Organ type keys versus semi weighted

[Beemer]

My interest is to buy the 76 key version primarily because I'm used to playing piano.
However after watching numerous You Tube videos of players using the 61 key PS3x I'm curious about the practical difference.

Apart of course from the 15 key difference, are there playing techniques that
can only be done using the 61 key "organ type" un-weighted keyboard?

Ian

[karmathanever]

Apart of course from the 15 key difference, are there playing techniques that
can only be done using the 61 key "organ type" un-weighted keyboard?

Don't think so.

76 is semi-weighted and still not even half the weight of the typical Korg 88 note keybed.
76 has a very nice feel

Pete

[Beemer]

Pete,

So it looks like the 76 will feel much the same as my 88 key Kurzweil K1200.

That's good for me to know because the music shops around me only have the PA3x 61key in stock for me to try.

Ian

[karmathanever]

Don't know anything about 88 key Kurzweil K1200 but if that is fully weighted keys then...
....no!!! You mis-read my post:-

76 is semi-weighted and still not even half the weight of the typical Korg 88 note keybed.

Cheers

[Beemer]

Pete,

No I did not misread your post. My K1200 Professional is an 88 key semi-weighted keybed. The first fully weighted Kurzweil was the PC88 keyboard.

Ian

[Reuben]

I'm fairly certain there is in fact no difference at all between the feel and weight of the 76 key and 61 key versions. I have the 61 key Pa3x and still also have my old 76 key Pa1x and there is no difference at all between the two. Both are semi-weighted and I find its easy to be expressive in my playing (in fact more so then some fully weighted keys I have tried). I have read elsewhere that the keys are the same even though the advertising seems to indicate otherwise. Note that semi-weighted does not mean true piano action. Its still sprung but the keys have weights underneath to offer a little inertial resistance.
Normally I would have gone for the 76 key version but because the store was going out of business I got the 61 at a very substantial discount. I mainly play piano sounds and I must say I have not really noticed the lack of keys simply because of the ease of changing octave if necessary (not during a song , but just with the setup in Songbook). The first STS I will call say "GPiano-8" to remind me of the setting.

[Beemer]

Reuben,

Thanks for your really interesting comment. I'm trying to understand the physical playing differences out of interest only as I will be buying the 76 key regardless.

One reason for me originally asking about 61 key operation is because many 61 key players (especially Eastern players) play in a style that is similar to accordian players. Their rapid right hand fingers and seemingly weightless keys always astound me.

Of course accordian players might never play a fully weighted (upright) piano key so I might never find out if they can perform equally fast passages on the piano. I mentioned "upright" because the "grand" piano action is much faster than upright.

Ian

[Beemer]

Just an afterthought to my above post. Do acoustic accordions have any velocity function in their keys?

Maybe playing with no available velocity (e.g. piano) adjustment is why they are able to play so fast because their brains do not need to listen for audio feedback of sound levels.

Ian

[Dikikeys]

Not only does lightness of the keys have a big impact on how fast the average guy can play (mind you, listen to great classical players, and you can see that full weight keys are no impediment to incredibly fast playing if you have the technique!), but also WHERE on the key's travel the note actually sounds is quite a big factor, too.

Most arrangers' keys don't sound the note until the key hits the bottom of the travel. But Hammond's the note sounds after you have only depressed the key a fraction of the distance (and some harmonics sound before others because it was not simply ONE contact bar). This is one of the factors that go into it being such a delight to play fast on its keyboard.

When you are talking about reed keyboards like accordion and harmonium, the note will start to sound as soon as the pad is lifted off the reed block. So a certain amount of pressure will get to the reed as soon as even the slightest depression of the key happens. But weighed against that is that the reed takes a fraction of a second to start vibrating so it's a bit of swings and roundabouts.

But if you've played an accordion, you know that the travel of the key is a tiny fraction of how far you have to depress a piano or synth key, and the bellows is what determines volume, not force on the key, so yes, that goes a long way to how fast and facile accordion players can play. But also take into consideration that accordion keys are also a lot smaller than piano or synth keys, so the hand doesn't have to move around so much, leading to faster playing...

And don't get me started on button accordions! The layout of the notes on those allows you to do tricks that take herculean technique on a piano keyboard, because the notes are packed in so close!

[Beemer]

Wow! that was a great lesson for me on accordion technology.

thanks,

Ian