I have 2 kp3's that are currently linked with a midi cable. I've set the midi clock on one to 'internal' and the other to 'external'. I am new to midi so I might be missing something that seems obvious. I am having the following problems:
1) Using the align function on the master kp3 has no effect on the slave kp3.
2) Over time they seem to drift apart in terms of tempo. The loops no longer line up correctly after only perhaps 5 mins.
3) The led underneath the tempo button on one of the kp3's does not match the audio.
Any help is appreciated.
2 Kp3's - tempo syncing problems
Moderators: Sharp, X-Trade, Pepperpotty, karmathanever
You must be new to the KP3's. You can't synchronize them via midi. They aren't midi sequencers and they aren't designed to sync via midi to any external gear.
It's more of a problem with not understanding what they do and how they work. The KP3 can only be synchronized within itself, to keep its own 4 loops in sync with each other, if the loops are all exactly the same length, even multipliers of each other, or resampled to match the length.
When multiple KP3's are hooked together via audio cables, then it's how they are used that keeps the music in sync. This is done by using one KP3 as the master looper that the audience hears for the loops that are running. Any other KP3's are used for controlling the FX of the master (hooked to the output of the master) or used as audio sources that are sampled by the master.
So when you see an artist like Beardyman performing with multiple KP3's and the music is always in sync, it can give you greater appreciation of his skill because he knows how to use them well enough to keep the performance in sync even though the KP3's don't hardsync to each other.
It's more of a problem with not understanding what they do and how they work. The KP3 can only be synchronized within itself, to keep its own 4 loops in sync with each other, if the loops are all exactly the same length, even multipliers of each other, or resampled to match the length.
When multiple KP3's are hooked together via audio cables, then it's how they are used that keeps the music in sync. This is done by using one KP3 as the master looper that the audience hears for the loops that are running. Any other KP3's are used for controlling the FX of the master (hooked to the output of the master) or used as audio sources that are sampled by the master.
So when you see an artist like Beardyman performing with multiple KP3's and the music is always in sync, it can give you greater appreciation of his skill because he knows how to use them well enough to keep the performance in sync even though the KP3's don't hardsync to each other.
Alright, thank you. This does seem (to me) to be a pretty basic midi function that should be included in a product of this price range. Why even have midi in and out if they do not work? In any case, I think I will instead get some of the older Electribes and use them for sound generation, leaving the kp3's for improvised effects.
Midi in/out work on the KP3's just fine as designed for what midi was intended to do on them. You're expecting the KP3s to be able to do something that they can't do. The KP3's aren't sequencers but you're expecting them to work like sequencers. The Electribes are sequencers. It's the same problem as buying an EMX and expecting it to be a sampler. It doesn't do that. It never did that. It was designed a particular way, and it was that way before you bought it. You just had unrealistic and false expectations that you realized were wrong when you finally got around to seeing how the device works in real life. Midi is not only for synchronization, so this is a learning opportunity. On the KP3s, they can be used as external controllers via midi. The KP3 loopers are very good when working with Electribes as the music source. You just don't "get" them yet. They don't need to be able to sync loops to each other in order to keep the music in sync. You apparently don't even know how they actually work. My suggestion is to not buy more equipment until you learn what you've got well enough to be confident that you know what they do. I would recommend buying Maschine2 or Ableton Live with an APC40 before getting any older electribes.
Well, I thank you for the advice but perhaps you should consider being less rude to people who have not been rude to you. It may give you a temporary self esteem boost or mild euphoria but in the long term I suspect it is poor strategy. The greatest artists encourage and support future artists rather than using their knowledge to create a (false) sense of superiority, IMO.
I'm not being rude, and that wasn't my intent. I'm telling you that your expectations were misguided and that you haven't spent enough time learning the KP3's in order to make the conclusions you stated. If you knew how the KP3's worked then you wouldn't have asked the questions you did. It takes time to learn how they work. Telling you that isn't rude when it's (1) true and (2) what you need to know to overcome the problem before you start buying other gear that won't solve that problem. The KP3 is a lot of fun to learn and use. I'm suggesting that you do that. If that's being rude, then I'll continue to be rude by encouraging others to learn their gear before buying more gear that they don't know how to use. There's a reason why someone like Beardyman would use 4 of them, even though they don't sync to each other. I also suggest that you watch all the videos of him that you can find, since you can learn a lot by studying them. I will suggest this for everyone who buys a KP3, as I found it interesting, useful and entertaining to view Beardyman's performances myself. I've probably seen every video posted of him, as well as hours of viewing other interesting KP3 videos. They are inspirational. Watching them is free. All it costs is time and effort, which is something I was gladly willing to pay to learn how to use my KP3 better. I've owned my KP3 for more than 5 years, as I recall. What were you doing 5 years ago? I've spent hundreds of hours learning and using my KP3. How much time have you used yours?
Firstly, I admitted at the very beginning that I was new to midi and the fact I was asking these questions made it clear that I was new to the kp3. I have no problem admitting this as I am proud to be curious enough to ask questions and thus learn new things. I admit right now that I did not fully understand the kp3 when I bought it, however that is no reason to react the way you have.
Secondly, it is pretty weak to just deny your rudeness when it is clear to anyone with a mature perspective.
Thirdly, 5 years ago I was learning harmony, counterpoint, viola, guitar, software, and many other things. There is no shame in being new to this piece of hardware now; I am sure that in the future you will be learning new things that I already know. I would not be a jerk to you for asking questions about such things.
If you simply admit to yourself that you could have been much more polite and constructive (when I did nothing to provoke your ire), I suspect you would grow as a person. Or you can continue to be immature and thus live a very limited mental life with impoverished social relationships. I do not care either way as I am done interacting with you or reading this thread.
In other words, grow the f*ck up.
Secondly, it is pretty weak to just deny your rudeness when it is clear to anyone with a mature perspective.
Thirdly, 5 years ago I was learning harmony, counterpoint, viola, guitar, software, and many other things. There is no shame in being new to this piece of hardware now; I am sure that in the future you will be learning new things that I already know. I would not be a jerk to you for asking questions about such things.
If you simply admit to yourself that you could have been much more polite and constructive (when I did nothing to provoke your ire), I suspect you would grow as a person. Or you can continue to be immature and thus live a very limited mental life with impoverished social relationships. I do not care either way as I am done interacting with you or reading this thread.
In other words, grow the f*ck up.
I was responding to this statement that you made. You were bitching about what should be included in a product of this price, which wouldn't be a problem if you knew how it worked and why it doesn't sync. Then you proceeded to bitch about it having midi ports and claiming (falsely) that they don't work, just because they don't do what you (incorrectly) expected them to do. Then you went off by saying that you'll get some other gear and use the KP3's only for FX, like a spoiled little brat who doesn't get his way. So, that's the context of my reply to you. Now you want to stomp off and take your ball home. Everyone can see how you've acted in your first 4 messages here to see you for who you are. I've been helping people here for years, so I can stand by everything I've posted without concern for your baseless and false assertions. I was correcting your false conclusions, explaining that you needed to learn them better, and pointing you to excellent resources to do that. You took that as rudeness, when it wasn't intended as rudeness, which you also falsely assume that your subjective opinion was a fact, when it wasn't. I don't think it is shameful or rude to point out that the reason why someone misunderstands how their gear works is because they haven't used it enough and need to use it more. I wasn't negative about your original questions or about how much you knew or didn't know. But it does explain why you went off bitching about things you don't understand.nametag wrote:Alright, thank you. This does seem (to me) to be a pretty basic midi function that should be included in a product of this price range. Why even have midi in and out if they do not work? In any case, I think I will instead get some of the older Electribes and use them for sound generation, leaving the kp3's for improvised effects.
No problem. Apology fully accepted. I realize that it's hard to always pickup the writer's intent here. I really didn't intend to be rude. The KP3 is a very interesting and fun device. But it isn't entirely easy to understand without using it for a while. The KP3 take quite a bit of practice with sampling to appreciate how it works. That can be a lot of fun to do the experimenting, but with some frustration when it doesn't exactly work as you might expect. When running into these problems, don't let it stop you and cause you to give up. That's one of the points I was trying to get across, which is to not merely give up and seek additional gear, because the KP3 will make a lot more sense after you work with it for a while. That's also why the Beardyman videos are useful, because it shows what you can do with the KP3's after you master them so well that you can slice, dice, and loop the music in so many ways.
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thehighesttree
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It's hard to fault you for expecting that. Oddly enough, for the uses I have for the KP3 (what you touched on, mainly using it as master FX in a MIDI rig for sampling into transitions, glitching with the looper, and other FX) it never seems to let me down in this regard, so hopefully it'll fill the niche you're looking for with the ER1 (I'm confident it will). Extended samples that need to be synched for long periods don't seem to be its forté apparently, but if you're looking for something that can add some crazy transitions and add "live factor" to your beats then this does the job well.
Oddly enough, I've never run into any MIDI tempo sync problems myself except when I change the tempo on my master clock, which is pretty understandable and can be negated when you get more experience with your rig. Even (re)sampling my entire output doesn't seem to drift like people say even after a few minutes, but it's probably best not to leave it going this long. I will say that you have to have pinpoint accuracy when you hit the sample bank button to record!
Oddly enough, I've never run into any MIDI tempo sync problems myself except when I change the tempo on my master clock, which is pretty understandable and can be negated when you get more experience with your rig. Even (re)sampling my entire output doesn't seem to drift like people say even after a few minutes, but it's probably best not to leave it going this long. I will say that you have to have pinpoint accuracy when you hit the sample bank button to record!