, otherwise you can't compare it's sounds, and you are noe enable to get a conclusion.-

Hope this helps you on your trip to a new keyboard.-
With regards.
Eduardo
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