Issue with copying programs into combis

Ricky_jcr · Post by **Ricky_jcr** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 10:37 am

Hey guys,

A little help needed here, I've created some really badass programs using mostly 2 oscillators in each program, and I've also added a load of IFX, TFX and MFX to them. There are 3 programs I wish to layer together in COMBI mode, for a synth lead sound.

The thing is, each sound uses different IFX for different contours, if you get my drift. One has hypergain wah and a phaser/flanger, the other just stereo chorus and delay etc. So its really important for me to have these sounds in my combi.

Now I went into combi mode, did the "copy from program", and checked IFX, TFX, MFX. I did this for the first program(routed to timbre 1), and I had no issues.
But when I tried doing the same for the second timbre, the second timbre came out fine, but the IFX,TFX and MFX on timbre 1 vanished leaving a toy-like sound to it.

I tried routing timbre 3, and the same happened, the FX on timbres 1 and 2 vanished.
Am I missing something here?

Best regards,
Ricky

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 11:33 am

You only have one set of FX slots in a combi. All programs in the combi share that set of IFX so when you copy one program in you are overwriting existing IFX.

Ricky_jcr · Post by **Ricky_jcr** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 12:07 pm

Thanks for the prompt reply Eagle!

So thats why my Krome was acting weird. This is definitely something to build on in workstations. Or is it just a drawback on the Krome?

Any info about the Kronos? Does it behave similarly if you do what I did?

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 1:35 pm

It's the same on all Korg workstations, although the Kronos (and Oasys) have 12IFX slots which helps. It may be initially confusing but ultimately it's quite powerful. Quite simply put, the processor can only handle so many FX (5IFX in the case of the Krome). You get all of those available in program mode so you can build complex FX structures. When switching to combi mode and combining multiple FX you still have the same total number, so you will have to consider which ones are the most essential and route the timbres accordingly. A piano with a tube preamp, EQ, piano body and compressor may be left with just the piano body. A Hammond with a rotary and tube preamp will have just the rotary, etc.

The alternative would be to limit you severely in program mode, which is the Yamaha approach; you get only one IFX in a "voice" (program) . And you can STILL only use so many IFX in performance mode (combi mode), I think a maximum of 8 in the latest Motifs (and 4 or 1 before).

Once you get your head around the routing, it's quite powerful!

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 1:40 pm

The Kronos behaves the same but has more FX slots, 12 insert, 2 master and 2 total.

You can use the Copy Insert Effect menu command to copy an IFX from a program into a different free slot and then change the routing. But you will still run out of slots very quickly. Copy in the most important FX first and try remapping other programs to those FX the best you can. Sometimes you will get good results, other times no so good.

roger2600 · Post by **roger2600** » Mon Jun 09, 2014 3:52 pm

you can apply differen t effects to different timbres in Combi mode but you have to do it manually. go to effects routing and assign each timbre to an effect slot [like timbre 1 to effect 1, timbre 2 to effect 3 and timbre 3 to effect 5. Then using the chain, chain 1 to 2 and 3 to 4. That way timbre 1 can use two effects (1 and 2) and timbre 2 can use two effects (3 and 4) and timbre 3 just gets 1 effect (effect 5).] There are many other possible combinations of effects like timbre 1 could go through 1,2,3 and timbre 2 could go through just 2,3 for example. You can most likely get very close the the original three prgs using smart routings/chaining/effect order.

Ricky_jcr · Post by **Ricky_jcr** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 3:21 pm

Thanks for your replies fellas! Great info!

Yes I agree that it won't be a problem with some smart routing and chaining, but that means there is just ONE approach to building a combi on a Korg workstation.
Assign very basic sounds with no FX, and then add I/T/MFX as per required.

In the future, I hope Korg unlocks other ways of building combis by effectively making the processors more powerful (the cost will soar, admittedly). For now, I'll have to make do with what I have.

Or buy a Kronos

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Tue Jun 10, 2014 4:07 pm

Well that's more a problem of philosophy. If you had a processor that could handle 20 IFX you would get a lot of programs with 6, 7 or even 10 FX per program, ultimately leading to the same problem. As I said, Yamaha does it by severely limiting FX power in programs, which I really dislike. Learn to work with it and I don't think you'll miss too much. Don't forget you can also send multiple timbres to the same slot and by choosing your MFX smartly you also free up a lot of space.