A new pretender...
Moderators: Sharp, X-Trade, Pepperpotty, karmathanever
Yeah, I heard some similar stories about them, too. From various people and buyers, as well. Whish they'd do that to me - it would be my duty to do some re-educating by introducing them to worldwide PR noise then. Because these days - I'm really pissed at stupid and a$$hole-type people, more then ever before. And I have a perfect company for the picture that does pretty much the same s**t.Sharp wrote:I was personally threatened with legal action if I did not remove certain worlds I had used in a Meta Tags over on YouTube for the search engine. Basically they wanted to control what people saw when they searched for “Neko” for example. They didn’t like the fact that video’s of me playing a Lionstracs keyboard came up in YouTube searches.
I also don’t approve of how they moderated their own forums and removed content to suite their vision of a “Happy Place”. Don’t have an official forum if you don’t want people to have a voice.
Add that to the past history and eventual bankruptcy…. Err…. That’s why I’m not happy to see this new company ran by the same guy who ran Open Labs.
I have quite a few East West packs and I've done quite a lot of recording with them - in my own or friends studios. And their PLAY-based products have so many problems, it's just freakin' amazing. They should've stick to Kontakt sampler, as everything was working fine then. But what pisses me off heavily is their pre-post moderated forum where users' posts don't even get posted even if it's a good-will meets well-reasoned critique. They usually force people to "write emails to customer service" so the public eye doesn't see what's really happening with their software. Which is shite.
This new OL thingy doesn't really impress me all that much. Re-packaging of already re-packaged stuff. We need new and more creative ideas.
Check out http://it-review.net. Reviews and news - hardware, software and musical instruments.
Personally? LPI. RHCE, RHCI, RHCX, RHCVA. MCITP 2008 certification done. MCITP Virtualization Administrator done. MCITP Exchange 2010 done. MCITP MS SQL 2008 done. MCT done. MCSE Server Infrastructure 2012, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSE:Messaging and MCSE: Desktop Infrastructure done. VCP5-DV done. VCI done. MCITP: Sharepoint 2010 Administrator done. VCP5-Cloud done. VCP5-DT done. VCAP5-DCA done. VCP6-DCV done.
Personally? LPI. RHCE, RHCI, RHCX, RHCVA. MCITP 2008 certification done. MCITP Virtualization Administrator done. MCITP Exchange 2010 done. MCITP MS SQL 2008 done. MCT done. MCSE Server Infrastructure 2012, MCSE: Private Cloud, MCSE:Messaging and MCSE: Desktop Infrastructure done. VCP5-DV done. VCI done. MCITP: Sharepoint 2010 Administrator done. VCP5-Cloud done. VCP5-DT done. VCAP5-DCA done. VCP6-DCV done.
Hmm, not really a company anyone would wish to do business with...Sharp wrote: I was personally threatened with legal action if I did not remove certain worlds I had used in a Meta Tags over on YouTube for the search engine. Basically they wanted to control what people saw when they searched for “Neko” for example. They didn’t like the fact that video’s of me playing a Lionstracs keyboard came up in YouTube searches.
I also don’t approve of how they moderated their own forums and removed content to suite their vision of a “Happy Place”. Don’t have an official forum if you don’t want people to have a voice.
But in all fairness I have to say that the OL forum is not the only place where critical content is removed.
Having a Fantom G and visiting the Roland Clan forum regularly I can tell you that at some point posts with criticism about the Fantom G also were moved to an obscure section of the forum which hardly anyone visits, and certain members were banned (unjustly so in my opinion).
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
What really happened
Everyone,
Let me dispel some things that have been floating around the net that is simply not true. To do so, I quote from my past posting:
I gave up the CEO title 5 years ago to concentrate on building the brand and the community around Open Labs. I was in charge of Artist Relations and Marketing. As you can see, Open Labs had a great brand and marketing brought in record number of potential customers.
Once I gave up the CEO title, I had no check writing privileges and did not have any final say in who to pay, who to hire, what projects to green light and how the business operated. Though I was still chairman of the board, and was the “face” of the company, I was told in the last 2 years to “sit in my office and let the new management work”.
The new management consisted of executives from DELL circa 1991 – 2001 and the CEO that replaced me. They were brought in by the investors who eventually foreclosed on the assets of the company after the money was all spent and the executives leaving, which means I did not drive Open Labs into bankruptcy.
In fact, I took pay cut after pay cut to help keep the company alive. In the end Open Labs owed me so much money that they were willing to sign a general release, which then allowed me to form the new company. Therefore, I did not “sell out the company and took the money and ran”.
Here is what really happened:
We had a board meeting on May 26 to determine the future of Open Labs. Three plans were presented and I, as Chairman, along with the board, voted to keep the company operational so that it can be put up for sale, seek additional investments, or wind it’s business down in a proper manner. To accomplish this, we had to cut our budget down to almost nothing. I, along with the bulk of the employees had to be laid off. Hank and several people were kept on to keep the business going. We made the official announcement at a company-wide meeting on Friday, May 28.
However, the debt structure that the company has now created was very large and accruing multiple five figure interest payments each month, which made it an extremely unattractive investment. This was a recent occurrence and started with the investment and the new management that was installed into Open Labs by the investors and CEO.
The foreclosure was not discussed in the board meeting. It was initiated by one of our investor groups/creditor unilaterally after I was laid off and after my resignation as Chairman. I only heard about it second hand. There was nothing I, nor anyone else, could have done about this, once that investment group decided to go down that road. This is now the same group that has proclaimed themselves “the new owners”.
To be honest, I have kept quiet about this because words are cheap. I would rather let my actions speak and to create a company from scratch and produce the products we have in less than 6 months says a lot.
They are not expensive. The 61-key is priced about the same as any 61 key workstation from the “Big Three”. The 88 key is $300 to $500 less, but offer way more in performance and features.
They are also smaller than most of them. The 61 key is only 36” wide, which is 12” shorter than a normal 61 key workstation and is only 4” thick instead of 7”.
They also only weigh about 28lbs, which is 20lbs lighter than other production stations.
A lot of people wanted to see these products happen, and some that didn’t. Nevertheless the products are here and I think they speak for themselves.
So, here are the facts, I have documents to back them up, and I am glad that I am finally at a place where I can set the record straight.
Finally in regards to "legal action" threatened by Open Labs toward the main moderator of this forum, the issue had to do with him using Open Labs trademarks in his tags to increase traffic, which is considered SPAMMING as well as unauthorized use of registered trademarks, which is illegal.
One other example of this policy can be found on eBay, who will not let you post a listing saying: "LionsTracs Mediastation, like Korg OASYS or Triton or M3". The moderate was using the keywords to promote the Mediastation via Open Labs videos on Youtube.com
Open Labs explained this to him and asked nicely, but he threatened to seek revenge using this very site, something Open Labs felt was unwarranted.
In the end, the notice that started all this was mandated by Open Labs management at that time. It was not some personal quest for me, but now it looks like there is an axe to grind, when it could have been resolved amicably.
Either way, this is not meant to insight any hostilities, but it's important that all the facts get out.
Let me dispel some things that have been floating around the net that is simply not true. To do so, I quote from my past posting:
I gave up the CEO title 5 years ago to concentrate on building the brand and the community around Open Labs. I was in charge of Artist Relations and Marketing. As you can see, Open Labs had a great brand and marketing brought in record number of potential customers.
Once I gave up the CEO title, I had no check writing privileges and did not have any final say in who to pay, who to hire, what projects to green light and how the business operated. Though I was still chairman of the board, and was the “face” of the company, I was told in the last 2 years to “sit in my office and let the new management work”.
The new management consisted of executives from DELL circa 1991 – 2001 and the CEO that replaced me. They were brought in by the investors who eventually foreclosed on the assets of the company after the money was all spent and the executives leaving, which means I did not drive Open Labs into bankruptcy.
In fact, I took pay cut after pay cut to help keep the company alive. In the end Open Labs owed me so much money that they were willing to sign a general release, which then allowed me to form the new company. Therefore, I did not “sell out the company and took the money and ran”.
Here is what really happened:
We had a board meeting on May 26 to determine the future of Open Labs. Three plans were presented and I, as Chairman, along with the board, voted to keep the company operational so that it can be put up for sale, seek additional investments, or wind it’s business down in a proper manner. To accomplish this, we had to cut our budget down to almost nothing. I, along with the bulk of the employees had to be laid off. Hank and several people were kept on to keep the business going. We made the official announcement at a company-wide meeting on Friday, May 28.
However, the debt structure that the company has now created was very large and accruing multiple five figure interest payments each month, which made it an extremely unattractive investment. This was a recent occurrence and started with the investment and the new management that was installed into Open Labs by the investors and CEO.
The foreclosure was not discussed in the board meeting. It was initiated by one of our investor groups/creditor unilaterally after I was laid off and after my resignation as Chairman. I only heard about it second hand. There was nothing I, nor anyone else, could have done about this, once that investment group decided to go down that road. This is now the same group that has proclaimed themselves “the new owners”.
To be honest, I have kept quiet about this because words are cheap. I would rather let my actions speak and to create a company from scratch and produce the products we have in less than 6 months says a lot.
They are not expensive. The 61-key is priced about the same as any 61 key workstation from the “Big Three”. The 88 key is $300 to $500 less, but offer way more in performance and features.
They are also smaller than most of them. The 61 key is only 36” wide, which is 12” shorter than a normal 61 key workstation and is only 4” thick instead of 7”.
They also only weigh about 28lbs, which is 20lbs lighter than other production stations.
A lot of people wanted to see these products happen, and some that didn’t. Nevertheless the products are here and I think they speak for themselves.
So, here are the facts, I have documents to back them up, and I am glad that I am finally at a place where I can set the record straight.
Finally in regards to "legal action" threatened by Open Labs toward the main moderator of this forum, the issue had to do with him using Open Labs trademarks in his tags to increase traffic, which is considered SPAMMING as well as unauthorized use of registered trademarks, which is illegal.
One other example of this policy can be found on eBay, who will not let you post a listing saying: "LionsTracs Mediastation, like Korg OASYS or Triton or M3". The moderate was using the keywords to promote the Mediastation via Open Labs videos on Youtube.com
Open Labs explained this to him and asked nicely, but he threatened to seek revenge using this very site, something Open Labs felt was unwarranted.
In the end, the notice that started all this was mandated by Open Labs management at that time. It was not some personal quest for me, but now it looks like there is an axe to grind, when it could have been resolved amicably.
Either way, this is not meant to insight any hostilities, but it's important that all the facts get out.
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MartinHines
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3041
- Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2003 12:56 pm
- Location: Topeka, KS (USA)
Victor,
Thank you for your post.
It is interesting that you claim you were not involved in key operational decisions at OpenLabs during the last few years, whereas some current OpenLabs employees claim you were (e.g. claiming you created/spearheaded the development of the dBeat and the SoundSlate).
Regardless of who was actually in charge, it does appear OpenLabs did run into trouble operationally. If OpenLabs would have been able to service their debt then a foreclosure would never have happened.
I do commend you for your willingness to start a brand-new company, very quickly, in the same market space as OpenLabs.
A couple of suggestions regarding the keyboard products on your new website. I am probably one of your target customer groups (hobbyist who buys new keyboards fairly frequently).
1) More detailed pictures
Given the majority of buyers will not be able to demo the product before purchasing, I would like to see more pictures of each product, allowing the potential customer to see practically every inch of the product.
For an example, I would point out MOTU's product webpages. With a product like the 828mkIII, potential buyers are able to see detailed, scrollable pictures of the front and back. For example, here is the detailed picture of the back. This level of detail allows me to see every control and input/output.
-- http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/ ... fullscreen
The pictures you have on your website are nice, but not detailed enough. I would like to be able to see the same amount of detail as if the keyboard was in front of me, the same detail I would get if I was in a Guitar Center store demoing the product.
As another example, here are pictures of the Yamaha Motif XF. Each version is pictured (XF6, XF7, and XF8) and I can even zoom in to see each control, button, knob, etc.
http://www.yamahasynth.com/library/2d_p ... /motif_xf/
2) pictures of every configuration
I see your Studioblade product comes in 61 and 88 key versions, and one has a choice of two Audio I/O options (2ins/2outs or 10ins/6 outs). However you only have pictures of the 61-key model with one Audio I/O configuration
3) more website information regarding keyboard actions
Most keyboardists would ideally like to be able to demo a keyboard's action before they purchase. Given this is an obstacle to overcome, it woudl be helpful if you provided information about the keyboard actions, going so far as to state who you source them from, and details about their relative quality.
In any case, good luck with your new company. I am always happy to see more and more competition in the keyboard world.
Thank you for your post.
It is interesting that you claim you were not involved in key operational decisions at OpenLabs during the last few years, whereas some current OpenLabs employees claim you were (e.g. claiming you created/spearheaded the development of the dBeat and the SoundSlate).
Regardless of who was actually in charge, it does appear OpenLabs did run into trouble operationally. If OpenLabs would have been able to service their debt then a foreclosure would never have happened.
I do commend you for your willingness to start a brand-new company, very quickly, in the same market space as OpenLabs.
A couple of suggestions regarding the keyboard products on your new website. I am probably one of your target customer groups (hobbyist who buys new keyboards fairly frequently).
1) More detailed pictures
Given the majority of buyers will not be able to demo the product before purchasing, I would like to see more pictures of each product, allowing the potential customer to see practically every inch of the product.
For an example, I would point out MOTU's product webpages. With a product like the 828mkIII, potential buyers are able to see detailed, scrollable pictures of the front and back. For example, here is the detailed picture of the back. This level of detail allows me to see every control and input/output.
-- http://www.motu.com/products/motuaudio/ ... fullscreen
The pictures you have on your website are nice, but not detailed enough. I would like to be able to see the same amount of detail as if the keyboard was in front of me, the same detail I would get if I was in a Guitar Center store demoing the product.
As another example, here are pictures of the Yamaha Motif XF. Each version is pictured (XF6, XF7, and XF8) and I can even zoom in to see each control, button, knob, etc.
http://www.yamahasynth.com/library/2d_p ... /motif_xf/
2) pictures of every configuration
I see your Studioblade product comes in 61 and 88 key versions, and one has a choice of two Audio I/O options (2ins/2outs or 10ins/6 outs). However you only have pictures of the 61-key model with one Audio I/O configuration
3) more website information regarding keyboard actions
Most keyboardists would ideally like to be able to demo a keyboard's action before they purchase. Given this is an obstacle to overcome, it woudl be helpful if you provided information about the keyboard actions, going so far as to state who you source them from, and details about their relative quality.
In any case, good luck with your new company. I am always happy to see more and more competition in the keyboard world.
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
@ Martin
Martin,
Good to hear from you again. As someone who has always been a critic of Open Labs and it's products, I doubt that you fall into our targeted customer group, but nonetheless, I would like to answer some of your questions.
However, other questions that fall into promotion of our products, I will withhold from this venue, because I do not think it's fair or ethical to promote our products on another company's forum.
Having said that, to address the issue of product development, it is true that I was involved in development of DBeat and SoundSlate. I came up with the concept of DBeat, created the product ID, detailed the internal components and handed it over the R&D.
From there it took months and months to develop because they wanted to use laptop parts instead of the desktop parts I designed it with and wanted to do it their way. In the end, R&D spent approximately $1.9M to create DBeat and to move the product lines from Gen4 to Gen5. To my 20 plus years of product development experience, this was a very excessive amount for what was done as DBeat was to have been a transitional product and the initial budget was $50,000.
The final product was back to essentially the same design I gave them in the first place, with desktop parts. To their credit, Intel did change their roadmap for laptop mother boards, but nonetheless, the numbers are the numbers.
Since I did not sign the checks and R&D had it's own building and reported directly to the CEO, I had no idea it cost that much till months after the release. While they would come to me from time to time to ask for my opinion, rarely did they listen fully.
When I realized how much that process cost, I refused to allow R&D to participate in any way in the development of SoundSlate. I even hand built the first prototype by myself in my office. When this happened, I was not a popular guy with R&D and the techs, to whom you are referring to in your posting.
However, in the end, the total cost for the development of SoundSlate was limited to just under $15,000, including 4 prototypes.
Moving forward, as I have said, my actions speak to the fact that we created an entirely new company from the ground up and released distinctly different products, some of which has not ever been offered by any musical instrument company. This goes for both hardware and software.
How can this be if I am the man who these techs you are quoting are saying I am?
So again, here is the other side of the story, with facts and figures to back it up, but the real question here is what do you believe in...words or actions?
Good to hear from you again. As someone who has always been a critic of Open Labs and it's products, I doubt that you fall into our targeted customer group, but nonetheless, I would like to answer some of your questions.
However, other questions that fall into promotion of our products, I will withhold from this venue, because I do not think it's fair or ethical to promote our products on another company's forum.
Having said that, to address the issue of product development, it is true that I was involved in development of DBeat and SoundSlate. I came up with the concept of DBeat, created the product ID, detailed the internal components and handed it over the R&D.
From there it took months and months to develop because they wanted to use laptop parts instead of the desktop parts I designed it with and wanted to do it their way. In the end, R&D spent approximately $1.9M to create DBeat and to move the product lines from Gen4 to Gen5. To my 20 plus years of product development experience, this was a very excessive amount for what was done as DBeat was to have been a transitional product and the initial budget was $50,000.
The final product was back to essentially the same design I gave them in the first place, with desktop parts. To their credit, Intel did change their roadmap for laptop mother boards, but nonetheless, the numbers are the numbers.
Since I did not sign the checks and R&D had it's own building and reported directly to the CEO, I had no idea it cost that much till months after the release. While they would come to me from time to time to ask for my opinion, rarely did they listen fully.
When I realized how much that process cost, I refused to allow R&D to participate in any way in the development of SoundSlate. I even hand built the first prototype by myself in my office. When this happened, I was not a popular guy with R&D and the techs, to whom you are referring to in your posting.
However, in the end, the total cost for the development of SoundSlate was limited to just under $15,000, including 4 prototypes.
Moving forward, as I have said, my actions speak to the fact that we created an entirely new company from the ground up and released distinctly different products, some of which has not ever been offered by any musical instrument company. This goes for both hardware and software.
How can this be if I am the man who these techs you are quoting are saying I am?
So again, here is the other side of the story, with facts and figures to back it up, but the real question here is what do you believe in...words or actions?
Hi Victor.
Lets be totally fair here and honest.
1: I used the words Neko and Open Labs only in meta tags that related to video's I posted of Open Keyboards, and Open Technology. That's what YouTube is for. It's not an advertising platform for you, it's a social networking community for everyone. That being said, Jessica did not even have the power to consider for one single moment what my intentions were and gave no consideration whatsoever to my explanation. Her gold was simply to stop my Video's that related to Open Technology from coming up in search engine results for Open Labs products.
Hence, hiding the Open Labs competition from fellow musicians just using YouTube for what it's for. Being informed and educated.
Ok... Yeah trademake, bla bla bla which brings me to my next point.
2: Open Labs had no problems whatsoever using copyrighted images paid for by KORG and Yamaha on their actual website in the past. This was all done totally without permission to promote your Mimik technology where Open Labs implies you have the ability to clone other keyboards (which is also illegal in Yamaha and KORG's eyes or could be considered as false advertising, but that's another story ). So don't talk to me as if Open Labs is innocent. You guys done far more s**t than little old me using a simple meta tag on YouTube.
Question.... Open Labs current Meta Tag lists a number of trademark names as we speak right now. Did Open Labs seek written permission for all that ?
No, revenge would be to plaster it over the Net and to kick you off this website right now. I'm not like that and I'm not a child. I had only good intentions at heart, but Open Labs were just been greedy and didn't want anything else but their products getting high ranks in a search engine in my opinion because Jessica instantly reported my meta tags to YouTube as a violation ***before even contacting me*** YES... BEFORE... and what was worse is she didn't even have a single ounce of power to even consider my explanation. So I'd hardly call that being asked nicely. That's like sending a robot after me who can only make threats and no conversation.
Also for a guy who was told to sit at his desk powerless for 2 years, you sure as hell seem motivated to support this kind of meta tag censorship, which is what I feel this was.
Simply put, I feel Open Labs did not want me coming up in search engine results. Yet we all know the company freely helped themselves to copyrighted images in the past and other trademarks without permission. Do you deny that ?
So who's in the wrong here? Me or Open Labs.
I'm not trying to start a fight or kick off any sort of argument. Your welcome to voice your opinion here, but I'm just as welcome to voice mine too. There's always two sides to every story and you can say things however you like but ultimately there's no getting away from the flact that Open Labs pissed all over trademarks and copyright law long before I ever used the words Open Labs and Neko in a meta tag over on YouTube. Or are you going to deny the comapny never did anything wrong or used copyriighted iamge ?
Do you not see how petty this all is even ? That's what I've come to expect from Open Labs. I've seen the forums censored and people banned, but I never thought the comapny would go after somthing so petty as a meta tag.
Sharp.
Lets be totally fair here and honest.
I have two issues I'd like to express here on what you just said.Finally in regards to "legal action" threatened by Open Labs toward the main moderator of this forum, the issue had to do with him using Open Labs trademarks in his tags to increase traffic, which is considered SPAMMING as well as unauthorized use of registered trademarks, which is illegal.
1: I used the words Neko and Open Labs only in meta tags that related to video's I posted of Open Keyboards, and Open Technology. That's what YouTube is for. It's not an advertising platform for you, it's a social networking community for everyone. That being said, Jessica did not even have the power to consider for one single moment what my intentions were and gave no consideration whatsoever to my explanation. Her gold was simply to stop my Video's that related to Open Technology from coming up in search engine results for Open Labs products.
Hence, hiding the Open Labs competition from fellow musicians just using YouTube for what it's for. Being informed and educated.
Ok... Yeah trademake, bla bla bla which brings me to my next point.
2: Open Labs had no problems whatsoever using copyrighted images paid for by KORG and Yamaha on their actual website in the past. This was all done totally without permission to promote your Mimik technology where Open Labs implies you have the ability to clone other keyboards (which is also illegal in Yamaha and KORG's eyes or could be considered as false advertising, but that's another story ). So don't talk to me as if Open Labs is innocent. You guys done far more s**t than little old me using a simple meta tag on YouTube.
Question.... Open Labs current Meta Tag lists a number of trademark names as we speak right now. Did Open Labs seek written permission for all that ?
Open Labs explained this to him and asked nicely, but he threatened to seek revenge using this very site, something Open Labs felt was unwarranted.
No, revenge would be to plaster it over the Net and to kick you off this website right now. I'm not like that and I'm not a child. I had only good intentions at heart, but Open Labs were just been greedy and didn't want anything else but their products getting high ranks in a search engine in my opinion because Jessica instantly reported my meta tags to YouTube as a violation ***before even contacting me*** YES... BEFORE... and what was worse is she didn't even have a single ounce of power to even consider my explanation. So I'd hardly call that being asked nicely. That's like sending a robot after me who can only make threats and no conversation.
Trust me on this, I've no axe to grind. It's simply not important to me at all. I can also assure you I've said a million times worst about KORG straight to their faces across a table and on the forums in my 10 years running this website. The difference here is that they listen and don't throw their toys out of the pram.In the end, the notice that started all this was mandated by Open Labs management at that time. It was not some personal quest for me, but now it looks like there is an axe to grind, when it could have been resolved amicably.
Also for a guy who was told to sit at his desk powerless for 2 years, you sure as hell seem motivated to support this kind of meta tag censorship, which is what I feel this was.
Simply put, I feel Open Labs did not want me coming up in search engine results. Yet we all know the company freely helped themselves to copyrighted images in the past and other trademarks without permission. Do you deny that ?
So who's in the wrong here? Me or Open Labs.
I'm not trying to start a fight or kick off any sort of argument. Your welcome to voice your opinion here, but I'm just as welcome to voice mine too. There's always two sides to every story and you can say things however you like but ultimately there's no getting away from the flact that Open Labs pissed all over trademarks and copyright law long before I ever used the words Open Labs and Neko in a meta tag over on YouTube. Or are you going to deny the comapny never did anything wrong or used copyriighted iamge ?
Do you not see how petty this all is even ? That's what I've come to expect from Open Labs. I've seen the forums censored and people banned, but I never thought the comapny would go after somthing so petty as a meta tag.
Sharp.
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MartinHines
- Platinum Member
- Posts: 3041
- Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2003 12:56 pm
- Location: Topeka, KS (USA)
Re: @ Martin
I am probably closer to your targeted group than you think. My criticism of OpenLabs products was always centered around the "value" question; I was never convinced the integrated OpenLabs solution was worth its cost compared to using separate components.victorwong wrote:As someone who has always been a critic of Open Labs and it's products, I doubt that you fall into our targeted customer group...
While I do own traditional keyboard workstations, I also use a PC heaviliy in my own hobbying. My primary DAW is Sonar, and I been using GigaStudio and Kontakt for a long time (along with a lot of other soft synths).
Given the prices for your Music Computing products are significantly lower than the corresponding OpenLabs products, you never know!!!
Just for clarification, this forum is a forum of Korg enthusiasts and is not officially affiliated with Korg.victorwong wrote:However, other questions that fall into promotion of our products, I will withhold from this venue, because I do not think it's fair or ethical to promote our products on another company's forum.
Given another forum member started this topic, it is not inappropriate for you to answer questions about your new products here.
Again, thanks for posting. Us "outsiders" do like talking to people who actually create music products.
Just for the record, this site is owned by me, not KORG. It's also a non-profit site. I do all this from my heart, the same place the video's of the Lionstracs Meidastation came from. This is something Jessica failed to understand and felt I had an alternative motif.I do not think it's fair or ethical to promote our products on another company's forum.
I can't stress how sick that made me feel and it's part of the reason why I've zero respect for the company right now.
Sharp.
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
@ Sharp
Sharp,
Trust me, I have not axe to grind either. However, your posting were simply wrong and I wanted to disclose all the fact, and you were propagating unsubstantiated information that was untrue.
As to your statement of Open Labs using a single image of the OASYS that was the property of KORG in it's website, that was true.
However, the minute we were notified by attorneys representing KORG, we changed the image to one that was not owned by KORG. And yes, we replaced it with another image of an OASYS, but it was legal to use it as news or demonstration as you can only copyright an image if you own it.
Had you have had an Open Labs product in your video to use as a comparison, or even a picture to point out the differences, you could have tagged your meta-tags with Open Labs to your heart's content.
Nevertheless, that entire page was only on our site for a short period of time and was removed and no other images of other company's products that we did not offer never appeared on our site again.
Finally I cannot speak to why the new Open Labs decided to shut down their forums. By the time the investors got done about 2 years ago, I only owned about 8% of the company and with the foreclosure, I own a whole .5%, so it's not like I know anything more than you.
However, I am glad that we are finally able to air this out because how that all ended never really sat right with me. It was just blown way out of proportions. So, sorry for any hard feelings, it certainly was not intended.
Trust me, I have not axe to grind either. However, your posting were simply wrong and I wanted to disclose all the fact, and you were propagating unsubstantiated information that was untrue.
As to your statement of Open Labs using a single image of the OASYS that was the property of KORG in it's website, that was true.
However, the minute we were notified by attorneys representing KORG, we changed the image to one that was not owned by KORG. And yes, we replaced it with another image of an OASYS, but it was legal to use it as news or demonstration as you can only copyright an image if you own it.
Had you have had an Open Labs product in your video to use as a comparison, or even a picture to point out the differences, you could have tagged your meta-tags with Open Labs to your heart's content.
Nevertheless, that entire page was only on our site for a short period of time and was removed and no other images of other company's products that we did not offer never appeared on our site again.
Finally I cannot speak to why the new Open Labs decided to shut down their forums. By the time the investors got done about 2 years ago, I only owned about 8% of the company and with the foreclosure, I own a whole .5%, so it's not like I know anything more than you.
However, I am glad that we are finally able to air this out because how that all ended never really sat right with me. It was just blown way out of proportions. So, sorry for any hard feelings, it certainly was not intended.
Last edited by victorwong on Sun Nov 14, 2010 2:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
More for Sharp
Sharp,
I just saw your other post. I commend you on your passion. This is what also drives me to do what I do. It's people like you who make companies successful and inspire others to create...no matter which company you are championing. So again, hats off to you as I had no idea you were not owned by KORG.
On another note. I actually consider Dominic from Lionstrac a friend. We met at Musikmesse years ago when both our companies were new and have contacted each other from time to time and I've wished him nothing but good fortune in his business. I'm pretty sure he will confirm that if you ask him.
In any case I hope to put this matter behind us and move forward. I hope you feel the same way.
I just saw your other post. I commend you on your passion. This is what also drives me to do what I do. It's people like you who make companies successful and inspire others to create...no matter which company you are championing. So again, hats off to you as I had no idea you were not owned by KORG.
On another note. I actually consider Dominic from Lionstrac a friend. We met at Musikmesse years ago when both our companies were new and have contacted each other from time to time and I've wished him nothing but good fortune in his business. I'm pretty sure he will confirm that if you ask him.
In any case I hope to put this matter behind us and move forward. I hope you feel the same way.
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jazlover
- Platinum Member
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- Location: Tampa, Fla USA
- Contact:
The fact that you help create a new company.. different products ... doesn't really address anything except that you need an income. The charge of bullying with litigation and forum censorship is a charge to your character and your affinity for deception. In your response to Martin, your words and actions are to do (just that) Bully him by discrediting him."Moving forward, as I have said, my actions speak to the fact that we created an entirely new company from the ground up and released distinctly different products, some of which has not ever been offered by any musical instrument company. This goes for both hardware and software.
How can this be if I am the man who these techs you are quoting are saying I am?"
I have known both Sharp and Martin for years and their credibilty is solid with me and you are likely just as you seem."As someone who has always been a critic of Open Labs and it's products"
“I’m into scales right now.”
John Coltrane
John Coltrane
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
@ Martin
Martin,
Thanks for the reply...if I can only get you to use our products, it would totally make my day!
But seriously, even if it's ok to talk here, I'm not going to. That's just not how I work.
Thanks for the reply...if I can only get you to use our products, it would totally make my day!
But seriously, even if it's ok to talk here, I'm not going to. That's just not how I work.
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victorwong
- Posts: 9
- Joined: Sat Nov 13, 2010 10:38 pm
@jazlover
I think you are getting things mixed up here. I'm not censoring or shutting down any forums. Sharp was referring to Open Labs and I haven't been with them for a while now.
And I also commend you on defending your friends, but unless I am totally crazy, I was not bullying anyone and if you see Martin's reply, I don't think he felt he was being bullied either.
And you are right, I am exactly who my actions are and trust me, I could have made a much easier paycheck doing something else instead of investing all this money into a new company during the worse economic times since the great depression, selling luxury items.
But you know what? I do it because it feels my heart with joy to hear music made on instruments that I have invented and to see people create a better life for themselves from it. And yes, I have gone without meals because I didn't have money for food to make my dreams happen.
So there you go, this who I am. It's your choice to think what you will.
And I also commend you on defending your friends, but unless I am totally crazy, I was not bullying anyone and if you see Martin's reply, I don't think he felt he was being bullied either.
And you are right, I am exactly who my actions are and trust me, I could have made a much easier paycheck doing something else instead of investing all this money into a new company during the worse economic times since the great depression, selling luxury items.
But you know what? I do it because it feels my heart with joy to hear music made on instruments that I have invented and to see people create a better life for themselves from it. And yes, I have gone without meals because I didn't have money for food to make my dreams happen.
So there you go, this who I am. It's your choice to think what you will.