Page 2 of 4
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 8:02 am
by MortenJ
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:06 am
by vinylwizard
agree with others. Monumentally expensive for some samples. I understand that programming takes time but from the people who's just posted here you'd maybe have ten sales at 50$ rather than none at $250..
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 12:40 pm
by Ksynth
I have to agree re prices being very steep for most of us. I'm a lucky one who can easily afford these but won't buy any at those prices. They just seem very high and not a good bargain at those levels.
And once your Kronos is replaced what can you do with those libraries then?
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 4:04 pm
by BasariStudios
Ksynth wrote:And once your Kronos is replaced what can you do with those libraries then?
Nothing, i sold mine and they are gone, once i buy a new one (if i do) then they won't be there...LOL.
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 10:06 pm
by ahutnick
IMHO Karo's Vintage Synth Explorer 1 which was mentioned earlier is an excellent value at $49.00
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:28 pm
by GregC
Ksynth wrote:I have to agree re prices being very steep for most of us. I'm a lucky one who can easily afford these but won't buy any at those prices. They just seem very high and not a good bargain at those levels.
And once your Kronos is replaced what can you do with those libraries then?
it should add some value to your used Kronos when you sell it.
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:52 pm
by Ojustaboo
GregC wrote:Ksynth wrote:I have to agree re prices being very steep for most of us. I'm a lucky one who can easily afford these but won't buy any at those prices. They just seem very high and not a good bargain at those levels.
And once your Kronos is replaced what can you do with those libraries then?
it should add some value to your used Kronos when you sell it.
Trouble is, the person buying might not be interested in the sounds meaning that very likely we would have to sell around the going rate of other Kronos on the second hand market.
If for example I bought eight sound expansions for $250 each, the chances of me finding someone who wants to buy a used Kronos and give me an extra $500 yet alone half the $2000 I would have paid is very very doubtful.
Due to the licensing it ends up with the customer loosing out.
If someone ran into short term financial difficulties and was forced to sell thir Kronos and couldn't buy another one for 6 months, all that money on sound expansions has gone.
If the person buying the Kronos isn't interested in the sound addons, the seller has a choice of not selling or loosing the money spent.
With older instruments we could sell the synth and sell the sound cards separately.
With native instruments, we can sell to someone else and simply get the license transferred to their name.
With the Kronos, we have it tied to one synth so say in 3 years time the synth died and we found a cheap Kronos on eBay, we couldn't even use our sounds on that. We would simply have lost them and have a choice of buy again or go without.
To me, any Kronos expansion that's tied to a particular Kronos, those restrictions make it worth far far less than a competitors product of a similar quality.
I mentioned the price of spectronics symphony of voices, while that's double what the Kronos legendary strings is, at least it's ours for life to use wherever we want, whether to use it on a Kronos, or on a PC etc and in 10 years time we can still use it on our latest synth/sampler.
I might never be able to warrant buying symphony of voices due to the cost, but at least it has fair use.
The Kronos addons being tied to one machine hasn't got fair use.
It was only a month or so ago in this forum where someone wanted to rent a Kronos at a destination miles away (might have had a gig in a different country, can't remember) but as they had spent money on korg sounds they were unable to do so.
It's a classic case of a company using over the top copy protection that ends up inconveniencing and in many cases alienating the customer.
Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 11:58 pm
by GregC
Ojustaboo wrote:GregC wrote:Ksynth wrote:I have to agree re prices being very steep for most of us. I'm a lucky one who can easily afford these but won't buy any at those prices. They just seem very high and not a good bargain at those levels.
And once your Kronos is replaced what can you do with those libraries then?
it should add some value to your used Kronos when you sell it.
Trouble is, the person buying might not be interested in the sounds meaning that very likely we would have to sell around the going rate of other Kronos on the second hand market.
If for example I bought eight sound expansions for $250 each, the chances of me finding someone who wants to buy a used Kronos and give me an extra $500 yet alone half the $2000 I would have paid is very very doubtful.
Due to the licensing it ends up with the customer loosing out.
If someone ran into short term financial difficulties and was forced to sell thir Kronos and couldn't buy another one for 6 months, all that money on sound expansions has gone.
If the person buying the Kronos isn't interested in the sound addons, the seller has a choice of not selling or loosing the money spent.
With older instruments we could sell the synth and sell the sound cards separately.
With native instruments, we can sell to someone else and simply get the license transferred to their name.
With the Kronos, we have it tied to one synth so say in 3 years time the synth died and we found a cheap Kronos on eBay, we couldn't even use our sounds on that. We would simply have lost them and have a choice of buy again or go without.
To me, any Kronos expansion that's tied to a particular Kronos, those restrictions make it worth far far less than a competitors product of a similar quality.
I mentioned the price of spectronics symphony of voices, while that's double what the Kronos legendary strings is, at least it's ours for life to use wherever we want, whether to use it on a Kronos, or on a PC etc and in 10 years time we can still use it on our latest synth/sampler.
I might never be able to warrant buying symphony of voices due to the cost, but at least it has fair use.
The Kronos addons being tied to one machine hasn't got fair use.
It was only a month or so ago in this forum where someone wanted to rent a Kronos at a destination miles away (might have had a gig in a different country, can't remember) but as they had spent money on korg sounds they were unable to do so.
It's a classic case of a company using over the top copy protection that ends up inconveniencing and in many cases alienating the customer.
impossible for a company to be all things to all people.
The used marketplace dictates the value of a keyboard plus options.
I sold my Extreme w/MOSS and the MOSS was a huge selling point. I capitalized by having MOSS installed with a variety of MOSS programs.
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 2:35 am
by mm-pro
I considered a second Kronos, but the fact I would have to pay twice for the libraries made me choose a different solution.
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 3:38 am
by JPWC
"How about a Kronos without all that workstation (Sequencer etc.) and Karma stuff?"
Not to offend, I am just the opposite. First thing I look at is the number of combi's that come in the set. I love playing with Karma. Hope to see Karma 3 integrated into a workstation soon. (not running on some computer, but fully integrated into the keyboard)
I guess it's because I like playing with musicians that are better than me.
enjoy
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 9:51 am
by SanderXpander
Greg, you're kinda making Joe's point for him. A hardware expansion is inherently different from a software expansion, you could take it out and sell it separately, or put it into another Triton. I bet if you wouldn't have gotten a dime more if you had had some of Kid Nepro's sample libraries.
But it's not just about resell value. The base price is just too high to justify. I can only speak for myself of course, and I wish Korg and Karo well. But I am never buying a library at those prices. And I've bought plenty of expansions for other gear. Fifty bucks I could justify, even on a whim on the odd chance I would really like some sounds. 250 gets me a high class soft synth, if we're talking studio work. Or a decent midi controller. Or second hand Maschine, a JX3P with some luck, etc.
Everybody will have their own perspective of course, but in my view it's too expensive for what you get.
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 10:21 am
by jimknopf
SanderXpander wrote:The base price is just too high to justify. I can only speak for myself of course, and I wish Korg and Karo well. But I am never buying a library at those prices. And I've bought plenty of expansions for other gear. Fifty bucks I could justify, even on a whim on the odd chance I would really like some sounds. 250 gets me a high class soft synth, if we're talking studio work. Or a decent midi controller. Or second hand Maschine, a JX3P with some luck, etc.
+1
The problem is, that any of us can get these kinds of sounds (plus some which may be much more to our own liking) by sampling or resampling from a load of available sources. I was interested when I saw all these names of great Korg analog synths for vintage synth explorer II, but frankly, the the sounds produced with them aren't really impressive. Sorry to say it, wishing Karo and Korg all the best, but I doubt that many would spend more than 50$ to be able to use these sounds. They are really nothing special.
It would make MUCH more sense to sell a well working pop/funk/r&b brass library, than to try to sell this kind of stuff at completely unrealistic price points IMHO.
And for Korg it would make much more sense to update some Kronos engines or add one or two, or to implement much better overdrive effects: this could cost us some money and still would be bought, because it would overcome one of the few really weak points of the present Kronos! I would belong to the first buying that stuff. But at the moment I get the impression that Korg doesn't want my money, by improving the Kronos and it's sounds in a more impressive way.
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:22 pm
by GregC
SanderXpander wrote:Greg, you're kinda making Joe's point for him. A hardware expansion is inherently different from a software expansion, you could take it out and sell it separately, or put it into another Triton. I bet if you wouldn't have gotten a dime more if you had had some of Kid Nepro's sample libraries.
But it's not just about resell value. The base price is just too high to justify. I can only speak for myself of course, and I wish Korg and Karo well. But I am never buying a library at those prices. And I've bought plenty of expansions for other gear. Fifty bucks I could justify, even on a whim on the odd chance I would really like some sounds. 250 gets me a high class soft synth, if we're talking studio work. Or a decent midi controller. Or second hand Maschine, a JX3P with some luck, etc.
Everybody will have their own perspective of course, but in my view it's too expensive for what you get.
Could also be that ' we ' are not the target audience for expensive libs.
There are some musicians, studio pros , wealthy hobbyists that generate significant income. For their gigs, to have unique sounds , might make the libs worthwhile
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:42 pm
by GregC
GregC wrote:SanderXpander wrote:Greg, you're kinda making Joe's point for him. A hardware expansion is inherently different from a software expansion, you could take it out and sell it separately, or put it into another Triton. I bet if you wouldn't have gotten a dime more if you had had some of Kid Nepro's sample libraries.
But it's not just about resell value. The base price is just too high to justify. I can only speak for myself of course, and I wish Korg and Karo well. But I am never buying a library at those prices. And I've bought plenty of expansions for other gear. Fifty bucks I could justify, even on a whim on the odd chance I would really like some sounds. 250 gets me a high class soft synth, if we're talking studio work. Or a decent midi controller. Or second hand Maschine, a JX3P with some luck, etc.
Everybody will have their own perspective of course, but in my view it's too expensive for what you get.
Could also be that ' we ' are not the target audience for expensive libs.
There are some musicians, studio pros , wealthy hobbyists that generate significant income. For their gigs, to have unique sounds , might make the libs worthwhile
plus the libs are considered a business expense for tax purposes
Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 1:51 pm
by SanderXpander
I wouldn't call myself rich, but I generate significant income with my music, I can support myself from it. I wouldn't really use sample based sounds from the Kronos in the studio at all. While some of the sounds are quite good, Ivory and Kontakt in my favorite DAW will always beat them for flexibility, sound quality and ease of use.
Again, just talking about my situation and you're right that I may not be part of the target audience. It just seems strange to me. I have and use a large variety of gear, I do a lot of different things within the music industry and I make my money from it. If I'm not the target audience they're either not aiming for pros or just making a bad judgment.