Heart broken Kronos owner: It died today..non operational

danmusician · Post by **danmusician** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 8:37 pm

Might I suggest that perhaps some of us have no business buying a Kronos - YET!

If you need rock solid technology that will not let you down on stage, in rehearsal, or in the studio, then you should probably not be buying cutting edge technology in the first year it's introduced. You should be sticking with what is tried and true.

I'm neither defending or attacking Korg in this. (Nor Roland, Yamaha, Kurzweil, etc.) The fact is, if you want reliable you need to wait and let us bleeding edge folks break it in for you.

As far as the price of a keyboard meaning it should be more reliable, my employer purchased Kurzweil K2500EX back in the day. ($4500) It was in the shop in a few months with broken hammers. Everybody has their problems. The class companies make them right.

I trust Korg.

ScoobyDoo555 · Post by **ScoobyDoo555** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:06 pm

Your sentiment is valid: to a point. Bear in mind most of Kronos' technology is tried/tested now (from OASYS)........
Been around for a while now.

I would also challenge that it's NOT the "worst keyboard ever played" - more so, in some cases, VERY flaky QC and unreliability.......

But different people have different expectations - the issue could be that the expectations are not necessarily in "sync" with the manufacturer.

Chriskk · Post by **Chriskk** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:16 pm

If you need rock solid technology that will not let you down on stage, in rehearsal, or in the studio, then you should probably not be buying cutting edge technology in the first year it's introduced.

The Kronos is not cutting edge technology. It's been around since the development of the OASYS.

The problem stems from Korg's cost cutting measures and poor QC.

jimknopf · Post by **jimknopf** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:33 pm

I can't really follow the view that anyone buying a new keyboard, be it cutting edge, would have to accept taking unusual risks.

Minor problems, yes.
Unusual failures with quick fixes or at least regular and clear status reports, yes.
But a general status of "anything can happen"?
Certainly not!

My concern is not that problems happen. Nobody of us works error free. My concern is, how clear cut and recognizeable a company reacts when more than very few customers can't use their expensive new gear at all (as opposed to: with some minor glitches).

I too trust Korg. But I think they ought to be much more present in the present customer problem zone than they actually are.

danmusician · Post by **danmusician** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:52 pm

jimknopf wrote:I can't really follow the view that anyone buying a new keyboard, be it cutting edge, would have to accept taking unusual risks.

Minor problems, yes.
Unusual failures with quick fixes or at least regular and clear status reports, yes.
But a general status of "anything can happen"?
Certainly not!

My concern is not that problems happen. Nobody of us works error free. My concern is, how clear cut and recognizeable a company reacts when more than very few customers can't use their expensive new gear at all (as opposed to: with some minor glitches).

I too trust Korg. But I think they ought to be much more present in the present customer problem zone than they actually are.

I'm not defending the situation, but the fact is all manufacturers rush products to market before they're ready. It's a fact of life these days. If you can't deal with it, you're better off waiting.

The OP complains about not having the editor. If the editor is important to you, I suggest holding off your purchase until its ready. People complain about having to wait for the editor, but if Korg rushes it out, then they'll complain about bugs. You can't have it both ways.

I've contacted Korg several times with issues that I've had. I have ALWAYS gotten a personal, professional response. They can't be any more present than that. If your having problems, go to the source. Don't expect Korg to come on here and make public comments about issues.

danmusician · Post by **danmusician** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 9:59 pm

Chriskk wrote:
If you need rock solid technology that will not let you down on stage, in rehearsal, or in the studio, then you should probably not be buying cutting edge technology in the first year it's introduced.
The Kronos is not cutting edge technology. It's been around since the development of the OASYS.

The problem stems from Korg's cost cutting measures and poor QC.

If its just an OASYS, than buy an OASYS. The fact is that it is cutting edge because of the way the technologies are combined together. People repeatedly refer to the Kronos as a game changer. So it is cutting edge.

My wife, who is a borderline technophobe, said to me, "Are you sure you want to buy one when it 1st comes out?" She pretends to listen when I talk tech and does her best to keep her eyes from glazing over. Even she knows better than to buy the next new thing when it 1st comes out.

Mercuryyyy · Post by **Mercuryyyy** » Thu Jan 05, 2012 10:09 pm

Am i the only one that thinks "I hope it doesn't fail on me" everytime i start Kronos while it takes a second or two for it to light up? Or even when it is loading up?

Can't we pressure KORG for an response about these failures? Certainly they should respond to this, cause this might not be just a few units, this might be concerning the majority of Kronos units out there or even all of them.

Cause we might think our Kronos is fault-free today but just like the topic poster, we might end up getting a failure not far ahead.

I think we need to get answers to what is causing this failure on what seemingly looks like a flawless Kronos unit.

johnnydr · Post by **johnnydr** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 12:54 am

I for one will not be putting my kronos on stage for a while(until some issues are resolved)

michelkeijzers · Post by **michelkeijzers** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:18 am

johnnydr wrote:I for one will not be putting my kronos on stage for a while(until some issues are resolved)

I really don't have any experience why I not should do this.
During rehearsals I only got one time a problem that the sounds was suddenly gone, however I found out I accidentally moved the VJS, so I disabled it for certain patches where it could affect volume.

After that, never got any problem again, also not at home. I think I have switch on/off the synth for about 100 or more times so I will take it on stage.

jimknopf · Post by **jimknopf** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 1:27 am

Mercuryyyy wrote: ... Can't we pressure KORG for an response about these failures? Certainly they should respond to this, cause this might not be just a few units, this might be concerning the majority of Kronos units out there or even all of them.

Mercuryyyy, it is not my aim to "pressure KORG for a response".
They have built an extremely powerfull and still payable synth (by the way much more than an Oasys from my view, and definitely a game changer), so first of all, they have a big bonus of trust from my side. So I prefer to see them as partners:
- a) I'm readily spending my money for something that good, and try to be constructive in dealing with it
- b) I'm expecting a partrnership relation the other way round as well

Having fixed minor issues (loud fan) readily myself, without asking Korg to solve my problem, or having waited patiently for a data wheel replacement, or defending them in public against a lot of from my view not justified criticism are some examples of partnership from my side.

But while I regard the presence of Dan and Rich as very helpful and I do like their normally non-defensive, open discussion style, I think the actual series of hardware problems is not managed and communicated well by Korg Japan, and then also hard to comment on by Dan and Rich. I don't expect Dan and Rich to have a remedy for that, but I expect Korg Japan to show up in some way, to behave responsible and deliver regular reports and statements on their own and/or the US site.

Trying to reduce all problems to the traditional "each customer has a single problem, we down't acknowledge more widespread concerns" is nothing but bad company politics in our times from my view. Roland acted like this as well, and got a lot of more than well earned critisim, for not having reached any communication level required in internet age and it's open public.

No modern company up to the task will try to silence or individualize problems, which are clearly recognizeable (in internet age) as NOT purely individual problems. Car manufacturers had to learn that, many other companies too, and music gear companies have zero chance to avoid being up to that challenge.

While I have very clear customer expectations at this point, I still regard Korg as partner and am willing to search for friendly solutions instead of putting up pure pressure. Maybe I can't avoid to create some pressure, just by insisting on answers, but that's not my main goal, and essentially I regard Korg as partner and not as any kind of opponent, unless proven wrong.

So I would like to stay open and polite, but I'm not willing to avoid critical questions.

jahrome · Post by **jahrome** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 2:31 am

The title is very accurate representation of my experience with the Kronos. From faulty data wheels that surfaced after a few days of use to my Kronos being completely inoperable. This is terrible. No power surges. No other equipment in my studio is damaged...just this Kronos. Yes, I have the extended warranty. But this is crazy that a $3000 keyboard would be so defective. I will contact Korg first thing tomorrow and return it.

aron · Post by **aron** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 4:16 am

Well we've certainly read through all of your postings from the beginning, so what a bummer for sure.

Hope your next keyboard purchase is a much better experience! Good luck on the next one and hope you get your money back.

jahrome · Post by **jahrome** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:41 am

aron wrote:Well we've certainly read through all of your postings from the beginning, so what a bummer for sure.

Hope your next keyboard purchase is a much better experience! Good luck on the next one and hope you get your money back.

Typically, once you get passed the 45 days of owning a product, you can't return it for a refund. Fix it and sell it at a loss is the only choice.

MRedZac · Post by **MRedZac** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 12:38 pm

jimknopf wrote:
Mercuryyyy wrote: ... Can't we pressure KORG for an response about these failures? Certainly they should respond to this, cause this might not be just a few units, this might be concerning the majority of Kronos units out there or even all of them.
Mercuryyyy, it is not my aim to "pressure KORG for a response".
They have built an extremely powerfull and still payable synth (by the way much more than an Oasys from my view, and definitely a game changer), so first of all, they have a big bonus of trust from my side. So I prefer to see them as partners:
- a) I'm readily spending my money for something that good, and try to be constructive in dealing with it
- b) I'm expecting a partrnership relation the other way round as well

Having fixed minor issues (loud fan) readily myself, without asking Korg to solve my problem, or having waited patiently for a data wheel replacement, or defending them in public against a lot of from my view not justified criticism are some examples of partnership from my side.

But while I regard the presence of Dan and Rich as very helpful and I do like their normally non-defensive, open discussion style, I think the actual series of hardware problems is not managed and communicated well by Korg Japan, and then also hard to comment on by Dan and Rich. I don't expect Dan and Rich to have a remedy for that, but I expect Korg Japan to show up in some way, to behave responsible and deliver regular reports and statements on their own and/or the US site.

Trying to reduce all problems to the traditional "each customer has a single problem, we down't acknowledge more widespread concerns" is nothing but bad company politics in our times from my view. Roland acted like this as well, and got a lot of more than well earned critisim, for not having reached any communication level required in internet age and it's open public.

No modern company up to the task will try to silence or individualize problems, which are clearly recognizeable (in internet age) as NOT purely individual problems. Car manufacturers had to learn that, many other companies too, and music gear companies have zero chance to avoid being up to that challenge.

While I have very clear customer expectations at this point, I still regard Korg as partner and am willing to search for friendly solutions instead of putting up pure pressure. Maybe I can't avoid to create some pressure, just by insisting on answers, but that's not my main goal, and essentially I regard Korg as partner and not as any kind of opponent, unless proven wrong.

So I would like to stay open and polite, but I'm not willing to avoid critical questions.

I suggest visiting the NAMM Show in January or Musikmesse in March and then re-asking all of the open questions, when Korg Distributers are not able to run away and have to answer eye to eye...

KronosSoundDesigns · Post by **KronosSoundDesigns** » Fri Jan 06, 2012 6:06 pm

jahrome,

try to remember if you ever powered it on right after shutting it off, without waitng 10 to 15 seconds. Korg states that you should wait 10 to 15 seconds before turning the unit back on after shutting off.

Just a thought,

These workstations today employ serious CPU's that are all connected to the power supply. Inside the power supply are capacitors that take time to discharge to ground, if you don't have a good properly grounded outlet this time is even longer. Hence, the re-power up before proper discharge can surge the cuicuits inside including the CPU and the SSD. SSD stand for Solid State Drive. It has no moving parts like a regular Hardrive and is based on flash memory technology which is obviously circuitry. Practicing patience with your computers, video game consoles and synth/workstations is key to prolonging their health.