Drum Track Feature

Infa Red · Post by **Infa Red** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 12:48 am

Has anyone tested and can verify if there is a limit to how long you can make a "Drum Track" sequence ?

Ideally I am looking to be able to make a sequence do the drums exactly as I want (no loop, ever so changing here and there like a live drummer) for the duration of standard song lengths (say 3-4min), then convert that entire sequence into a "Drum Track" to be triggered with the sound I play for a song.

But if there is a limit to a "Drum Track's" length, then my plan is screwed. lol

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 2:51 am

I think the maximum length of a pattern is 99 measures so that would likely be the absolute maximum length of a drum track. I have not tried this so I don't know if there is a smaller limit when converting to a drum track.

19naia · Post by **19naia** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 3:26 am

When i had the triton extreme, i used the Dr 880 drum machine via a korg D3200.
I got so used to the DR880 drum track composition tools, it made the korg drum track feature seem empty. The big difference is the fill, intro and ending options per each pattern. I dont see any suite of fills,intros and endings in the drum track feature of the kronos. Seems similar to Triton extreme except with the addition of link to KARMA. I will have to see how to make Karma compensate for lack of drum pattern fill, intro and ending patterns.
I usually just linked different patterns to create the change up feel for fills, but there just isnt any combination of patterns with enough of a fill, intro and ending quality to seem more than just basic. The patterns are great and a few do pair up well to compliment as fills and intros, but as i said, its lacking under someone who has a hard time tapping out his own fills on the keys or midi pads, I also dont have much skills in constructing user patterns from scratch in step recording or pattern edit features.
I am going to work more on those skills with the Kronos and i suspect Karma will take me leaps and bounds ipto that goal.
But man, the DR880 was quick and easy patch work of so many decent intros, fills and endings.
I may still end up with a DAW drum machine eventually to help out on the kronos
Thats one direction Korg has to go in future models. The memory is easily there now, so now just a nice set of intros, endings and fills.
Maybe i will be able to find a suite of drum patterns somewhere to load to my empty banks. It may just be that easy after all, if i can find a good suite of fills, intros and endings that compliment whats on board the Kronos initially.
Hmmm.

Infa Red · Post by **Infa Red** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 5:26 am

Bald Eagle wrote:I think the maximum length of a pattern is 99 measures so that would likely be the absolute maximum length of a drum track. I have not tried this so I don't know if there is a smaller limit when converting to a drum track.

Yea, that is what I am curious of, whether or not the "Drum Track" feature has a smaller limit.

That said, I swore on the Triton I made long song sequence over 99 measures before. No way the Kronos has more limitations than the Triton ?

Unless you are separating song and sequence ? In which then my question would be, can I convert a song to drum track ??

19naia wrote:When i had the triton extreme, i used the Dr 880 drum machine via a korg D3200.
I got so used to the DR880 drum track composition tools, it made the korg drum track feature seem empty. The big difference is the fill, intro and ending options per each pattern. I dont see any suite of fills,intros and endings in the drum track feature of the kronos. Seems similar to Triton extreme except with the addition of link to KARMA. I will have to see how to make Karma compensate for lack of drum pattern fill, intro and ending patterns.
I usually just linked different patterns to create the change up feel for fills, but there just isnt any combination of patterns with enough of a fill, intro and ending quality to seem more than just basic. The patterns are great and a few do pair up well to compliment as fills and intros, but as i said, its lacking under someone who has a hard time tapping out his own fills on the keys or midi pads, I also dont have much skills in constructing user patterns from scratch in step recording or pattern edit features.
I am going to work more on those skills with the Kronos and i suspect Karma will take me leaps and bounds ipto that goal.
But man, the DR880 was quick and easy patch work of so many decent intros, fills and endings.
I may still end up with a DAW drum machine eventually to help out on the kronos
Thats one direction Korg has to go in future models. The memory is easily there now, so now just a nice set of intros, endings and fills.
Maybe i will be able to find a suite of drum patterns somewhere to load to my empty banks. It may just be that easy after all, if i can find a good suite of fills, intros and endings that compliment whats on board the Kronos initially.
Hmmm.

Well as I see your points separately and thanks for sharing your experiences with us... but my whole thing is I would make from scratch all my fills, intros and endings. I like it better that way, as thats how I do it. Construct the entire song length of drums from scratch, no pre-made sections. I use samples I create though (with SP12, Native Instruments, Pro Tools, etc..) as some of the drum sounds here and there, and sometimes use stock sounds.

So I am curious how long a drum track can be. I do not see why they would put a limit on it. My issue now, and why I am asking you guys this, is though I know its a feature, and I know things can be done in this Kronos, since it is so new to me still, I can't even figure out how to begin this. LOL So before I start to try to do something I can not end up doing, I though I would ask first before I piss myself off. haha

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:04 am

Drum Track is intended as a simple "jam along" feature. You can still use sequence mode and create songs like you did on Triton. Kronos is not more limited than Triton in this regard.

19naia · Post by **19naia** » Thu Mar 10, 2016 4:10 am

Been studying RPPR for Kronos . I did maybe two RPPR projects on the Triton extreme years ago and that was it. Like i said, i just used the Dr880 for the main stuff and then simple preset drum and patterns that came in Combi
mode in the Triton extreme.

I think i will delve more into RPPR, Karma and loading external fill type pattern midi files. I have to be able to make full song length drum tracks with all the breaks, fills, intros and endings, and many have to be more than just a quick simple flick of change ups here and there through the entire song.

I started as a piano player and then joined bands with live drummers and then finally got the Triton which really took me leaps and bounds but i always had little expereince with drumming other than being able to hold time well in my element of playing keys. Thats why i am looking for the easy way to throw together full song drum tracks like i learned to do with the Dr880.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Thu Mar 10, 2016 8:59 am

I don't understand why you feel you need to use Drum Track for this. For a full song I would personally just sequence the drums from beginning to end.

19naia · Post by **19naia** » Thu Mar 10, 2016 12:18 pm

SanderXpander wrote:I don't understand why you feel you need to use Drum Track for this. For a full song I would personally just sequence the drums from beginning to end.

That sounds right. But in the sequencer it would still be a track/s for drums and patterns and i would still have the same issue of wanting a ready made stash of dedicated advanced fills, breaks, intros and endings.
I will just have to dig around the various options and see what i can make happen. Drum fills arent easy for me to tap out on the keys or pads and im not any better at step sequencing.
Im sure i will practice more at it, but will need other option until i come around in practice.

Infa Red · Post by **Infa Red** » Thu Mar 10, 2016 9:38 pm

SanderXpander wrote:I don't understand why you feel you need to use Drum Track for this. For a full song I would personally just sequence the drums from beginning to end.

You are totally right, and indeed thats what I want to do, but just then assign it to drum track, as I like the fact that I can press that button, and the drums are not triggered until the next key is hit.

Also, I simply do not even see why they would put a limit on it. Or better yet, why is the feature even there as they have it (need to "convert to drum track"), as to me, why could we not set a trigger key, and once that key is pressed it starts a sequence/song that you chose it to start ?

This would be entirely more simply, yet give us more complex configurings. Honestly, lol, I was hoping when I asked this question, someone was going to chime in and tell me we can do that and that I was going about it wrong.

So a request, if Korg is listening.

1 - Why not make the Drum Track feature just simply trigger a sequence or song we have ? The sequence or song can be chosen by us of coarse the same way we choose a "drum track" (converted sequence) now. The difference is, no reason to "convert to drum track", as it simply plays the assigned sequence or song.

Some of you may be asking why. lol I know, and let me explain.

To start a sequence now, I have to press play. If a double handed key/bass/instrument pattern starts on the 1/1/1 at the very beginning, this is impossible to press play and be on time perfectly and get the right sound, etc..

Only option then would be to program blank space in the beginning of the sequence/song, and yes this works. But if you need total silence (no hat count in, etc..) then dealing with a count in, having to look at the screen and time it is a little lame IMO, and also the point of drum track is to make it easier. I love the idea of it starting once I press a key.

So added to that, also, programming blank space before the sequence/song just adds (very little yes I agree) time and work, when Drum track should take that away.

Anyway, just a suggestion, it would be nice.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:49 am

Well clearly you can't simply expand Drum Track to suddenly work with 16 tracks and 16 timbres. That's why sequence mode is there. I do see why you would want to start a key press and I honestly don't know if that's possible in any way. I've used the sequencer maybe twice. But generally speaking it's a lot easier to try and see how you can work with the available tools rather than trying to make the tools do something they weren't intended to.

Infa Red · Post by **Infa Red** » Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:03 am

SanderXpander wrote:Well clearly you can't simply expand Drum Track to suddenly work with 16 tracks and 16 timbres. That's why sequence mode is there. I do see why you would want to start a key press and I honestly don't know if that's possible in any way. I've used the sequencer maybe twice. But generally speaking it's a lot easier to try and see how you can work with the available tools rather than trying to make the tools do something they weren't intended to.

Drum track doesn't need to work with 16 tracks/16 timbres..

Think of it more like, drum track is a on/off light switch assignment that simply ques your sequence/song to play when you hit the next key after engaging it. (all assignable). Its only the sequence/song that has to deal with what you describe, not Drum Track, as it would just be a on/off trigger to the real sequence. (another idea would be to be able to un-assign certain keys to NOT trigger it, this would allow for some playing without triggering too !)

But yes sir, I do agree and I am not waiting for Korg to change this, lol, no as you say I will work with the tools I got. But just giving some suggestions, as the way it is now, the Drum Track idea was cool, just executed not as well as it could have been. They made it complicated and limited. My idea is more simple programing for them plus makes it unlimited and allows users to skip the "convert" step.

jeremykeys · Post by **jeremykeys** » Fri Mar 11, 2016 2:59 am

I'm not sure just what it is that you are trying to do. How long do you need ot to play for? Not bars but minutes? It all depends on how long the song is I would think. Just a thought!