Setting Up a Midi Multi

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Fri Dec 05, 2014 10:32 pm

Hi Gang:

Have had the original Kronos since the first month or so of it being released but have hardly used it because I wasn't willing to invest the time into learning the interface. I just have other gear I can simply turn on and get working on. The incentive to use the Korg is the great sounds, but because of my view of the interface (you may adore it), it wasn't worth learning. What I want to do with it should not require such complication. So I might use it for hi-hats once a year. Pity, I know.

What I wanted to do is extremely simple, so very, very simple that old gear like some of the Ensoniq stuff could do this--

Just wanted to touch the first square in the performance mode (or whatever Korg calls it) then select another sound bank, confirm, and then that new sound is set to midi channel one.

Then touch the second block, select another sound, and that one is set to midi channel two.

Etc... maybe set up eight sounds and knock out a track in a couple hours.

When I made this suggestion before, much to my amazement, the consensus here was there was no need for it. So I wonder besides live performance, how is this keyboard being used?

I would have been using it daily but for the interface.

1) Anyway, perhaps someone can explain why this, to me, elementary functionality, can't and apparently after many software revisions, still isn't being implemented?

2) Question: Has there been any advancement in the user's ability to set up a midi multi over the course of the OS updates? Maybe it isn't easy to set up, like the way I described above, but maybe it's fifty fewer button presses? Five? Any improvement?

3) I am open-minded-- Did I overestimate the difficulty level in choosing a sound, setting it to midi channel one, finding another sound, setting it to channel two... it seemed a few years back when I was told the procedure, it required a heck of a lot of button pushing.

Really, no one else would like the ease of setting up a midi multi like I described at the beginning of this note? No one else wants to use the Kronos multitimbrally for sequencing without dealing with the Korg sequencer because one already has a much better sequencer?

Note: This is not an attack on the Kronos or on people who think it is perfect the way it is. If you like it the way it is, I envy you very, very much. Instead, I am simply looking for information. Thank you

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Fri Dec 05, 2014 11:06 pm

I think this is relevant-- it's from Sound on Sound's review, May 2011.

Maybe the Kronos doesn't quite substitute for a dedicated computer-based DAW, but it's sufficient to compose, arrange and produce music to professional standards if you're prepared to work at it. In part, this is because the effects structure in the Kronos has also reverted to that of the OASYS rather than the Triton‑esque system found in the M3. So, in addition to any dedicated effects within the sound generators themselves, the full complement of 12 assignable, routable, stereo, insert effects slots are available, together with dual Master effects and dual Total effects, plus up to 32 track EQs. Likewise, the full complement of 185 effects algorithms is retained, together with the ability to store up to 32 presets per effect module. While not truly multitimbral (which would require independent effects buses for each Program in a Combi or Sequence setup), this is still very powerful.

So apparently there is a clear technical reason why the Kronos can't be simply set up with a midi multi as I suggested-- it is because of the basic structure of how the keyboard assigns effects. The Kronos wasn't created conceptually to be a multi-timbral instrument. And apparently this hasn't or can't be changed in operating system updates because it would require a major overhaul and reconceptualization.

This makes sense to me.

It doesn't make sense to me that a $3,000 digital keyboard in 2011, and now 2014, is not truly multi-timbral-- but it explains why the Kronos can't do what I would like it to do.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Sat Dec 06, 2014 5:56 am

Actually it does exactly what you want to do. If you go to sequence mode this is exactly how the Kronos works, you wouldn't even have to set up the different midi channels. Really the ONLY caveat is that you will have to do some FX management IF you want to keep the FX on the sounds as they are in program mode. And this is really quite easy because Korg provides us with a bunch of copy options. Of course, because any program might use up to the full set of twelve FX, it's possible that with eight tracks you will run out of available FX slots. But you're still free to use any program without FX, or reroute them as you see fit.

psionic311 · Post by **psionic311** » Sat Dec 06, 2014 10:16 am

I'm not at my Kronos right now, but if I recall correctly, here's how to do what you want in 4 button presses:

1) Press the Sequence button (it's above the Disk button)
2) Touch the upper right of the screen (drop down menu)
3) Select Song template
4) From pop up window, choose your song type you want to compose (orchestra, rock, pop, dance, etc)

That will load up a pre-arranged set off musical tracks, each with a different instrument and, I think, each one is on its own MIDI track, just like you requested.

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Sat Dec 06, 2014 3:07 pm

In sequencer mode, even without doing anything, the timbres are already divided over the 16 midi channels.

It's the same for an initialized combi by the way.

In fact both modes work exactly as the OP described. So I guess the issue has to be FX routing. That's kind of a different discussion and yes, you will need a basic understanding of that in order to work with it easily.

BobTheDog · Post by **BobTheDog** » Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:02 pm

I use my kronos in multi mode all the time, seems to work for me and it must be fairly simple as I'm an idiot.

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Sat Dec 06, 2014 11:56 pm

SanderXpander wrote:So I guess the issue has to be FX routing. That's kind of a different discussion and yes, you will need a basic understanding of that in order to work with it easily.

Wouldn't it be nice if one day a combi could just use the FX from each program? I can always dream

SanderXpander · Post by **SanderXpander** » Sun Dec 07, 2014 7:53 am

It's conceptually improbable. Only if Korg limits the amount of FX you can use in a program to 1/16th of what you can use in a combi would it work. I'd rather have all FX power available for single programs too.
Besides, the copy-from-program works really well and if you take ten minutes to understand the FX routing screen it's not all that complicated.

I'm starting to wonder if the OP is genuine.

BobTheDog · Post by **BobTheDog** » Sun Dec 07, 2014 9:25 am

Well as they say "I only use it for hi-hats once a year" you may be right, there are far cheaper alternatives for that workflow.

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Sun Jul 05, 2015 3:46 am

I am real, but unspectacular

Real question about a real issue.

I have a little (very little) time off-- holiday weekend-- Today I upgraded it to 3.02 (or whatever the latest OS is and will look more into the above issues--

Thank you all for your input.

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Sun Jul 05, 2015 3:49 am

BobTheDog wrote:I use my kronos in multi mode all the time, seems to work for me and it must be fairly simple as I'm an idiot.

Do you make your own Combis in order to do this?

Or using the sequencer?

(I am definitely not going to use the sequencer.)

Bald Eagle · Post by **Bald Eagle** » Sun Jul 05, 2015 5:23 am

I find the sequencer very useful. It's certainly not a DAW replacement ... but it has much value.

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Sun Jul 05, 2015 9:34 pm

That's great that the Korg sequencer for some of you guys works really well.

I have an MPC4000 with 2 midi ins and 4 midi outs. That is the central nervous system of my set up, and I use it to the max.

Iguanadon · Post by **Iguanadon** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 4:04 am

I tried making a midi multi (Combi) and got it to work somewhat.

I got four different sounds of my choosing on midi channels 1 through 4.

Triggering the different sounds per channel is no problem.

I have a question--

The effects don't sound the same although I copied the IFX and MFX.

When you copy sounds from programs into your custom made Combi and you want those different sounds playing different parts on different midi channels, what are some tips for copying effects over?

If I can just integrate the Kronos for let's say four sounds on separate midi channels-- that would probably be enough with all the other modules I have running simultaneously.

Would love to put together an application guide for using the Kronos as a multi-timbral module.

Any tips about using the effects to preserve the effects from program when they are transferred over to a Combi?

Any other non-effects pitfalls I should be aware of?

Thanks