Korg Forums

[DannyDep]

Can I remap my TS Ribbon Controller to the Pitch Bend data?

Right now Ribbon is mapped to CC#16 which only allows data from 0 - 127 to be transmitted.
However, the Pitch Bend allows from 0 - 16,383 which obviously allows much more detail.

Is this possible?

[michelkeijzers]

I don't know, but what would be the use? I don't think the accuracy of the ribbon controller is better than 128 different positions; also I doubt someone can really hear the difference of a pitch bend range of 128 steps or 16384.
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Developer of the free PCG file managing application for most Korg workstations: PCG Tools, see https://www.kronoshaven.com/pcgtools/

[DannyDep]

[billbaker]

I don't think you can make the hardware itself have a different level of response if it is built to transmit +/- 127 steps.

You can, however, absolutely assign the ribbon controller to pitch as an AMS control.

What tends to happen at extremely large intervals like two octaves, is a "zippered" as opposed to smooth response, you can hear the jump between stair-stepped values on the wave. You don't hear that in smaller intervals of pitch control (i.e., 1 step) because the distance between steps is relatively so small; approaching smooth.

That's also why filter sweep controls want to be analog rather than digital. That seems to be less of an issue with Kronos, as they've made sure that filters do a smooth, natural sweep rather than stair-stepped values. That is, no doubt, a software thing.

Here's a thought, though; applying the same rule about pitch intervals to filter, you might get a better response by limiting the "interval" of control for whatever parameter you're modulating; 127 steps over a variable of 20 rather than 200 -- 20/127 (.157 per step) is ten times smoother than 200/127 (1.574 per step).

BB
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billbaker

Triton Extreme 88, Triton Classic Pro, Trinity V3 Pro
+E-mu, Alesis, Korg, Kawai, Yamaha, Line-6, TC Elecronics, Behringer, Lexicon...

[DannyDep]

[billbaker]

AMS (alternate modulation source) would be imposed on pitch; pitch parameters are a part of either the main oscillator page or the amp section I think (not sure without my keyboard).

In that section you'll see several options for changing pitch, changing the range/depth of the modulation and which control will be used.

In selecting an AMS you're deciding which control will be used -- it will be ribbon, not pitch that shows in the pull down menu, in this case. You will already be at the parameter(s) for pitch.

The default pitch modulation parameter should be set to JS X, usually with a range of 2 (whole step) -- look for that and you'll be on the right track.

I don't think there's any way to selectively assign (globally) the ribbon to effect pitch in lieu of the default JS pitch-bend. You have to make changes at the program level for that, since that's where they're set up currently.


BB
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billbaker

Triton Extreme 88, Triton Classic Pro, Trinity V3 Pro
+E-mu, Alesis, Korg, Kawai, Yamaha, Line-6, TC Elecronics, Behringer, Lexicon...

[billbaker]

As a follow-up, all of the things on that AMS pull down menu can be used to control other parameters in real time -- none of them do anything by themselves, or if they do they can be used to control more than their usual default.

That is where you'd find and assign obvious physical controls like joystick, pedal, knobs, etc., so as to change select parameters. But some not-so-obvious controls are also included.

Velocity controls volume, yes, but it can also control the cross fade or switch between two layers. That's a velocity cross fade set up in key ranges for each track in a combi. But, as an AMS it can do those things AND also control things like the EQ Wet/Dry balance, so one trick I use for brass voices is to give an EQ boost to the high mid/high EQ as velocity goes up. It gives the brass a more in-your-face (well) brassy sound for stabs (hi vel) while playing more mellow at lower volumes. That would entail going into the IFX, where EQ is set up, and putting an AMS (VEL) on the EQ balance in the lower right.



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billbaker

Triton Extreme 88, Triton Classic Pro, Trinity V3 Pro
+E-mu, Alesis, Korg, Kawai, Yamaha, Line-6, TC Elecronics, Behringer, Lexicon...

[DannyDep]

[billbaker]

I think it's probably a case of changing only one synth (Triton) so that internally the AMS is working. Yay!

You then hook up to a VI and send what, in your mind, should be a pitch bend via ribbon.

However, the ribbon's data doesn't necessarily change externally just because you've made that internal change correctly. A remap or "AMS" assignment, by whatever name the VI uses, needs to be done before it can receive the ribbon data as meaningful. Even received data (which you are seeing) may not hit pitch due to its being mapped to a specific controller (i.e., joystick) already as a convention or industry default.

- - - - - - - -

Think of MIDI as a series of gestures. MIDI is whatever your hand or foot does; notes played or released, pedal stomped, knob twisted. Then take away the synth. The gestures remain -- MIDI is air guitar -- as you move those gestures to another synth will the gestures for a knob twist mean the same thing; is there even a knob on the second synth to twist?

What happens when you send a "Go to bank D, Combi 127" message to a synth with 2 voice banks, no combis, and only 64 voices (DX7) in its architecture? Nothing. Or possibly something completely wrong.

Your issue is, I think that the gesture you've recorded either doesn't mean the same thing or is just twisting a knob that is in the wrong place or nonexistent.

The gesture, pitch bend using a ribbon - regardless of the CC# - has to be meaningful at the receiving end. That's where you need to be checking.


BB
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billbaker

Triton Extreme 88, Triton Classic Pro, Trinity V3 Pro
+E-mu, Alesis, Korg, Kawai, Yamaha, Line-6, TC Elecronics, Behringer, Lexicon...

[DannyDep]

[billbaker]

The crucial post is this one, which I've modified for clarity...


Danny,

Korg Ribbon controller sends MIDI CC#16 [even when I modify it with AMS to pitch bend on the Triton] (but that) automates Pattern On/Off in RealLPC.

TRUE

Please refer to Korg Manual to find out if Korg allows to change it to Pitch Bend control so that it is meaningful to the RealLPC

IT MIGHT BE POSSIBLE, BUT THAT"S NOT YET DONE, AT LEAST EXTERNALLY

--------------------

You can use JS => PB per the industry standard, or change it to Ribbon => PB with AMS, but that's internal to the Triton. The receiving VI sees CC#16 (ribbon) as pattern on/off.

IF you know what CC# RealLPC wants for PB control, then you may be able to set up the Ribbon to send it -- I'd think that would be a global modification if its there at all; mod ribbon to send [selectable] CC#X.

What's not clear is why (or if) RealLPC is not seeing the industry standard PB control (JS) as PB, and why it needs to change in the first place unless you've got a clear and immediate need to use the ribbon controller.

Is JS working with RealLPC as PB? If it aint broke...



BB
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billbaker

Triton Extreme 88, Triton Classic Pro, Trinity V3 Pro
+E-mu, Alesis, Korg, Kawai, Yamaha, Line-6, TC Elecronics, Behringer, Lexicon...

[DannyDep]

If you own Cubase (mine is 7.0.7) here is a solution to the problem.
http://www.steinberg.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=181&t=74755